A lot of hatred in this thread, Islam this and that ad-infinitum but does anyone of you Islamaphobic protagonists actually have intimate knowledge of a Muslim, as in a mate, a cobber? How about its history in Australia and its contributions to our society? I think not, for to me much of the vitriol farcically on show is derived from the US propaganda machine which is religion-wise biased and racially prejudiced against any people coloured other than white. Don’t tell them that when Jesus walked the earth he had brown skin, black hair a beard and spoke in Aramaic. Much of the US authored demonisations are horribly regurgitated in clichéd examples of pathetic monkey see, monkey do emulation’s of grotesque loyalty and adoration of all things USA. Doesn’t it make you want to chuck chunder? Doesn’t it? Ho hum....!

I grew up in the seventies with the music of Cat Stevens whose lyrics embraced tranquil philosophical introspection of ones self and the world at large but universally his message was of peace never war nor avarice leading to the subjugation of third world countries to facilitate the theft of their natural resources. But I guess that as “plutocrats” you would see his behaviour as threatening your world, but guess what else “tough”!

In my country, Australia, secularism was written into the constitution by the federation founders whom had witnessed the terrible consequences of religious fervour in Europe and so decided that in this new land at the bottom of the Asia Pacific region, religion would find no dictate in the affairs of politics and state. Although there have been some religious transgressions into the affairs of state, mainly sponsored by divisive members of the Liberal Party (under foreign influence? Maybe I dunno), Australia on whole remains a secular nation. All Australians are free to worship whatever or whoever they wish without any interference from the state.

So can Cat Stevens come here to Australia to sing and speak to his fellow Muslims on peace and Gods message? Yes....he most certainly can and much more he is welcome with open arms.

Dear folks... including Pericles, Foxy, CJ and now.. Westralis.

You blessed folk have been accusing Steven, Proxy and myself of "Islamophobia"...

We have sought to justify our position (which is not a 'phobia' based on irrational fear) by reference to documented information which would shed light on that position.

I've hardly made any actual 'assertions' in this thread concerning Islam. But Proxy and Steven definitely have. I've taken a different approach..in the context of 'should Yusuf Islam be barred'...I've approached it from a 'look and see for yourself' standpoint.

But rather than engage in a genuine exploration of 'why' we 'gang of 3' are opposed to Cat Stevens coming here.. we get..

*drum roll*.....

1/ CJ MORGAN "Boazy, why do you want to ban Waleed Aly from appearing on the ABC? (Classic CJ "attack when cornered)
ANSWER.. see the information I provided in the link..and it will show you "WHY"
2/ PERICLES "Boaz, for the gazillionth time, I have absolutely no interest in discussing comparative religion with you, or anyone else."
(Standard Pericles when cornered "denial and obfuscation")

Then this deuzy

//"those attacks are being made from a position with no basis in logic."//

at which point.. (given its' just afer 4.00am) my Milo went SPURRTTTTT all over my crappy BENQ monitor) Why did my last skeric of milo have to be needlessly sacrificed in this way?

3/ CORNFLOWER picks Morgans Australophobia like the proverbial nose.
*hi5>cornflower*

Because, put simply

a) Pericles is left wanting.. claiming "No basis in logic"
b) But I won't discuss (or research, by the look of it) the issue or reasons.

I keep telling you P.. OTHERS can read that stuff :)

4/ FOXY However, what I found distressing was what was on the news this evening. Gaza?

Foxy must not have any regard for the 'poor Nazi's who had 'weird' ideas umpteen decades ago'..... because afterall..that was so long ago...

But Foxy.. you wanted "discussion" yet you deliberately avoid examining factual, documented information which might shed light on our position. That is bigotry I'm afraid "Don't give me facts..my mind is set"

THENNNN.....we have WESTRALIS jumping in like a hyena onto our bleeding half dead bodies.... after our 'logical and reasonable' mauling by the 'pride' of Pericles the Marauding Morgan and the Ferocious Foxy.. Westy tries to tear chunks of flesh off (even though he has not worked for it) with...

//A lot of hatred in this thread, but does anyone of you Islamaphobic protagonists actually have intimate knowledge of a Muslim?//

ERRR...to answer the question..'YES' emphatically.
But.. I fail to see why you BEGIN with the term 'IslamoPHOBE' without yet having examined 'why' we might have reservations we express.

WESTRALIS..let me try with you please.. you seem to feel the so-called 'hate' as you put it is unfounded correct?

I'll see if you are any more reasonable than the cabal of PericlesMorganFoxy

IF....(and it depends on this) you are SERIOUS and wish to know and understand WHY some of us are expressing such reservations....then please...demonstrate your good faith and intentions by examing one of the primary reasons.... You can see it for yourself. *values*

Follow this link please.

http://www.quranenglish.com/tafheem_quran/065.htm

Scroll down to the blue backed panel with Arabic writing, and the numerals 65:4

Scroll down (or read the whole discussion might be better if you have time) to the place indicated by *13

Then read just ONE paragraph from *13 on...and have a look at the conlcusion the author reaches concerning the meaning of that verse.

I invite you to present your findings here...and perhaps then you will recognize that this 'value system' is one which some people might find a bit unsavory.

STEVEN... if you don't know this already.. why not join in the exercise? It will be very educational.

PS..you will realize by now that no amount of evidence, reason or logic will penetrate heads like those you are seeking to reach :)

Hence..I am limiting my input to providing links rather than making outright assertions on this matter. It's the best way to highlight true bigotry.

STEVEN.. you did'nt report Yusuf Islam's most telling words

"Id try to phone Ayotollah Khomeini and tell him exactly where this man is"
Game...set...match -no ambiguity there.

Westralis? he is still welcome ?

A lot of hatred in this thread,
Westralis,
Yes ! If we want to curb this hatred then it must start with the people who cause it. What is this man's reason for coming to Australia ? A simple holiday or promoting his beliefs ? If he had an ounce of integrity then he should be aware by now that his visit is disconcerting for many Australians, so why not be considerate & consider the feelings of Australians & do the unselfish thing & not come here. He might have the individual right to come here but he also has the responsibility not to cause the division his visit is causing. So, what would make him a better individual, to insist on his right or to consider the feelings of others ? It's selfish but more than likely an agenda. When countries like Iran, Indonesia, the Arab nations etc. permit westerners to buy land & settle there & promote western culture then Australia should do so also. Presently, it's a heavily exploited one-way street with Australia constantly at the receiving end. Isn't it time Australia exercised it's right to stipulate who comes here ?

So, a seven-second snippet from a programme called - what was it? Oh yes, "Hypotheticals" - is now confirmed as justification for a never-ending tirade of whack-a-mozzie fear and loathing.

Where does that stand on the Gavril Prinzip scale of provocation to universal hatred, I wonder?

>>Watching Stevens express such DREADFUL thoughts or the fact that ANYONE could seek to excuse or minimise the horror of it.<<

Oh, the horror of it all.

Does anyone here remember the threats made to life and limb by the IRA in the 1970s? Many of those who made them have since become respected politicians. That should give stevenlmeyer the vapours as well, should he care to dig into it.

Yes, Cat Stevens/Yusuf Islam said a couple of very stupid things. Whether or not the statements can be justified within the concept of "hypothesis" we can argue about forever. But taken as a whole, it is hardly sufficient to justify the perpetual tirade of hatred that some would like us to consider reasoned argument on this thread.

Understand, Boaz, that your religious stance has precisely the same - no more, no less - validity in my eyes than any other. So any appeal to scripture, yours or anyone else's, is entirely and utterly pointless.

You may describe it as "denial and obfuscation" if you wish. But that is only because you see it through the eyes of your own one-dimensional view of life.