*Yabby once referred to the entrepreneur being like the cave-man hunter. No cave-man worth his hide would kill more than he could eat within a reasonable time.*

Severin you missed the point. People commonly follow their instincts
and a hunting instinct is one of them. Insincts are based on
emotions and chemical rewards. You don't decide not to have
sex, because you don't want a child. You do what feels good.

In fact my dogs regularly chase rabbits and parrots, even if they
have just had dinner. They do it because they enjoy it. Its the
same with business tycoons.

So what if they have money? They can't eat it, they can't spend it,
so they invest it, take calculated risks and create economic activity
and jobs in the process. Its those jobs, which people like you need
to survive. When Murdoch throws 100 million $ at a movie, having
no surety that it won't be a flop, many people are employed in the
process of making that movie. To take those kinds of risks, you need
substantial capital behind you, be it an individual or company.

In genetic terms its certainly paid off for Murdoch, for he's in his
70s, with a young thing on his arm, still making babies.

Stern

"What has happened is its purity has been debased by neo-socialists who have meddled with the regulations to drive a particularly odious social agenda"... this sounds the same as an apologist for Communism explaining away the failure of that system.

Same problems, same excuses.

It's always the way when a mere theory is elevated to a 'living being' status, and as you highlight above, there is no such a beast as 'pure Capitalism' today, and there never was.

Interesting that you blame the downfall of Capitalism on Blacks-Hispanics and women getting loans, and not, say, on the never lifting wages for 'the poor folk' in the USA, along with, yes, foolish decisions by greedy bankers, and greedy stock exchange types, along with irresponsible 'pension funds' required to gather massive returns, and vote seeking (probably corrupt) politicians.

This is another goodie, "Economically naive (stupid) social mind /socialist governments, instead of following the common sense rules of capitalism, bastardised the system with fraudulent, socialist leaning regulation and brought about the economic problems of which you speak"... actually, if anything, politicians try to moderate the extremes of Capitalism in return for votes, rather than in pursuit of any imagined socialist agenda.

It is, for sure, the mindless bleatings of the mob that drives a lot of policy formulation, and that is far more persuasive than any ideological claptrap from left or right of the political rainbow, or any considered thoughts for that matter.

The mob, of course, comes with many shades to the collar, from blue, to the ubiquitous garb of the banker pink shirt-white-collar types, and variations thereof.

Peter Hume,
<Well I can only address one issue at a time, and it took an unprecedented 3 posts at the magical limit of 350 words just to get across the point that a non-capitalist system cannot be as sustainable as capitalism *assuming* it is to attempt to satisfy the same human wants.>

Dear Peter Hume,
I'm gratified that I've obliged you to extend yourself to an unprecedented 3 posts, though I'm inclined to observe, as I sometimes do on undergraduate assignments, that you could cut it by half without loss of content, thereby also making it far more readable. Indeed, withal the extra padding, I believe I've demolished your laborious premises: "that a non-capitalist system cannot be as sustainable as capitalism". Capitalism, I've argued, is unsustainable, inefficient and profligate; it is not merely unsustainable, I doubt it could, or will, ever be trumped in that regard. The laboratory rat (form of capitalism) you dissect can hardly be said to be representative of the species; indeed it's a purely hypothetical beast. S your proviso, "*sssuming* it [anti-capitalisms] is to attempt to satisfy the same human wants", erroneously implies that something of the sort has been accomplished.
So yes, I have nothing to add as yet; in the interests of fair play I believe I should give you the opportunity to catch up.
Noblesse oblige.

Aha... have a look at this chaps bon mots on greed,

"I am not convinced that understanding greed, even in a limited way, as a good is a good idea. There is no doubt that, for those shaped by the habits of modern societies, acquisitiveness is assumed to be a character trait that is indispensable for continuous and limitless economic growth.

"But from such a standpoint, the idea that a lower standard of living could be considered a viable alternative to the economics driven policies of liberal democratic societies is almost unfathomable".

Check these lines out chaps.....

"But we too are a people harassed by greed just to the extent our greed leads us to engage in unsatisfying modes of work so that we may buy things that we have been harassed into believing will satisfy us.

"We complain of the increased tempo of our lives, but our frenetic lives are just reflection of the economic system that we have created.

"We know, moreover, no other way to keep the system going other than the threat of war. We tolerate the world shaped by our greed because that world in return temptingly and cunningly makes us believe that there are no alternatives to a world so constituted."

Oh indeed, the greedy are truly empty vessels who make much noise to hide their emptiness.

http://www.tinyurl.com.au/dct

As an Anglo European white guy from a very long line of white guys, I want to thank all the brown, black, yellow and red people for a marvelous three-century joy ride. During the past 300 years of the industrial age, as Europeans, and later as Americans, we have managed to consume infinitely more than we ever produced, thanks to colonialism, crooked deals with despotic potentates and good old gunboats and grapeshot. Yes, we have lived, and still live, extravagant lifestyles far above the rest of you... my sincere thanks to all of you folks around the world working in sweatshops, or living on two bucks a day, even though you sit on vast oil deposits. ....

... It's the world's cheap labor guys like you: the black, brown and yellow folks who take it up the shorts; who make capitalism look like it actually works. So keep on humping. Remember: We've got predator drones....

....To an economist, work; the stuff that eats up at least a third of our earthly lives, is merely a "factor" called labor. Work is considered an unfortunate cost in creating added value. Added value, along with nature's resources, is the basis for all real world profits. Without labor, the money economy could not gin up on-paper wealth in its virtual economy. Somewhere, somebody's gotta do some real-world work, before bankers and investment brokers can go into their offices and pretend to work at "creating and managing wealth."

Paying the workers in society to produce real wealth costs money. Capitalists hate any sort of cost. It represents money that has somehow escaped their coffers. So when any behemoth corporation hands out thousands of pink slips on a Friday, Wall Street cheers and "the market" goes up. No ordinary mortal has ever seen "the market." But traders on the floor of 11 Wall Street, people who've deemed themselves more than mortal by virtue of their $110 Vanitas silk undershorts, assure us the market does exist. No tours of the New York Stock exchange are permitted, so we have to take their word for it...."

oooarrrr!

What a revelation.

"$110 Vanitas silk undershorts"... I suppose the silk acts as a sort of silican coating, like on a non-stick frying pan, preventing skid marks for the wearers when the dollar plunges, rises too steeply, markets crash, taxpayers revolt over constant bailing-out of failed Capitalists.

Does Peter Hume wear them, along with Stern and Yabby?