Those falsely claimed "wasted billions" (you've really fallen for the far right wing rhetoric haven't you) saved your sorry a r s e rehctub, and everyone else in Australia. Without the stimulus (which **EVERY** first world country has adopted) and infrastructure repair Australia would be experiencing a horrid recession. Without stimulus worldwide the world would now be in the middle of a serious depression. The Liberals "policy" (so called) was to sit back, watch and DO NOTHING ...... had those amateurs been in charge. Imagine it, a country run by Abbott, Tuckey, Bishop, Hockey....... we'd be the laughing stock of the world.

Like I said, your posts show why you live in obscurity rehctub, while Kevin Rudd achieved the highest office in our country.

Benq
At no time have I said the stimulus was a bad thing.

I clearly stated that it was the way it was implimented that was wrong.

Now you can remain in denial as long as you wish, but the reality is that there have been billions wasted on failed projects, most related to the stimulus.

Insulation is of cause the worst case, then there was the wasted stimulus dollars spent on gambling, grog and cigs, all of which returned a heafty sum to the government through taxes.

As I have said from the outset, why did they not distribute specail 'debit cards' whereby the money could not be wasted on booze, gambling and cigs. And who can forget the overseas residents getting some of the stimulus, planned to stimulate 'our economy', agree?

Now I don't deny anyone the right to spend thier money on these items, but not the tax payers money.

I further stated that such a card needed a 'use by date' and, if not spent within this timeframe, any remaining credit would have been forfited.

Now I am certain that even you agree this would have stimulated the economy.

My other beef was the employment rules.

Blind freddy knows the last thing you do when times are tough is make employing people harder.

Now you can go on rubbishing me as long as you like, nothing sticks! But may I suggest you try saying something positive to defend the actions of your favourite PM.

BTW, I note that Madam PM isn't faring that well and the honeymoon may well be over. Remember, she was a huge part of all this wasted billions and people will find it very hard to forget that.

Remember the school tuck shop for $600 grand? Her baby!

Rehctub, while I realise the Liberal Party manifesto disallows you to even consider thinking outside the accompanying right wing propaganda, try ...... just "try" for one minute to understand why the stimulus was enacted.

It was put in place in order to **stimulate** the economy, in other words to provide employment and spending power in order to keep the economy turning over instead of drifting into lesser activity and eventually recession and depression. The insulation project, in this regard, was an **outstanding** success. For political reasons it was stopped owing to the 4 deaths and the lack of safety; it was a dismal "political" failure. The **economic** benefits were FANTASTIC however.

There was NOT "billions wasted" as you falsely claim while following the Liberal manifesto to the letter. There was a MAGNIFICENT economic return..... more jobs , more money, more purchases, more manufacturing, more food in mouths, more clothes on backs etc etc etc.

OK, lets see you back up the false "billions wasted" claim. A billion is one thousand million. As you have claimed "billions" (plural), that means you are claiming a sum of over 2 thousand million dollars of stimulus money has **NOT** produced any return to the economy whatsoever. Come on rehctub, back yourr claim up with **FACTS** and **FIGURES**. I want **YOUR** accounting that shows, proof positive, a ZERO return........ in other words WASTED BILLIONS.

Don't forget now........ provide the proof and actual accounting figures that at least 2 thousand million dollars of stimulus money has not produced an economic return. I'm not interested in hearing more or your right wing rhetoric and "opinion", just give me your accounting figures for the sum you claim was lost to our country, showing how, in mathematical detail, it produced no outcome.

Benq
I am not an accountant, nor do I claim to be, furthermore, the wated billions is not confined to the stimulus alone.

From memory we started with a new government and around 70 billion in the bank.

Now, less than three years later, that money is gone and we have a debt of some 60 billion or more.

That's 130 billion. Right!

Now, what has been achieved from this?

How about the money needed to fix the insulation programe and restore peoples houses so they are safe to live in.

How long will this go on and how much will this cost?

How much have houses been de-valued by having insulation installed that has been proven to be 'at risk'?

Would you feel comfortable buying a house knowing the insulation may have been fitted by some dodgy opporator?

How much was wasted on the Copenhargen fiasco?

Did we really need to pay $58 for a bowl of soup?

I seriously doubt you would find anyone that doesn't agree, yourself excluded, that there have been billions wated on failed projects.

Again, I would love to provide exact figures, but that's simply out of my league.

Benq,

Irrespective of how loyal and blinkered a Labor tragic you are, even blind Freddy can see that the BER was extremely wasteful, with construction costs 3 to 5 times what they should have been. Given the $16bn tag, $2 billion wasted on this alone would be a conservative estimate. $8bn would be closer to the mark.

As for the $9bn cash splash which went almost exclusively on imported electronics, a few jobs were retained for a few months. It would have been cheaper to employ these people directly.

While some stimulus might have been required, the retention of jobs could have been achieved for a fraction of the $42bn spent.

What we are now faced with is a desperate attempt to restore the budget with a tax grab on mining.

Labor is not being judged on its intentions, but its appalling incompetence in implementation.

SM said "Labor is not being judged on its intentions, but its appalling incompetence in implementation."

Absolutely agree.

However for rehctub to throw up the old JG was part of the group responsible, ignores the main reason for the leadership spill. It was about KR's management style and failure to consult and inform others in his team. Many MPs and Ministers only knew about changes to the ETS through the media. Dictatorial styles don't go down well in political parties in countries like Australia.

JG was a part of the Group of Four but how much influence did she have with Kevin? JG may have warned him on a number of issues as I suspect Swan and Tanner may have as well, but look to the nature of the man.

I must eat humble pie, as many moons ago I wrote on here that the leader largely doesn't matter it is policies that count, but in this case clearly that rule does not always apply.