Severin that's an excellent piece.

I'd been pondering comments by Michael Flood in one of the pieces written for XY Online http://www.xyonline.net/content/pro-feminist-publishing-delights-and-dilemmas "that pro-feminist men and magazines such as XY sometimes have been too focused on the negative without appropriate qualification or context" which seems to fit with with some of the point's made in the piece you referenced.

I've been pondering the hostility between the men's movement and women's movement when often the real goal's don't seem that far apart even if the understanding of cause differs and how some of those divides can be bridged (it appears that Flood has spent some time on that as well). The attacks by some on feminism in it's entirity do nothing to soften attitudes nor do the attacks on the men's movement by some women (or by Flood for that matter). The comments made in the article you referenced are ones we can all learn from.

Thinking about the example of the handbag from the article has me thinking about where I'm at on some of that stuff. I think a transitional point for me came many years ago when the church I was involved in had Rev John Smith (http://www.concernaustralia.org.au/johnsmith/) up to speak to us and do some stuff with the youth group. I can't recall the detail of what he said but it challenged some of the unhealthier aspects of masculine conformity in a caring manner.

In particular for me I think I had my first adult man hug from John. One person in the right place at the right time willing to care can make a difference.

R0bert

Severin, you've got to be kidding.

Bring us your handbag, & I'll dance around the CBD of any city you like, with it, all day, if it will help stop you falling for this bull dust.

The reason men don't go for all that rubbish your link produces, is that our BS detectors are far to highly tuned to fall for such stuff.

I'll bet you read all those "How To" books, like how to make a million before next week, be more popular, successful, positive & all the others.

Have you noticed that those who do fall for this stuff, don't, ever become what ever it was.

For heavens sake, go buy some roller skates, a surf board or even a motor bike. They may get you out of the house, & keep you too busy to continue to gaze at your navel, all day.

Dear RObert,

We should all support Men's Sheds for the
excellent work that they do in dealing with
health and other issues ranging from isolation,
loneliness and of course depression in both the
urban and rural regions of this country.

You may find the following website of some use:

http://www.mja.com.au/public/issues/185_08_161006/gre11027_fm.html

Men's health and wellbeing: taking up the challenge in Australia.

Hasbeen did you read the article?

If so what bothers you so much?

Some men are in real crisis, male suicide rates should tell that story strongly enough. Others have really miserable lives and no sense that anyone cares and no idea how to change it.

R0bert

Yes RObert, I got to page 3, but had to stop there, before so much BS made me throw up.

It is this type of rubish that gets men into trouble. Get them confused with this rubbish, & they will never find their way out.

Yes, the men's shed movement could help, as it will help many find some companionship, which they lack. But stop short of all the mumbo jumbo please, it helps no one except those who sprout the stuff, & get paid for it.

If that's where our society is heading it's too late for us. To be buried in that slime would make me want to slit my wrists.

Hasbeen after the reading I've been doing this week my BS threshold is probably at an all time high.

I dated a psychologist for a while which gave me a better insight into the value of therapy for some people than I would otherwise have had.

What bothered you specifically? Was it the idea of the power of shame, the value of therapy, both or something else?

In particular I appreciated that the author recognised how unfriendly to men a lot of counseling situations are and that the required way's of communicating are often very female orientated.

I think the Sheds would be great for a lot of people but unless the organisers are really good there will probably always be gaps for some people who need real support.

R0bert