Houellebecq:"nobody has kids 'for the future of society"

Talking about crap debating standards...

I didn't say they did. i simply pointed out that if everyone made the selfish decision not to have kids, there would be no next generation, therefore having kids is a public good which parents pay for. why should the wilfully childless not also have a share of the cost, since they will reap the benefit of having that next generation around?

BTW, do try to keep up in future.

Foxy:"Blaming it on one gender or another"

Have you been to the Houellebecq school of debating irrelevancies recently? I'm not "blaming it" on anybody, merely pointing out that the decision is a selfish one, whoever makes it. Dear me, Foxy, you used to be smarter than that. If kids are worthwhile and we as a community seem to think they are, then we as acommunity should be making sure they're properly provisioned. Why should only part of the community bear the cost while others feather their own nests?

Foxy:"Vasectomy, IUD or whatever,
that's an individual decision that should be
made by the people involved."

Not according to Severin. Apparently a amn has a choice between a condom, vasectomy and celibacy as far as she's concerned and women need not take any responsibility at all. Beats me how she's remained childless.

Ah anti, the childless are forever paying for schools and hospitals and FTB and childcare rebates and soon maternity leave. I say they do their fair share. Lets not forget a lot are not childless by choice.

'I didn't say they did. '
Yes but your argument is so close to that it doesn't matter. You're attempting to put up someone who doesn't have kids as selfish, so that, oh, that means...since I have kids.... man I'm not selfish.

'I'm not "blaming it" on anybody, merely pointing out that the decision is a selfish one, whoever makes it.'

How is someone who doesn't have kids more selfish. Having children is selfish. I had children for PURELY selfish reasons. I wanted kids.

Having kids or not is equally selfish, and claiming people who don't have kids are more selfish is claiming you're somehow taking into account the needs of society in some way when you choose to have kids. And that more than a little bit bullsh1t.

Such a weak, weak argument. Severin (Who I cant stand so I'm doubly pissed off to be defending her) also said she cares for others children and elderly people. Why do you see it as some sort of competition. Why do you feel the need to berate the childless or put breeders up as better people? What do you gain?

'Apparently a amn has a choice between a condom, vasectomy and celibacy as far as she's concerned '
She never said that. You're getting more like her every day with these over-emotive misrepresentations.

You two are like peas in a pod.

Dear Antiseptic,

"Oh, okay, so you believe my style isn't
suiting you and you feel that I'm not as
smart as I could be. Oh, gosh, okay.
Well, I'm happy to discuss it with you.
Um, it's Friday now, so how about some time
after the week-end, if you'd like it done
this week. Let's make a time now and then
we can get back to where we were." ...

Dear Houellebecq,

Thanks for your input.

Houellebecq:"Lets not forget a lot are not childless by choice."

And let's not forget many men are not fathers by choice, yet still they must pay...

The fact remains that the current generations require fresh generations in order that they may live their dotage in some comfort. The cost of raising a child is significant and those who do so are effectively subsiding those who choose not to or indeed are unable to.

Houellebecq:"Why do you feel the need to berate the childless or put breeders up as better people?"

I do neither, simply point out that people who raise children have additional costs and other burdens compared to those who don't. A truly fair society such as I'm sure Severin would claim to support, would ensure that those who could not or would not contribute through their reproductive organs could do so via their financial contributions.

Houellebecq:"She never said that."

she implied it - "Then be responsible for the consequences.

Ever heard of "vasectomy"?"

Dear me, the debating standards...

Dear Foxy, it seems that is Severin's preference, is it yours?

Anti

>> Not according to Severin. Apparently a amn (sic) has a choice between a condom, vasectomy and celibacy as far as she's concerned and women need not take any responsibility at all. Beats me how she's remained childless. <<

You don't ever read my posts do you? You just react.

I suggested a vasectomy to Yabby who is single, past middle age and has stated that he prefers to remain single. Therefore, a vasectomy would be basic common sense. Even so, to avoid STD's, condoms are the most ideal solution. Besides, no professional sex-worker would accept unprotected sex.

Contraception is the responsibility of both sexes. That you suggest that I think otherwise is what leads me to consider you do not think my (and other's) posts through at all.

My childless status would be understood by you if you had actually read my contributions over the past two years.

Houllie

If you don't like me, that means I must be going something right. You may be surprised (although you really should be more aware) to know that you are not someone I have the slightest interest in impressing.

Foxy

I am sure you never intended this level of vitriol. Incredible.

My final word, monogamy appears to work for most people, but not all. For those who do not wish to be in a monogamous relationship, it behoves them to take responsibility for their own contraception. All of which should be bleeding obvious, but apparently not for some.

*My childless status would be understood by you if you had actually read my contributions over the past two years.*

Basically she's on the shelf and of course menopause and all that :)

See the bright side Severin, you won't need to worry about the pill
anymore.