Most people haven't heard of this man. But all have been effected by him or his work.

He is the father of public relations and propoganda.

Active in the 1920s and after, Bernays used his Uncle Sigmund Freud's insights into the subconscious to re-shape many aspects of society.
His primary method was to identify 'deep seated felt need' and apply this to changing opinion.

He wrote a book titled "Crystalizing Public Opinion" which was purchased by Joseph Goebbels, who used it to reshape German opinion toward Jews.. ironically Bernays(and Freud) are Jewish.

-"Bacon and Eggs for brekky" employed by the meat industry to help them sell more meat..

//In order to promote sales of bacon, for example, he conducted a survey of physicians and reported their recommendation that people eat hearty breakfasts. He sent the results of the survey to 5,000 physicians, along with publicity touting bacon and eggs as a hearty breakfast.//

-Women Smoking in public. He determined through consultation with Uncle Siggy, that women see a cigarette as a phalic symbol.

//Bernays paid top dollar to get leading NY psychoanalyst A.A. Brill ‘s opinion on the question of what would make women smoke. Brill told him the cigarette was a phallic symbol and represented male sexual power. //

//In the 1920s, working for the American Tobacco Company, he sent a group of young models to march in the New York City parade. He then told the press that a group of women's rights marchers would light "Torches of Freedom". On his signal, the models lit Lucky Strike cigarettes in front of the eager photographers.//

TODAY... I saw an interview on CNN with Rosanne Barr. During the interview *suddenly* a 'viewer question' was offered "Do you think being gay is becoming more normalized?" Barrs.. "Yes.. of course"

Bernays.. is still at work.. being channeled by Rosanne Barr.

Agree or disagree ?

So Bernays is source

Of propaganda techniques,

Not god botherers?

Edward Bernays showed American corporations how they could make people want things they didn't need - systematically linking mass produced goods to their unconscious desires. Bernay's was one of the main architects of the modern techniques of mass consumer persuasion - using every trick in the book (persuading women to smoke by convincing them that cigarettes were a symbol of independence and freedom - "you've come a long way baby"),from celebrity endorsement and outrageous PR to eroticising the motor car, the list goes on. Manipulating people - that's what big business does best. "Greed is Good!" afterall - just ask Wall Street.

Sneaky one Al.

Of course spin, PR and propaganda are present in modern life. They are the tools of marketing, politics and social engineering. The smarter person would assess and process information and make their own choices. Sure we are all victims of marketing even if we hesitate to admit it.

However, you are hinting at social engineering around homosexuality, you are missing your own point about the vast amount of (mainly religious) social conditioning, PR and propaganda that gives rise to bigotry and discrimination. It was once thought the earth was flat and that women were chattels of men. History shows us that as peoples and societies become civilsed, they also become more human, less divisive and slowly more empathetic and inclusive.

The best weapons we humans have against the constant wave of overt and covert 'spin' is our own brains, compassion and empathy for others. That has always been the case.

Could you run that past me again, Boaz?

>>TODAY... I saw an interview on CNN with Rosanne Barr. During the interview *suddenly* a 'viewer question' was offered "Do you think being gay is becoming more normalized?" Barrs.. "Yes.. of course"
Bernays.. is still at work.. being channeled by Rosanne Barr.<<

You must have missed out the part where you connect the work of Bernays with the comedienne, entertainer and showbusiness personality, Roseanne Barr. Or do you just assume that because she too is Jewish, she think in the same way that he did?

Has she actually read Bernays, to your knowledge??

If the link is neither her Jewish ancestry nor her reading habits, then you must assume that Bernays is being channelled involuntarily - his influence reaches people mystically through the airwaves, or by ectoplasmic osmosis, or - maybe - simply by breathing the same air?

In which case there is an easy test: would you have answered that question in the same way?

If not - and don't forget that you fulfil the same requirements as Roseanne Barr, not being Jewish, breathing the same air etc. - then your case is categorically denied. She cannot - as you cannot - be influenced by Bernays.

Here's another thought. Have you read Bernays? If you have, and you would not answer as Ms Barr did, then clearly Bernays is not the influence you suspect him to be.

Of course, if you haven't, and still answer differently to Ms Barr, then not reading Bernays has a similar non-effect.

All of which leads me to ask... what exactly are you insinuating here?

And have you sorted out your Scottish forbears yet?

Bernays source?

Does that come with Glenn Beck's Eggs Benedict Arnold?

Apologies, Boaz - that should of course have been "forebears".

But I just found the source of your interest in fifth-horseman-of-the-apocalypse, Edward Bernays.

And it was, of course, Glenn Beck.

http://mediamatters.org/blog/201101260012

You really should do some independent thinking occasionally, instead of simply parrotting the latest Beck ramblings. It would definitely be good for you.

You might even find it liberating, to work something out for yourself instead of relying upon others for your reasoning.

AGiR tough on you Boazy but thanks.
I have been aware for most of my life this is true but not of this start.
Again thanks FOX a Friend of yours has it down to pat.

