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The Forum > General Discussion > Israel's choices.

Israel's choices.

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No actually, the world could actually, instead of trying to "manufacture" a true, Islamic Democracy, with modern values and all the rest, actually embrace those that do exist - Kurdistan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdistan) & Azerbaijan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azerbaijan)...

But on the basis that the squeaky wheel gets the grease, we continue to watch the world throw massive amounts of resources at the Palestinians. Sh1t, these two nations have massive oil & gas reserves, so they wouldn't even need to be funded out of the dark ages. All they need is the support necessary to safeguard them.

That is what amazes me with the "peace flotilla", absolute bunch of condswallop aimed at providing a propaganda victory for people who will not help themselves. Yet these societies, which are models for the entire world (not just the middle east) are ignored, not newsworthy enough. Or is it that Israel isn't involved?
Posted by Custard, Friday, 4 June 2010 8:57:30 AM
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These ships are supporting and giving aid to terrorists.
Israel has no option but to take all personnel off the ships then sink it.
Any one of these ships could be carrying any type of weaponry used to kill israelies.
Israel does not have the manpower nor inclination to conduct a thorough search of these ships.
But one thing they cannot afford is to allow these ships through unsearched.
No I am not a Jew I am an atheist
Posted by ponde, Friday, 4 June 2010 9:28:30 AM
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It's interesting to read people's
interpretations of "terrorism."
I would have though that "terrorism"
can only be applied to political acts
of violence that are aimed at civilians.
Beheading construction workers in Iraq
and bombing a market in Jerusalem is
terrorism, pure and simple.

Yet to suggest
that any and all forms of Palestinian
resistance to an illegal occupation
is "terrorism" or the work of "militants"
ignores totally the legitimate rights of
an oppressed people to struggle for their
independence.

"Terrorism" seems to be
accepted by some, as a defining term
for Palestinian resistance,
whereas an Israeli military
campaign has legitimacy. In this view, Israelis,
and Westerners in general, never commit terrorism,
only Arabs and Palestinians do.

Therefore for some - the recent debacle in Gaza that
has caused global outrage at Israel violating
international maritime law is perfectly acceptable.
There is no need to ask questions like - why didn't
the Israeli authorities apply "border protection
policies" as practised at shipping ports, airports,
and border crossings, where civilized, legitimate
procedures are used to determine illegal importation
of goods, such as weapons, drugs, contraband, plants,
food items, animals and birds. Did they even try
using negotiation and diplomacy?

In the dark, shadowy figures coming out of noisy
helicopters with weapons, to any normal person,
would appear to be a threat to their safety and
would naturally evoke self protection.

If we condemn the actions a rabble of
undisciplined Somali pirates approaching
large ships in small boats threatening the ships,
bording them successfully, and then taking those
ships and passengers as hostages to Somali ports.
Why not condemn the actions of
a highly-trained Israeli military force for doing the
same thing and causing deaths and injury? Blaming
the organisers of the flotilla is shifting the
responsibility from decisions taken by the Israeli
government, and its well-trained military.

At the very least,
an independent international inquiry needs to be
conducted to clarify the circumstance of the
incident.
Anything less would simply be an injustice.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 4 June 2010 11:36:37 AM
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Oh Dear, it goes on and on.
I continue to be amazed at the number of people who are unaware of the
nature of war at sea.

I would suggest a few minutes thought along these lines.

It is generally considered that there is a war like status between
Gaza and Israel.
Israel should, to clarify matters, declare a state of war with Gaza.
There seems to be a large group of protesters who are surprised that
people might actually be killed in a war at sea.
Baby Boomers and those younger do not seem to realise the nature of
war at sea.

In a war, blockade runners are likely to be torpedoed without notice.
If Israel had sunk the ships with all on board there is plenty of
precedence to support their action.
There is absolutely no point in calling it piracy or complaining
about the action in International waters, they are not relevant.
As much as you all are appalled at that, that is the way it is
so live with it !
Posted by Bazz, Friday, 4 June 2010 11:40:12 AM
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Yes Foxy they did try negotiating.
They requested that they go to a port in Israel and unload the ships
there and they could accompany the cargo to Gaza to ensure it was delivered.

I heard the radio conversation between the Israeli army and the ships.
It appears that the suggestion was refused, probably because that was
not the aim of the exercise.
Posted by Bazz, Friday, 4 June 2010 11:49:36 AM
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Dear Bazz,

A few clarifications:

The flotilla was in international waters
carrying humanitarian aid, medicine,
food, and so forth. They were not engaged
in a battle with the Israeli government or
its military. It was the Israeli military
that swooped down on them at night, fully
armed, with live ammunition. That is an act
of piracy, not a war time battle.

Israel does not have the right to act unilaterally.
And it certainly needs to explain the current
violation of international maritime law. Why couldn't
the ships be allowed to deliver the goods at the
Gaza ports, the goods could have been off-loaded
and inspected by UN officials. I'm sure that the
Palestinians would have accepted that. However,
again, It's either Israel's way or no way.
That's not negotiation!

3) You claim that Israel did negotiate? Negotiation
means that you actually listen to the other side's
requests, and not dictate only your terms to them.
Why should the Palestinians accept only the terms
that Israel dictates? The entire peace process
attempted between Palestine and Israel always
appears to be on the terms of the Israeli government
and no consideration is conceded to the Palestinian
requests. The offers to date have been neither fair
nor equitable.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 4 June 2010 12:47:29 PM
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