So I started reading about Atheism purely for the selfish point of storing boxes of ammo to fire whenever the need arises, but it quickly turned into an interesting read about the realities of human nature, versus ideology.

We all love a good brain fight; some more than others, and I enjoy firing shots about, "well your bloke....", when in the end people that use faith - theist or not - to persecute then it's a sad indictment on humans as a species.

It's a fact that people with murderous agenda will use whatever tools work to achieve their goals. That rings true for the petty criminal, to the serial offender, to the likes of fundamentalist nutters from all creeds.

From the Fundamentals of Marxism Leninism Manual, Materialism and Idealism section.

"The great historic service rendered by materialist philosophy is that it helped man to break free of all superstitions. Ever since ancient times it has taught him not to fear death, not to fear gods and other supernatural forces.

It teaches us not to hope for happiness beyond the grave, but to prize life on earth and strive to improve it. For the first time materialism gave man the realisation of his dignity and intellect, proclaiming that man was not a worm condemned to crawl in the dust, but nature’s supreme creation capable of mastering the forces of nature and making them serve him. Materialism is imbued with the utmost faith in the human intellect, in the power of knowledge, in man’s ability to fathom all the secrets of the world around him, and to create a social system based on reason and justice."

Interesting read. What's even more interesting is the rhetoric versus the man made reality of that Atheist ideology.

Well StG atheism is not a man-made ideology it merely reflects absence of believe in the supernatural. It is just a tag to describe someone who does not believe in God.

Religion is the man-made ideology, probably designed, at best, for good intentions in more primitive times, at worst, for control - who really knows. One of the flaws IMO of religious dogma is the view that man is supreme in nature. We are certainly more higher order in terms of intelligence but that gives us greater responsibility as well to act with integrity when human life impacts on the environment or on other species. Ultimately this protects human life as well. It is all symbiotic.

Atheists like those with faith are a broad Church and what one atheist thinks or believes does not represent all others just as those who subscribe to different religious beliefs would not claim to represent all Christianity or Islam etal given there are many differing sects within.

While a robust debate or joust is fodder for the brain cells, it would be a lot easier to just accept that people think differently for various reasons rather than the continual praising or condemning of either IMO.

The usual stigma of amoral atheism and intellectually handicapped theism serves no other purpose than division.

STG,

Still banging on this old drum?

Lesson in Logic: because all cows have 4 legs, does not mean that all animals with 4 legs are cows.

Similarly because Marxism promoted atheism, linking atheists to Marxism or Marxist ideology is extremely feeble.

The absence of spirituality does not imply that only materialism is left. The proportion of Christians that are materialist is no different than atheists, and from my personal experience higher.

pelican,

>"atheism is not a man-made ideology"<

That wasn't my statement.

I said, "What's even more interesting is the rhetoric versus the man made reality of that Atheist ideology."

Mankind has used faith in the negative as well.

Shadow Minister,

If you don't like it, don't comment. Fairly simple I would think. Anyway, Marxism - Leninism is an Atheist ideology. It doesn't just promote it, it IS it. And you misunderstand the use of the word 'materialist'. They don't mean widesreen teles and such, they mean what you would call scientific evidence. And I didn't write the manual of Marxism - Leninism.

At everyone. If you're going to comment on this topic, take the time to comprehend the original post. Cheers.

STG

Do we HAVE to go over this AGAIN? ? ?

Not believing in a religion is just that. Not believing in a religion.

For example, Shadow Minister and I disagree on many issues, in fact I think the only two things we have in common is not following any religion and posting on OLO.

There are plenty of people who are raging, ranting, right-wing capitalists who are also atheist.

I really like doing origami, doesn't make me Japanese.

Many Buddhists are Communists, so too Hindus, Jews, Muslims and guess what there are communist Christians - despite the rhetoric of Lenin and Marx.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_communism

If you were born here in Australia, chances are I have more in common with you than I do with Lenin.

Sheesh!

hey waitttttt a minit folks.. the topic is not 'atheism' but Marxism/Leninism... and what a juicy choice it is :)

Marxism/Leninism is Satanic ?

Saul Alinsky's 'Rules for Radicals'.

“Lest we forget at least an over-the-shoulder acknowledgment to
the very first radical: from all our legends, mythology, and history... the first radical known to man who rebelled against the establishment and did it so effectively that he at least won his own kingdom — Lucifer.” (Saul Alinksky.. "Rules for Radicals")

Suprisingly, Alinsky waddles, quacks and has feathers like a communist duck, but never formally joined any party. Nevertheless, his community organizing methods have been taken up by the American left with great gusto.

It's worth reveiwing his methods...because they are seen in a lot of places and movements..including the infamous ACORN.

STG's quote : "The great historic service rendered by materialist philosophy is that it helped man to break free of all superstitions."

...really shows how lacking in understanding these communists are.

The real human condition (for most) is this:

11 He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the hearts of men; yet they cannot fathom what God has done from beginning to end. (Eccl 3:11)

That's the condition of the natural man. He/she has only 'general revelation' to inform him her about the nature of God. Special revelation is needed to break through that shell of blindness and ignorance.

Communism, Marxism/Leninism completely misses this fundamental truth.
It begins from the darkness of uninformed, imperfect general revelation....and denies the special revelation in Christ.

As Jesus once said of the religious leaders of his day:

15"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are."

Harsh words indeed.. (Foxy.. u reading ?)

But anyone who rejects not just the general, but also the special revelation of the Almighty, and then teaches men so, falls under the condemnation of those words of Christ