Thanks Bugsy, but a

Good lie down after a Beck's

Rant might go better

Pelly.. no I didn't miss the point about Religious PR and mind shaping.. I know it all toooo well.

Pericles, I was a bit obtuse there. I was simply showing from a structured (looks like it to me) example from a current TV station, where the classic "opinion leader" is being used to shape opinion.

The connection is only in the 'structure' not the people.

Lexi...EXcellent summary of the situation.. NOWWWWW it get's interesting, and Bugsy.. this has little to do with Beck (though he does mention Bernays at times) and more to do with my own son getting into Bernays from a PR perspective for his own interests.

O---K.. let's 'get it on' :)

Bernays had shaped the 'perfect consumer' for which Big Capitalist business was very grateful.

Enter Herbert Marcuse and his book "One dimensional man" which protested about that situation. At the same time, the 60s radical left was also protesting this consumerism, and Marcuse became their 'oracle' or prophet.

ENTER THE NATIONAL GUARD. The 60s leftist radicals tried to energise and mobilize mass protest and overthrow the government.. as one person commented "They outgunned us" and the Left began to fall apart in disarray.

Looking for an ALTERNATIVE to mass public protest... they found......?

aah. now that would be telling :) see if you can figure out who it was? (Hint...Sigmund Freud hated him, and Anna Freud disgraced and humiliated him, he was jailed as an insane menace and all his books and papers were burned by court order)

That's rich, Boaz.

>>this has little to do with Beck (though he does mention Bernays at times)<<

As my link pointed out, since the beginning of 2011, Beck has "mentioned" Bernays on his show more than eighty times.

http://mediamatters.org/blog/201101260012

That's over five times per show.

Knowing, as we do, your addiction to, and blind regurgitation of, Beck's pronouncements, it wasn't a difficult conclusion to reach.

But when are you going to clarify your ancestral link to A' Chananaich?

Enquiring minds are agog.

AGIR, you are so transparent in your attempts to push your fundamental Christian, anti-gay agenda.

Pericles has your measure though, and Shintaro picked right up on it.
Great reading guys! Lol :)

Dear dear Pericles :) *MEDIA MATTERS* ? u jest...surely?

George Soros has allocated over a million dollars to MM for the specific purpose of destroying Beck. Yeeaaaaaaahhhhh...they are sooooo objective...right? :)

Ok.. snide sarcasm aside. The source of my interest in Bernays is not from Beck, though from him I did come to know the name. I'll repeat it a-gain.. my SON is the one who has kept on mentioning him with me not know anything about him. When Beck ALSO mentioned him..I though "hmmm..I should look into this* then my boy gave me 2 dvd's which are BBC doco's on the whole issue of "The Century of the self" where Bernays features as the PR man who gave Freud the wide acceptance in the USA. Got it now ? good! If you dills who are picking me like a crusy nose would actually look at those vids (which I linked to on the ETHICS thread.. you would realize this...grrrr

SUS.. I absolutely have an anti 'gay law reform' agenda. I also have a very passionate anti 'gay political/educational' agenda.

But that specific agenda has not much to do with this thread.

I'm seeking to demonstrate that the techniques used by Bernays, are still being used, BUT..and it's a huge but... they have been surplanted by the 'orgone energy' techniques of Freud's arch enemy Wilhelm RIECH.. who was a communist and psychoanalyst who believe 'orgasm'is (yes the sexual type) is the key to 'utopia' on a personal and societal level.

I'm hereby sending your myopic narrow vision OFF line..and hopefully bringing your common sense and objectivity ON line.

Knowing how Bernays techniques work, is to instantly recognize how the Gay lobby, the Socialist Lobby (often combined together) and the GREEN lobby all work.

I seriously doubt you are Glen Beck's dad. That's just made up.

Bugsy, lol!

AGIR...at least you are consistent.

I admire the fact that you stand by your anti-gay stance, even in the face of overwhelming evidence from the bulk of scientists and medical personnel in the world that disagree with the views of seriously strange people like Beck and Bernays.

Dear Al,

You're a bit of a technique man yourself.....and your hero, Beck, is a maestro of "technique"!

I'd heard the name 'Glenn Beck', but had no idea what the man was about, so I looked him up. I still have no idea what he's about!

Is he religious? I'm surmising so as he's a baptised Mormon, yet on the other hand, he once had a problem with drugs and alcohol. In my line of work, I've come across a lot of religious people who once had a substance abuse problem. Sustained substance abuse often seems to invoke a sudden "attachment" to a 2000 year old ghost and they sometimes believe that a dead nun can cause things to happen in the real world. We mark it in their files as "Delusions of a religious nature caused by chemically induced brain trauma."

Could somebody please explain in point form what Glenn Beck stands for?

