The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > General Discussion > Abolish the citizenship test

Abolish the citizenship test

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. Page 3
  5. 4
  6. 5
  7. All
CJ,
You are spot on. You can represent me on this thread.
Posted by Philo, Monday, 25 January 2010 2:12:22 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
@CJ
"I think that a citizenship test is a sound idea - not only that, I think that everybody should be required to pass one, whether they're born in Australia or not"
@Philo "CJ,
You are spot on. You can represent me on this thread"

If we use the citizenship test for all Australians, as you suggested, then a huge number of Australians will lose their civil rights.
Most migrants from non-English speaking countries will lose their civil rights, as their English is not very good.
But if we start the deprivation of civil rights then we risk turning our democratic system ... to oligarchy or bringing back the …white Australia.
Our goal should be the extension of our democracy, the deepening of our democracy and not the exclusion and division of Australians.
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide
Posted by rightway, Monday, 25 January 2010 10:21:03 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Maybe *all* prospective citizens (local 17year olds included) should pass a test. (how would you do?)

But what will it test? It will easily fall prey to jingoism and mrs grundy.

I suggest that it should cover topics that some very large majority (say 70 or 80%) think are important, without neccesarily requiring pat answers. Nothing compulsory, nothing *important* excluded.

Make it a model for *any* citizen, anywhere.

People who aren't good at maths would like to be, so put some in, functional and advanced.
People who aren't historians still appreciate that the sweep of history has something to tell us. Put some in, not just local stuff.
Languages, sciences, musical ability, job skills, trades, crafts, hobbies, child-raising, history, bush survival, exceptional senses.

Rightway highlights a flaw. Someone speaking 3 languages and poor at english might fail. Why? How many languages do most Aussies know?

I know people (whose kids include my best mate) who don't speak english. They have two languages fluent and two others "sort of". Their english is good enough for me but not most. Why exclude them? They're fine, their kids are fine. My missus' grandparents might not have bothered (but did) with english, would we exclude an industrial chemist and an engineer? just for a preference for Russian? They don't *want* to talk to you, just see their kids do OK, *same* as you, and their kids *do* fit in.

The danger is that a test is easily subverted into something that lets candidates "pretend" to be a local and pass, yet exclude genuinely valuable people because they won't "fit in". If "they" have the personal dignity, "they" are more "australian" than conformists.

Who cares if "they" know the national "anthem"? An idea of common law is better for our nation. Who cares if "they" can recite lists of prime ministers? Do you know even one? in any nation? and their failings?

Forget "allegience to the flag", rip one up for bandages for those who need them. Allegience to one's neighbors and the common-wealth gets the tick.

No test, or test all of us.

Rusty
Posted by Rusty Catheter, Tuesday, 26 January 2010 1:14:32 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
For a community to be cohesive it must communicate fluently no matter which community. People entering Australia with the intention of becoming Australiam must respect its laws, institutions, culture and icons. Otherwise we cannot call them Australians, they have an allegiance to another culture or set of values.

Rusty Catheter, is certainly not an Australian with allegiance to our culture or values. It is not the cloth that unites Australia but the values it represents. Rusty should polish up his halo as he lets the Nation fall into chaos.

We can relate to people of other nations in a friendly and civil manner that does not make us citizens of other nations nor is it the criterion of participation in their government. Getting on well with neighbours does not mean we form the rules in their household, not rip down a tapestry of their great grandmother.
Posted by Philo, Tuesday, 26 January 2010 6:45:17 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Rusty: << No test, or test all of us. >>

That was the point I was trying to make, certainly when it comes to being allowed to vote in elections. However, given that citizenship is something conferred on most of us by accident of birth, I don't see how a citizenship test that is only compulsory for immigrants can be anything but discriminatory.

Nice to see Philo resuming responsibility for representing himself :)
Posted by CJ Morgan, Tuesday, 26 January 2010 8:27:13 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Sorry CJ I couldn't resist, thought you might be on holiday. Have a great Australia Day!
Posted by Philo, Tuesday, 26 January 2010 9:19:24 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. Page 3
  5. 4
  6. 5
  7. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy