ammonium nitrate[as a reformed stamp collecter
i know stampcollecting isnt a hobby]..its a cut throat profession..

that sees everone doing an apprenticeship..bying the worthless common stamps..till they wake up to the search for the rare valuble ones[in hope not by hobby]

but lest we get into hair/splitting..annologies any further
analogy..;corrospondance or simularity
[a comparison between something*..and another[to wit nuthing]

anyhow..woot/quote..""you claim this of your super intelligent magical man..that made everything.""

again for lack of reading actually what is written
you got it wrong..gen 1;god created the heavens;;
[to wit mr half wit]..the unseen..and the earth

not everything
[2/..now the ear-th was formless AND VOID[empty]
darkness[hell]..was over the deep

[as opposed to now
where hell lies under the deep]..
and ..the spirit[of god]..was hovering over the waters

3/'and god said..let there be light'
yo/ye..and somehow..with a loud bang,[presumably]..
'there..was light'

4 god saw..the light was good

anyhow it goes on
and god SAID
and god SAID...etc

try to rstrict comment..to what was ACTUALLY,'said'
and dont take away from the true cause..that only he could create

[recall you can blasheme the...
oh heck why bother..


""Myself, I'll go with the evidence and science of the matter.""

great
lets hear it?

""I think the most interesting,
yet still not claim it as a truth,
is that a quantum foam has always existed.""

foam or form
its as you chose to believe

""Interesting eh?""

yes much like dorkins mud bubble theory
for the first cell...[lol]

""What electrical image of us are you talking about?""
mate..look deeply into your brain[not your mind]
your brain has electrical activity
as does your muscles and heart etc

now think of all them LIVING micro beasts
[trillions within YOUR own body
[think of their 'energy]
aura

your whole body..'works'..
because all this electicity..[energy]

that CANNOT BE DESTROYED..nor created

[living sperm/living egg
*remember?]

""There is no 'image of us',"'

ok present your evidence

""the workings of our brain
are a result of the parts.""

name the 'parts'

""The way you put it, e
verything would have an 'electrical image'""

WEVERY LIVING THING
yes...how does your finger type the word?

""A heaven of amoeba's and bacteria.""
are these the first living things
[that evolved?]
in your opinion?

""a god into the gaps""
no its fossils that got the gaps,,!

""there is no need to have to have the answers immediately""

so why bother evolving beyond the bacteria stage?
toom much life simply takes living for granted

but some spirits chose to evolve spiritually
[and thats why you got your god given spirit inside you right now

YOU CHOSE TO EVOLVE your spirit..!

""You claim to have the answer to life,""
no that is a thing..of spirit
no man is able to be trusted..with the REAL spirit secrets

i just believe that which
to 'me'..best explain
the data..that i have verified

by living here..in this material realm
wih materialists..that together help me
make sense via our various beliefs/life experiences

Ammonite,

There is a deeper problem underpinning this thought that atheism is an ideology. It is a religiously induced emotionally held idea that humans are bad to begin with and therefore if they don’t have a god to control them, they will create gulags and give religious people a hard time in general. It is an irrational fear.

Religions tend to force folk to feel they are unworthy ‘sinners’ and without the ‘grace’ of a god (whatever that is), the heathen, pagan, heretic, apostate and atheist will revert to a savage state where nothing matters except self gratification. That there is a shortage of examples of this doesn’t seem to bother the religious mindset.

These same people live in a country of atheists and don’t see the huge benefits that has brought them. I often ask such religious persons which other country would they rather live in? Still waiting for an answer on that one.

Religion has had thousands of years to perfect a safe society where all are treated equally but we still find that the more religious any community or county is, the more dysfunction exists. Talk about living in false hope.

Australia began dropping religion in the 19th century and in just a 100 years has created an egalitarian-like society no religion has come close to. As religion has declined so have, human rights increased.

The 2012 Global Atheist Convention is a celebration of the ‘reason’ that has helped create this.

David

AJ Phillips,

If I may come to Poirot's defence (quid pro quo), I don't think she's taking that middle road here in favour of religion and the status quo. I agree with Poirot that no system is free of indoctrinisation, and this is precisely my grumble with Ditchkins--their stance isn't critical enough! It's like a flea bomb that gets rid of undesirables but leaves the house in-tact for it's spoiled and fastidious occupants.
The house needs attention! And not just a makeover; it needs asbestos removed, its occupants educated, and some serious downscaling to sustainable and equitable proportions.
I'm delighted at your optimism(?) that <Religious indoctrination is done BECAUSE there is an imaginable alternative> but I don't see that Ditchkins are any more interested in alternatives than the pious are.
What is the atheist's movement's vision for a secular world? This one without the religion! Their like a minor political party that can evade the responsibility of serious policy; they're all ideology; as eclectic as the motley of mystics and religious nutters they want to displace. Which amounts to conservativ.! We all whistle a different tune, that's all, and nothing changes materially.
I don't think anyone who's considering the issues here, on their merits (there aren't many of us), is recommending the safe bet, the status quo.
For the record, as you would know, I'm fundamentally opposed to religious instruction and chaplains in school, and indeed to any inveigling to or corruption of the rule of law or secular government by religious interests. But that's not enough. The State has adapted to other reciprocal and cosy relationships too, and Ditchkins, despite the best of intentions, is one of them.

David of Atheist Foundation of Australia Inc writes

'Religions tend to force folk to feel they are unworthy ‘sinners’ and without the ‘grace’ of a god (whatever that is), the heathen, pagan, heretic, apostate and atheist will revert to a savage state where nothing matters except self gratification'

Exactly. The replacement of Christian values in society with godless values has led to mass increased in divorce, mass increase in pornography, promotion of perverted lifestles, teen suicide, lawless citizens, huge increase in drug usage etc etc.
Without God's grace these things are very evident.

Ammonite & David,

"Atheism has no ideology to control anything."

In its essence, atheism is merely the non-belief in a deity. However, any "movement" that operates under the banner of atheism (or any other "ism") does possess an ideology (or there would be no movement).

woot elaborated earlier in the thread that the AFA believes all government decisions should be based on empirical evidence rather than religious beliefs. I happen to agree with that stance - nevertheless, it "is" an ideology.

Atheism in itself may not be seen as an ideology, but attach it to a movement and it becomes conflated with the aims of that movement - fused to its ideology