Dear Aime.. don't worry about Beck for this thread please.. he isn't the focus.. yes..he is a Mormon.. but in all the time I've watched him.. I've found that came out only ONCE..and I wrote a corrective email to him :)

His thing.. is "let's get back to the constitution and founding fathers"

Now..back to THIS thread. Poirot.. I AM arn't I :)

Ok.. we need to forge ahead beyond Bernays.. to explore the forces which arose AGIN him.

1/ Bernays and Freud.. nephew and Uncle, co promoted each other, with Freud feeding Bernays with Psychoanalytic info about people and Bernays both popularizing Freud's books and using the information to create.."The ideal consumer".

They had it wrapped up by the mid 50s.. a done deal. "Conformist, Predictable...consumers"

BUT... along came the 60s....and Freud's arch rival and former student Wilhelm Reich (though already dead) suddenly began to have influence. Radical Pshycho analalysts began the ESELON institute using Reich's techniques.

Remember now

"Freud"= Control the primal forces of the subconscious"
"Reich"= Liberate and unleash them.

The Esalen institute founded by students of Reich began with just a trickle of seminar attendees. Within 7 yrs there were 200 such centres in America.. until it was estimated 80% of the public had attended a sesson.

ESALEN was about 'Liberating the libido and inner self' (Michael Murphy and Robert Price were founders)

First resident 'guru' was
Dr Fritz Perls http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Perls

The footage of Perls interaction shows strong similarities to Demonic Possesion in one attendee.(no details for now)

EST training. "Erhard Seminars Training" Werner Erhard. He taught that once you stip off all historic conditioning.. you arrive at..*nothing* which is meaningless. Then..he said you are 'free' and can rebuild your personhood anew.

EST seminars were copied in the UK by a group called "Exegesis"

CONTINUES below

So...now we have 'deconstructed/reconstructed' human personalities.

PROBLEM This was recognized quickly by Capitalism as a huge danger!

i.e.. All these people are no longer 'ideal (bernaysian) consumers'...they are now UNpredictable!

This means.. manufacturers can no longer make MANY of one thing and sell to a predictable market.

SOLUTION. "Get inside the heads of these new liberated self expressives and find out how they tick...look for patterns"

RESOURCES. SRI international the research group which also did Star Wars work, came up with a questionaire to see if any patterns exist.

YES!....they found them. But those patterns cut across race, class and economics.

ACTION PLAN.. Tailor production for shorter runs of a bigger variety of choices to pander to the new 'self expressive' person who no longer identified with a particular social (or Political) group.

REMEMBER THIS ? "Where do YOU want to go..today?" (Microsoft windows intro)

OUTCOME. The present status quo is where the new 'individual' is completely predictable based on information gathered through focus groups and surveys.

Ever wondered why Bill Clinton's message after the Mid term elections was very 'UNDemocratic' in flavor ? It outraged Democrats and sounded more Republican. Enter Dick Morris :) Look him up. Clinton was pandering to the new 'swinging' voter self actualizer segment.

He new "Staid democrats will vote democrat no matter what"
"Dyed in the wool Republicans will vote GOP no matter what"
But the WIN/LOSE will depend on the independant self actualizers.

AUSTRALIA Does anyone think this history is lost on our own political parties ?

Aime:

Just to answer your question about Glenn Beck. The American political satirist,and TV host (The Daily Show), Jon Stewart, summed things up rather well when he said about Beck:

"He's a guy who says what people who aren't thinking
are thinking."

Poor defence, Boaz.

>>Dear dear Pericles :) *MEDIA MATTERS* ? u jest...surely? George Soros has allocated over a million dollars to MM for the specific purpose of destroying Beck. Yeeaaaaaaahhhhh...they are sooooo objective...right? :)<<

Regardless of who is funding the source, you should be able to recognize facts when you see them. You may be able to make snide comments on the source of the information, but it is significant that you cannot deny that Beck has "mentioned" Bernays on his show more than eighty times already this year.

And please, all this "Beck isn't relevant here" rubbish won't wash. You have made your devotion to Beck's outpourings clear on many occasions, so it is a little disingenuous to now try to blame your son for a sudden interest in Bernays, at exactly the same time that Beck is also on his case.

Do you take us for simpletons?

>>Knowing how Bernays techniques work, is to instantly recognize how the Gay lobby, the Socialist Lobby (often combined together) and the GREEN lobby all work.<<

Also the Liberal Party. Also Coca Cola. And Qantas.

On what basis can you possibly believe that these techniques, in your view, are only employed by the people that you hate?

Your original point - "Bernays.. is still at work.. being channeled by Rosanne Barr" - has already been debunked, due to the non-existence of any link between them. The same can be said for your attempts to link Bernays to your hate-objects the Gay lobby, the Socialist Lobby and the Green lobby.

It is only in your mind, Boaz.

Which clearly is not a great place to be.

Still no news of Fortrose. How can this be?

>>It will begin with a trip to my forebears tomb "Fortrose Cathedral" where you can ponder why it lies in ruins.<<

Surely you weren't... fibbing about your ancestry?

We might be entitled to ask, what else have you been inventing?

Pericles.. surely you can't be serious.

