meredith,

Wow! Regarding your first paragraph and the party kink drug comment you are pretty good at generating possibilities. As many one liners as the sexuality change addiction could generate if it happened in real life it could be a serious problem.

"I'm falling into idealism here which i dislike as it is often so unrealistic but I'd think it could be a treatment for people that were deeply troubled by being gay..."

I'm guessing that is where TurnRightThenLeft was pitching and invite him to correct me if necessary. I suspect that there would be some self regulating there as I doubt that many other potential patients would be open to treatment.

"Idealistically I'd day yeh *maybe* on prescription after a year or 2 with the shrink..."

That makes a lot of sense.

"Then idealistically I also have said before that meat should be available with Drs prescription only as I am pro animal liberation..."

Singer who pushes vegetarianism heavily (remember the gore pictures in that chapter of the book?) reportedly believes that meat eating is okay providing that animals are humanely killed. Reportedly he doesn't say it publically because he thinks it would confuse people due to overcomplicating. The former makes sense to me. Would you be open to humane production or are you more polarised?

jpw2040,

Basically you want to out me as a fundy so we might just get that out of the way. You have to admit that it is more relaxing when fundys and activists don't gather in numbers and go in circles debating along party lines as normally occurs. Sorry I remember that you don't like me saying it normally happens even though I can't remember why. I just needed to refer to that to make the point I was trying to make.

Acknowledging the other aspects of your expressed view that adults should be able to change would you consider being deeply troubled a good criteria in current circumstances?

Hi MJ,

Idealistically/personally I'd prefer almost no meat production... dare I say none. Realistically though I push for animal-welfare and rights to adopt a more capitalist approach.

I have a post of alternatives to idealism in animal-welfare here:
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=4040&page=0#28438

I'm commenting on PETAs stand against mulseing sheep which they made at the height of our pretty successful and long-term campaign against live export of sheep to the Middle-East.

PETA were on 60 minutes saying they would crush the Aussie wool industry and our campaign took a massive downturn... Mulesing is nowhere near as painful or damaging as the exporting. They killed any good PR we had.

This is where I call idealism as selfish or foolish.

I believe it should be kept mostly kept out of social policy... as an atheist socially idealistic pushes from various groups are often akin to religions banging on my door/privacy/rights etc...

As a conservative, I tend to think it's a lot like kink, don't impose it on the masses, but preserve our rights to the freedom to idealise or kink all we like in consenting and more private situations.

Of course I believe it has saved us too... attempts to end slavery etc... but like I say.. a pill to cure murderers over a pill to toy with sexual preference.

I think it is called Utilitarian thinking too.

So I believe in capitalist sales of animal-welfare approved meat.

meredith,

"Realistically though I push for animal-welfare and rights to adopt a more capitalist approach."

I have always believed that a more capitalist approach is much more realistic. However I'm not a vegetarian. I just believe in humane production.

"PETA were on 60 minutes saying they would crush the Aussie wool industry and our campaign took a massive downturn... Mulesing is nowhere near as painful or damaging as the exporting."

Nor as painful as getting fly blown in the bush. Nor as painful as being cruelly treated in some other country and killed in pretty horrible circumstances. We've all seen the videos.

"This is where I call idealism as selfish or foolish."

No argument here.

Thanks for tying it back to the topic occasionally as I was worried that I had derailed the thread.

"Of course I believe it has saved us too... attempts to end slavery etc... but like I say.. a pill to cure murderers over a pill to toy with sexual preference."

But you can guess which one Murphy's law would make more likely to happen.