as i explained at

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=8347&page=0

my posts reveal that hamas was created by the mossad;

that israel has presented no proof that hamas is doing the pipebombing[hamas is really only the equivelent of a political party name[like liberal or labour or the greens]

parties dont do things people do

later posts reveal fatah also was set up by israel [lol?]

but you cant punish captives crammed into a prison camp and say they are hiding behind children...[when settlers drag their children..[of a freechoice]into a war zone

[and palisteins are like fish in a barrel,..not allowed to leave]

the death rate also stands out
[the pipe bombs have killed 17 israelies in 6 years[and israel has killed nearing 400 in 4 days]

the timming at election time is also suspitious[plus admissions this attack has been in the planning for 6 mths]

also israel stating peace is not an option,...seems a blatent previeuw of what is planned

the timming is interesting as well,deliberatly planned to be exicuted while most press is asleep[and while still under gw busche's watch, noting obama's change we can believe in,will be unchanged from the busche/cheeney neo con zionist lobby stance

but i said it on
http://www.civilrights.org.nz/forum/index.php?topic=364.msg1060;topicseen#msg1060

http://www.peacetakescourage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9505

and at obama's change forum allready[he cant claim not to know]..it even mentions rothchilds role in the farce of a'homeland'[the 4th reiche]

for the same zionist capoes that chose;,who went to the chambers[the same type explused true judeans from the holy lands when the zionist'bolchovics/teutonics took it from palistein[the new/neo 4 th reicke]

[a feud that goes back 2500 years has been subverted, my posts reveal jews are created from nthe judean myths..[i also note that the natzies better prepare for a surge[sneak attack at anytime;when they get their hundred fold vengence upon the'natzies'for ww2,next time].. but [lol]its the self same natzies,settling like the teutonic/germaic/zionista have allways done under talmud law in many lands

[the hundred fold vengence is egsactly what the futile death toll reveals,every israelie is'worth'100 goys[non jew]the clay'man'who takes orders from the rothchild/zionist teutonics holyblood line.

It's a shame massab didn't get his hands on a copy of the God Delusion instead.

Look around the world, and you'll see that the more secular the country, the more stable it is.
It appears so many religious people bury their heads in the sand on this one, but it's true - it's there for anyone to see.

We can only hope secularism continues to spread.

Oops, that should be 'hassan'.

TurnRightThenLeft,

You write

'Look around the world, and you'll see that the more secular the country, the more stable it is. '

You are obviously ignorant of the founding fathers of the US and Australia. You also ignore the fact that the more secular we become the more violent we are as demonstrated by the murder of millions of unborn children. Your eyes are blinded by your dogmas.

Dear TRTL.... given that Moussab was schooled from childhood in the most radical form of religious faith, by a dad he regarded as a hero, the 'God Delusion' would probably not have helped him much.

I can imagine his mental state after the crisis of faith in Hamas and thus Islam... but bear one thing in mind please.. once his mind was opened to the Gospel...he made a long and systematic comparison between the Quran and the Bible. His conversion was not really Damascus Road like, more a slow train to Mumbai... I don't know the real saying.

At least his experience should underline to you blokes and gals...that when I say the same things..I'm not talking through my rear end.. it is in fact substantive and true.

I was discussing the "Free Gaza"/ "Save Israel" rallies today with a very independant feminist woman at gym. Her view was pretty adamant.. "All religions are good urging love.. and when fanatics claim their religion justifies killing others for the sake of their religion.. they are taking it out of context"

I didn't persue the discussion deeper.. but it remains true that her opinion was based more on sentimentalism than hard fact. It shows also, just how bigoted some secular people can be.. albeit ignorantly so. (not realizing) "I don't believe in discriminating against any religion... " cripes.. sounds good and noble but neglects some very real problems with Islam as a belief system.

How often have you heard me say "Islam"(i.e..the faith) teaches that unbelief after belief is a capital offense"? heaps.. but most of you poo poo that as 'biased/Christian Islamophobia (CJ) and misconstruing of obscure texts" :) (Pericles)...but it's real as the Al Qaeda document shows.

All Mousab needs is a regular diet of Grace, the Word, divine love and warm fellowship :)

runner, you've shown yourself to be immune to basic things like crime and abortion statistics, if they run contrary to your preconceived god-notions, but here's some reliable evidence for you.

http://www.slate.com/id/2203614/

"In his new book, Society Without God, Phil Zuckerman looks at the Danes and the Swedes—probably the most godless people on Earth. They don't go to church or pray in the privacy of their own homes; they don't believe in God or heaven or hell. But, by any reasonable standard, they're nice to one another. They have a famously expansive welfare and health care service. They have a strong commitment to social equality. And—even without belief in a God looming over them—they murder and rape one another significantly less frequently than Americans do."

But runner, here's the real kicker - they have far fewer abortions too!

"Denmark and Sweden aren't exceptions. A 2005 study by Gregory Paul looking at 18 democracies found that the more atheist societies tended to have relatively low murder and suicide rates and relatively low incidence of abortion and teen pregnancy."

For more evidence, you can look here:

http://moses.creighton.edu/JRS/2005/2005-11.html

But, I suspect, you'd rather just parrot another line about 'evil' secularists.

Well, frankly, this childish repetition is becoming pretty blatant to most posters on these threads.
I really don't know what it is you hope to achieve.