Soros pays Media Matters over a million bucks TO DESTROY/DISCREDIT Glenn Beck.. specifically...

You can forget any shred of credebility they might have but if they reported Beck referred to Bernays that many times.. ummm why would this be a problem ? It might be a fact..but not a problem.

I didn't connect the dots with Bernays very well untill I heard my lad speaking about him indpendantly (and my son doesn't watch Beck) and putting this all together and my boy prompting me "you reallly should see these video's".. I finally did. It almost blew my mind.

Seeing how Bernays was related to Freud and how they helped each other at our expense (The consumer) and changed public opinion about many things.. how Bernays book was used by Goebbels to shape German public opinion about Jews (the 3rd Reich).. How the 4th Reich (Wilhelm Reich) tried to defeat Freud and his daughter.. how Anna Freud destroyed the 4th "Riech" who's teaching comes back in the "Human Potential" Movement...

and you are muttering in your beard about Beck? gimme a break Pericles. I already told you that the Rosanne Barr connection was purely in the 'method' used to influence public opinion... Probably not by Barr but by CNN producers.

I find it fascinating that Reich was a staunch Marxist and he understood life as being 'orgasmic' requiring total sexual freedom.

Marcuse, another socialist.. believed the same.

Reich's orgasmic teaching seems to have unleashed a number of examples of behaviors resembling of demonic posession.. amazing stuff.

Communism... Reich, Orgasmic Sexual..energy... EST...Progressives...Demons... Greens...what a collection

When 8 of the 9 names on Glenn Beck's list of those he considers most dangerous turn out to be Jewish I think he needs to be watched very carefully.

When 400 rabbis deem it fit to sign a letter calling for him to be sanctioned saying in part;

"We share a belief that the Holocaust, of course, can and should be discussed appropriately in the media. But that is not what we have seen at Fox News. It is not appropriate to accuse a 14-year-old Jew hiding with a Christian family in Nazi-occupied Hungary of sending his people to death camps. It is not appropriate to call executives of another news agency "Nazis." And it is not appropriate to make literally hundreds of on-air references to the Holocaust and Nazis when characterizing people with whom you disagree."

I think we need to take notice.

Communism, demons,

Orgasmic energy. You

Can't be serious!

Glenn Beck's in trouble

How can his fans ignore his

Antisemitism?

http://tiny.cc/gpwg1

I certainly am, Boaz.

>>Pericles.. surely you can't be serious.<<

Beck mentioned Bernays eighty times in three weeks for a reason. You raise Bernays - at the same time - on this thread. You say that it is coincidence.

So let's clear up one thing before we go any further. It speaks to your fundamental integrity, and provides perspective to all these observations of yours re: Beck, Bernays, your son etc.

You claim that your forebears lie in a tomb in Fortrose Cathedral.

>>It will begin with a trip to my forebears tomb "Fortrose Cathedral" where you can ponder why it lies in ruins.<<

Is this, or is this not, true?

Dear Pericles.. I will not and need not comment on your 'inquisition'.

Regarding Beck and Bernays... the only thing you need pay attention to is whether he mentioned bernays in a manner which is fitting for a point he was getting across.

His *point* re Bernays is that the masses have been influenced by his use of psychoanalytical techniques to manipulate the masses.

Beck shows exactly what the BBC doco "Century of the self" shows.. that the masses HAVE been manipulated by Bernays methods and Bernays personally.

Beck has mentioned Bernays said "The masses need an elite to guide them"..Bernays daughter says "Or they might vote for the 'wrong' person"

His (Beck's) point of course is that when the masses (you and me) are regarded as "stupid" by an intellectual elite..who then use psychological techniques to toss around like a salad.... we are in trouble.

I have not the slightest problem with Beck pointing this out, and it fits perfectly with the position of the BBC who did the Century of Self doco.

Of course.. the FULL story is only (thus far) found in Century of the Self, where the Star Wars research institute was employed (By capitalist interests) to unravel the new 'Reichian/EST/Self affirming' consumermentality and how this has been effectivly applied to Political Campaigns.

CSTEELE.. your post is unworthy of a response.

Dear Al,

Sorry to inform you, but the masses are easily led. They are docile and gullible. They have always been "tossed around like a salad".
Bernays might have identified the "technique", but the intellectual and hereditary elite have always manipulated the masses - now it is the turn of the meritocracy.
The whole of the Western system is arranged so that the masses dance to the discordant notes of consumerism - however, they are simultaneously captivated by the plethora of entertainments and contraptions on offer. (It keeps them coming back for more)

To quote Oscar Wilde - "It is the problem of slavery, and we try to solve it by amusing the slaves.

Actually, Boaz, I didn't really expect you to.

>>Dear Pericles.. I will not and need not comment on your 'inquisition'.<<

Asking you to elaborate on your claim is hardly an inquisition. Let's face it, if your little tale had been true, you would have been thrilled to have the opportunity to crow about it.

But the reality is that you had two choices.

You could either admit to the teensy little fib about your ancestors occupying a tomb in Fortrose. Doing so would be a form of confession, which would earn you a form of absolution. At least, your own conscience would be clearer.

Or you could continue to ignore the question, and hope that no-one would notice that you fibbed to us.

Sadly, the only alternative you are able to contemplate is denial. Which speaks volumes about your character, and about the sincerity with which you approach discussions.

One of the movies that had a significant character-building impact on me was a short 'B' feature, made in 1960, called "Snowball", directed by Pat Jackson. It details the "snowball effect" of telling lies. You'd do well to check it out.

Dear Poirot.. excellent take on it all.

Please consider this:

An astute politician might use this information to combat that 'herd' effect as follows:

1/ He might be able to convince people that

a) Elections are not won by either Labor or Liberal supporters
(this is because perhaps most of the 'masses' vote along inherited or traditional lines?)

b) The outcome is decided simply by the swinging independant voters.

2/ If they realize this, and it can be demonstrated for them, along with the contemptable attitude Politicians and Social elites hold them in.....

3/ That they are in fact very close to having an effective political voice firstly by realizing this, and secondly by acting on it.

ENTER THE INDEPENDANT.

I can envisage an Independant with a good strong team behind him or her, making use of all the modern means of electronic communication plus a healthy dose of feet on the ground.. community house meetings etc.. shifting the ground from "Traditional/Predictable + swingers"
To 'Traditional/Predictable+ swingers PLUS Newly swinging traditionals.

Now..there's something to chew on :)

You would be quite surprise how many times I've been hinted at to stand :) based on the kind of conversations we have here.. and the subject matter.

PS... I don't plan on standing :)

I had a wonderful spur of the moment convo with a young lad Jack in yr 10 on the bike track. He was virtually 'stunned' by a quick peruse of the 'Darwin/Evolution->Racism' issue. I've seldom seen a young male teenager so eager to "look things up" on the strength of a short chat.

Dear AGIR,

You wrote; "CSTEELE.. your post is unworthy of a response."

Are you going to tell 400 rabbis their letter is unworthy of a response too?

I understand how much you have invested in glorifying Glenn Beck and how hard would be for you to think ill of him. It is evident this reverence has blinded you to the truth of the man.

Mmm, Beck - Anti-christ?

Dear CSTEELE... yes :) because Beck regularly has a RABBI on his show.

'400 rabbi's' is CLASSIC Bernays psychoanalitical technique.

Also....I hold "400 rabbi's" in utter contempt when they try to shut down a voice of freedom and truth.. remember this.. (read it in full please..for your own benefit)

"How Jewish is hollywood" which includes reference to

-Wall street.
-Mainstream media.
-Hollywood.

Written, of course by a proud Jew :)

(you can't make this stuff up)

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-stein19-2008dec19,0,4676183.column

News Corp. President Peter Chernin (Jewish), Paramount Pictures Chairman Brad Grey (Jewish), Walt Disney Co. Chief Executive Robert Iger (Jewish), Sony Pictures Chairman Michael Lynton (surprise, Dutch Jew), Warner Bros. Chairman Barry Meyer (Jewish), CBS Corp. Chief Executive Leslie Moonves (so Jewish his great uncle was the first prime minister of Israel), MGM Chairman Harry Sloan (Jewish) and NBC Universal Chief Executive Jeff Zucker (mega-Jewish).

He mentions that ABE FOXMAN of the ADL saying that mentioning such things could incite ill feeling towards Jews.

THEN..he says:

//I appreciate Foxman's concerns. And maybe my life spent in a New Jersey-New York/Bay Area-L.A. pro-Semitic cocoon has left me naive. But I don't care if Americans think we're running the news media, Hollywood, Wall Street or the government. I just care that we get to keep running them.//

Please note THIS bit...

"That's a very dangerous phrase,(says Foxman) 'Jews control Hollywood.' What is true is that there are a lot of Jews in Hollywood," he said. Instead of "control," Foxman would prefer people say that many executives in the industry "happen to be Jewish," as in "all eight major film studios are run by men who happen to be Jewish."

Stein was simply showing the ludicrous nature of Foxman's approach.

Foxman was triumphally saying "Only 22% of americans now believe Jews control Hollywood" etc. Stein corrected that misinformation.

Dear CSTEELE.. I am quite objective about Beck.

When he started on his 'Mormon' history of Hebrew writing in the Smithsonian..I immediately wrote to correct him :) I know the difference between truth and falsehood.... because I never NEVER take Becks word alone. I do actually invessssstigate things myself....independantly. Do you ?

The value of a program like Beck's is this

a) He has a TEAM of researchers.
b) He tells the stories "in their own words" (you can argue with hearsay but not THEYsay)
c) He provides sources.

"CENTURY OF THE SELF" in various parts on Google vids or youtube.(NOT done by FOX, but by the good old left wing BBC)

Study Freud/Reich and their daughters war.

EST movement (Werner Erhard)
ESALEN INSTITUTE. (Reichian psychology)

"HISTORY OF POLITICAL CORRECTNESS" same.

Follow this little juicy one

AL GORE shareholdings.. companies he controls.. how they are linked... how they benefit from 'Green' anything.

MAURICE STRONG..

a) Promoter of Eath summit Rio.. and Copenhagen

b) Director of the CHICAGO CLIMATE EXCHANGE! (carbon trading)

Old son..if you cannot see what's going on ... I feel for ya :)

2+2 still equals 4 in 'my' world.

Al is "objective"

Because he "invessssstigates"

That's hilarious

Just one more word on "Fortrose-gate", Boaz.

>>Dear Pericles.. I will not and need not comment on your 'inquisition'.<<

Did you or did you not start a thread recently on the topic of Ethics?

It is hardly surprising, then, that your credibility here is so low.

Shintaro :) not bad.. but please... look at the facts.

Dear Pericles.. you are a master of devising wild fantasies in your own mind and then.. satisfied you are absolutely right.. projecting those fantasies on others with a superior attitude. And you speak to me of ethics ?

HOMEWORK... All should be able to comment intelligently on the impact of the theories of Wilhelm Reich on the nature of American (and Australian) politic strategies.

For this, you will need a working knowledge of

a) Bernays construction of the 'Ideal Consumer'
b) 60s leftist rebellion against Bernays 'consumer' model
c) The embracing of Reich's ideas at the same time.
d) The impact of the Eselon institute and EST training.
e) The reaction of Capitalists/Manufacturers to c an d.

Having reached that working knowledge, the participant will then be in a position to unpack why Labor policies don't seem quite 'labor' to staunch traditional laborites and Liberal policies don't seem quite 'liberal' to staunch traditional liberals.
It will also explain why the Greens seem to give the 2 fingered salute to just about everyone... but they do know who they are aiming at...

Which fantasy is that, Boaz?

>>Dear Pericles.. you are a master of devising wild fantasies in your own mind and then.. satisfied you are absolutely right.. projecting those fantasies on others with a superior attitude. And you speak to me of ethics?<<

Do tell.

By the way, your attempt to link a bunch of separate concepts into a single, vast left-wing conspiracy sound quintessentially Beckian to me. Not to mention tissue-thin in the logic department.

And has it not yet occurred to you, that Beck himself uses classic Bernays tactics in the manipulation of his own audience? Where does that fit into your theories?

I think Al's problem

Is he discovered 60s Psych

Fifty years too late

Dear Pericles

"Vast Left wing Conspiracy" ?

I believe in that as much as many leftoids believe in a "vast right wing military industrial quest for total control"

"Left wing" is indeed part of it Pericles. There is, without question, a communist insurgency going on in America, via the SEIU and AFLCIO and many others.

Naturally, to call it that name is to attract the poo pooing of the likes of yourself. But that's ok.. because I prefer to rely on the words and writings of the people concerned than your own tangential espousings from afar.

You see.. when the likes of Soros openly say 'from his own mouth' that he "rather enjoyed" participating in overthrowing governments.. we kinda get the message. If Soros limited his 'philanthropic' activities to disposing of Communist dictatorial regimes (Like Checoslovakian, Ukrainian) we might not have much concern. But when his foundations and connections are so vast as to threaten American democracy? aah.. "enter BECK".

You see Pericles, Soros is not interesting 'overthrowing' just Dictatorial regimes for the good health of the citizens, he is interested in overthrowing ALL governments he and his agenda find politically distasteful.

"New World Order" is his order of the day... of his life. Note "HIS" new world order..not yours..not mine..but HIS.

You call em..and me..as you see em/me... I'm fine with that. In the end, fact and truth usually prevail.

Communist agenda in America? It must be well concealed.

Al
While you are chasing mythical communists the real threat in modern society (corporate power and far right wing economic agendas) continue to erode the foundations of democracy.

Trouble is many Americans don't know what Communism means. For example, many Americans think that a government health system which ensures even the poorest Americans have access to health care, is a communist conspiracy.

What about the gradualism of corporatism? How do we deal with that in an open and democratic society? The light bulb moment has well passed and still the US is spinning nonsense about socialism and communist conspiracies.

Reds under the beds!

"Communist insurgency"

My samurai ar$e

So... that's a "yes", then, Boaz?

>>Dear Pericles "Vast Left wing Conspiracy"? I believe in that as much as many leftoids believe in a "vast right wing military industrial quest for total control"<<

As we know from this thread alone, that is exactly what many of them do believe.

>>There is, without question, a communist insurgency going on in America, via the SEIU and AFLCIO and many others<<

I guess it's very much a secret insurgency, right? Except to those who have been "reliably informed" by Glenn Beck.

>>I prefer to rely on the words and writings of the people concerned than your own tangential espousings from afar.<<

Glenn Beck is certainly concerned. Very concerned. A concern that he transmits, quite cleverly, to folk who are confused by the complexities of life and just want someone to reassure them that they are not alone in their paranoia.

Interesting that you should mention Soros. You might enjoy this little gem I came across the other day. It has plenty of new material that I'm sure you could use.

http://g-r-i.org/downloads/DECEMBER_PART1_2010.pdf

When you've finished with that, Part 2 is just as much fun.

http://g-r-i.org/downloads/DECEMBER_PART2_2010.pdf

Great stuff. Don't say that I never do anything for you Boaz. Loved this:

"...by 2012 the American currency would be worthless"

That will really piss off the Chinese, who hold hundreds of billions in $US debt. Think about it.

And it comes from a source as impeccable as Mr Beck - Mr Roger K Young. As you are no doubt already aware, Roger runs the website "Another Word of Warning", dedicated to exhorting people that they should prepare themselves for the end-times by storing away a year's supply of food.

http://www.ldsavow.com/brethren_quotes.html

I particularly liked this observation from one of the Pastors:

“Many more people could ride out the storm-tossed waves in their economic lives if they had their year's supply of food, and were debt-free. Today we find that many have followed this counsel in reverse: they have at least a year's supply of debt and are food-free.”

It's comforting that even end-timers are human, underneath.

Dear Pericles :) oh my... but glad you are doing some wide reading.

I'm afraid naming Soros as 'the AntiChris' is about the level of predicting the date of the Lord's return.

You know how it goes by now..
-"choose some controversial subject"
-"Make wild but confident claims this way or that"
a) Make a lot of money on your book.
b) Make a big name for yourself or your Web site, which could translate into donations.

When people start on theories which use the word "IS" and "WILL"

I step back like a million paces.

Seriously, you should watch Beck and Orielly (both) over a 6 month period. 'Do' what Beck says "NEVER..EVER believe me....DO your own homework" and you might be surprised.

Relying on left wing blogs or MediaMatters? :) *cringe*.

I take great satisfaction at times in comparing Becks 'assertions' with how the Leftist blogosphere handles them. Very amusing I assure you.

Seldom have we met a modern "Bernaysian" effort to equal the Anti Defamation League. Those blokes are as rabid in their anti Western-ness the worst of the 3rd Reich ever was in it's anti semitism. We just don't see the body count yet. But rest assured... if the Weathermen had their way... 20 million unre-educatable Americans would have died.(FBI infiltrator report)

Becks treatment of Soros was liberally laced with contexted Soros interview admissions.
Soros' 'open society' response was more like the KGB or the GESTAPO.

Interesting. But in all fairness to balance things up ... Richard Dawkins tells us in his book, "The God Delusion," that -
"in the US of recent years, the phrase, "American Taliban" was being coined. If you do a swift google search you'll get more than a dozen websites. The quotations that they anthologize,are particularly nasty ones beginning with a prize one from someone called Ann Coulter who, American friends have persuaded me is not a spoof... "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity." And there's more gems but I won't go into details. All the ingredients are there: slavish adherence to a misunderstood old text, hatred of women, modernity, rival religions, science and pleasure, love of punishment, bullying, narrow-minded, bossy interference in every aspect of life. They are a perfect example of what happens when people take their scriptures literally and seriously. They provide a horrifying modern enactment of what life might have been like under the theocracy of the Old Testament. Kimberley Blaker's, "The Fundamentals of Extremism: The Christian Right in America," is a book-length expose of the menace of the Christian Taliban." As I said - interesting.

At least one of us is doing so, Boaz.

>>Dear Pericles :) oh my... but glad you are doing some wide reading.<<

You tend to regurgitate the last opinion that is fed to you, without questioning either its provenance or its relevance. For example, you began this thread by taking a swipe at Bernays, having heard Beck mention him (eighty times) on his show since the turn of the year.

And don't give us that tosh about "my son told me" - your credibility on such matters is zero, remember? Fortrose, and all that.

>>His primary method was to identify 'deep seated felt need' and apply this to changing opinion.<<

Which is, as you should be the very first to recognize, exactly the modus operandi of your mate Glenn Beck.

The "deep-seated need" he feeds on is their insecurity, and the main tool that he uses is to convince his acolytes that they are, actually, discovering stuff for themselves - "...do your own homework", etc.

Which is of course very clever - and Bernaysian - but totally manipulative. It uses the same mental processes as a conjurer "forcing" a card...

http://www.card-trick.com/sleights/forcing_cards.htm

...or the cold-reading techniques employed by such charlatans as John Edwards. To the suggestible in the audience, it looks as if the hustler "knows" everything, but in fact he merely reflects their own thoughts back to them.

>>Seriously, you should watch Beck and Orielly (both) over a 6 month period.<<

I'd rather remove my own appendix with a rusty blade. In the dark.

But - "seriously" - why six months?

Does it take that long to achieve the state of numb, unquestioning acceptance that you have reached?

Though it appears that the mindlessness does not last forever.

http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2011/01/04/2011-01-04_glenn_beck_dropped_by_new_yorks_wor_radio_station_over_poor_ratings_replaced_by_.html

There may be hope for you yet, Boaz.

First the canny New Yorkers get fed up with his distorted lens, followed sometime later, by Kentucky trailer-trash, until eventually the realization reaches Melbourne, Australia.

Everything about him is show-business, and everything is about making himself some luvv-erly mon-ey.

http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/0426/entertainment-fox-news-simon-schuster-glenn-beck-inc_print.html

"Monetizing a mouth: Beck's media empire is bringing in $32 million a year"

Dear Al,

I agree with Pericles - and I'm amazed that you find Glenn Beck so credible.

I have mentioned before that I find his "act" so incredibly transparent for being an "act" in the same way that Jimmy Swaggart performed with dramatic intensity in his stage show.

I can't believe that you can't see it.

"Jesus conquered death. He wasn't victimized. . . . If he was a victim, and this theology was true, then Jesus would have come back from the dead and made the Jews pay for what they did."
Glenn Beck - July 13

AGIR takes dear Poirot off for some therapy :) walk...walk.. walk.. ok P..sit down please...

The egg timer is going....*now*.

Bless you for trying, but you are scratching where I'm simply not itching.

*I'm amazed you find Beck So CREDIBLE*

which is code for..(it seems to me) "I've watched a couple of shows, and then turned to Media matters or left wing blogs for my information"

I say this because if you watched Beck regularly over time, you would detect a very noticable method in his presentation.

That method is this "out of their own mouths" so it's not BECK who is credible...it's the people he puts on our screens... digging their OWN verbal grave.

EXAMPLE. Beck goes on a rant-a-thon about "If cap and trade are brought in, energy prices will skyyyyyrocket" He gives background.. facts.. trends...

THEN.. He puts Obama himself on, from a speech..

QUOTE:
"Energy prices will indeed skyrocket under the cap and trade law"
UNQUOTE:

Now.. hopefully I don't have to give you an extended therapy session :) as I have other clients (Pericles) waiting out there.

Howwwww many times do I have to say "Beck says ...DON'T believe me..CHECK it out"

What does gullible me do ? hmmmm well of course I just take his word for it....right ? WRONG!

When I verified his 'Crime Inc' story with Gore and Zoi and Strong and Blood and Goldman Sachs etc... blew my mind..from ORIGINAL sources.

Check this out

GORE->(Kliener Perkins)-> Generation Investements-> Zoi-> Alliance for Climate protection->Dept of Energy->Shares in Landis & Gyr-> our smart meters +Labor connections.

You might find 'Discover the networks' of help in some of this.

Connecting between the Tides foundation (Soros)and the Agenda's they pursue- Gore, Strong, Zoi, Rockefella, even Bob Carr (Envex) etc etc etc.. (the list of names and connections is endless) is not hard.. it's in the shareholdings, directorships, Political activities etc..

Such things are not about 'Becks credibility' they are about fact and general credibility.

Ok...the egg timer just ran out of sand..and me time :) that will be $300 pls..(discount rate for nice people)

CSTEELE.. *exactly* .. do you see what Beck is saying ? (not bad for a Mormon too)

IFFFFFF Jesus was a 'victim' of the Jews...... you might well expect divine retribution. But Becks point was..it DIDN'T come. So the theology of 'Jesus as victim of Jooz' is flawed. But it's not flawed because something *didn't* happen...it's flawed because of what I explain below.

Any Christian who has an ounce of common sense and a reasonable grasp of the Bible know this.. Christ's death was DIVINELY MANDATED.

Repeatedly .. over and over...

Mark 8:27ff Mark 9:31ff Mark 10:31ff he says the SAME thing.

If you look *very* closely at the unfolding of events in Mark 8 it goes like this.

a) Time/Chronology.... nearing the end of Jesus ministry.. around 3 yrs. Only weeks before his Crucifixion.

b) He asks his disciples 'WHO' am I?
c) Peter 'gets' it... "The Christ"

d) Jesus BEGINS.. let me repeat BEGINS...... to teach them.....

"The Son of man MUST suffer and die and rise"

Read Isaiah 53 for goodness sake.. "HE was wounded for OUR transgressions.. bruised for OUR iniquities"

See this please: (Is 53)

10 Yet it was the LORD’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the LORD makes his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand.

Who's will? THE LORDS will!

It was not the Romans will..not the Jews will..not your will...not my will..but THE LORD's will.

"Offering for sin"- (His death)
"will SEE his offspring" (resurrection)
"my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities. (Justification by faith)

Dear AGIR,

Rubbish my friend.

While your worship of the man continues to allow you to view what he said with admiration at least Beck was not blind to the import of his words. The following day he retracted his statement and said who he really meant was the Romans not the Jews.

Now you need to look very carefully at what you have become. An unquestioning acolyte and apologist for a man who is waving some very dangerous flags in his quest for ratings.

Time to take stock young fella or you are in danger of becoming a young Hitler to Beck's Mayor Kruger.