Co-ordinated attacks on 7 locations in Mumbai.

78 people killed..gunned down... 200 wounded.. Britons and Americans targetted.

So far.........

Hostages taken.

Reports indicate that a hithertoo unknown Islamist group has claimed responsibility or is responsble.

Probably the most important questions which should be asked here, are these:

1/ Have the Britons and Americans attacked anyone in Mumbai?

2/ Is the group responsible from India, Pakistan or where?

3/ No matter where they are from, what ideas are driving the objective of targetting US and British citizens?

UNDERSTANDING NEEDED.

The goal of this thread, is to establish the connections between this action, and ideas behind it. This understanding is crucial for us to grasp the nature of the particular type of terrorism we are confronted with in Mumbai, Bali, Melbourne, Sydney... and most important also, to recognize from where, i.e. which elements of the community, such things arise.

We can, by analysing the events of Mumbai, identify embryonic elements among ourselves where such things can happen, by recognizing the same ideas at work.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/27928844

'Deccan Mujahedeen' an Islamist group have claimed responsibility.

1/ Who is fighting them?
2/ How.. what has actually occured that this group can claim they have been 'attacked'?
3/ Do they see attacks on Muslim countries as attacks on them?

4/ If so, where could such a view come from?

5/ Should Australia be closely scrutinizing the sources of such views?

6/ What action can we take to reduce the possibility of such attacks on our soil

Why don't we wait for the news?

Here's a question for you: what makes you think anyone on here knows what is going on?

Don't let the facts stand in the way of a good "analysis" will you?

Boaz, you are utterly incorrigible.

>>We can, by analysing the events of Mumbai, identify embryonic elements among ourselves where such things can happen, by recognizing the same ideas at work.<<

This, as we all know, is Boaz-speak for "let's use the terrorists' murder of innocent bystanders as an excuse to dig out bloody surah bloody nine and use it to prove that we are all in imminent danger of being murdered in our beds."

Let's just see if I'm right, shall we?

Our local Islamic apologist can no longer blame Mr Howard, soon they won't be able to blame Mr Bush and it certainly won't fit with their dogmas to blame an African American President. Maybe, just maybe some journalist might look at the ideology behind the terrorism. I suppose the parallels with secularism are a bit close to home.

>>The goal of this thread, is to establish the connections between this action, and ideas behind it.<<

Yeah, right. And the goal of Coca Cola is to improve the health and well being of humans everywhere.

What if it turned out to be a bunch of Christian fundamentalists trying to give the ecstacy a shove along? Would the goal of the thread still be to "establish" connections beween this action and the ideas behind it?

Why is this forum infected by so many muslim-apologists?

Any time a muslim atrocity is mentioned, the poster is howled down for 'Islamophobia'. What a crock.

Anyone who attacks posters in this manner is a traitor and, hopefully, the terrorists' next victim.

Open your eyes. A high percentage of muslims is responsible for most ongoing terror operations.

Until this cancer of humanity is excised, we are all potential targets.

if you cant see this black swan event is a red flag op

god help us all

look at the wepens used in this mass destraction[grenaids and machine guns]

hardly the work of fertiliser [or liquid in airline bottles]

it specifuclly seems targeted at NON austrailians

[lest we forget the secret missions of our sol-diers in the muslim countries [were it REALLY muslims ,we would be on the head of the list; clearly note we are not

clearly these attack's are coordinated [premeditated and planned]
ie a special op

[i wont speculate who gains by this red flag operation]or from the arms build up for the armogeddonists upcomming attack on iran]

lest we missed it there are uprisings in other places
dont watch the hand
watch the flag wavers

right now our second wasted question time is deedicated to platitudes
[this time turn bull seems to be not fixated on ridiciuling rudd [but his name calling is a-typical]

just like the 3 trillion [not 800 billion] bailout is not a fulsome truth,

see that behind many of these 'attacks' is the desire to contain us to our homes[to limit our web info or the ability to comunicate with others]

but lets see what the tide brings in
dead men tell no tails

and open trials will not be heard [another prediction]
dead men tell no tail[tales]

google up crooked teeth and sad man insane
see even there they hung the dople ganger
[not the cia agitator]

who is the bull
the red flag wavers for?

You can come out from under the bed for a minute or two, Boaz.

The chances are high that this is a local dispute - local to India, that is, not to Warrandyte - and is unlikely to affect you.

As far as is known at the moment, the perpetrators are the Indian Mujahideen, an outgrowth of SIMI, the Students Islamic Movement of India. Their major objective appears to be to "demolish the faith (Hinduism) of the infidels of India".

You're not Hindu, are you Boaz?

Thought not.

So I think we can safely tick the list for you.

Referring to the Deccan Mujahideen, you asked:

1/ Who is fighting [the Deccan Mujahedeen]?
a: they believe they are being persecuted by Hindus, particularly the police

2/ How.. what has actually occured that this group can claim they have been 'attacked'?
a: "In an email – its favoured method of communication – it accused the city's anti-terrorism squad of harassing Muslims." http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/nov/26/india-attacks-mumbai-terror-security

3/ Do they see attacks on Muslim countries as attacks on them?
a: No evidence for this at this stage. It seems to be more about Kashmir

4/ If so, where could such a view come from?
a: Not applicable

5/ Should Australia be closely scrutinizing the sources of such views?
a: Sorry - what views?

6/ What action can we take to reduce the possibility of such attacks on our soil
a: Refrain from invading Kashmir and annexing it on behalf of the Christian Brethren

So, Boaz, you can relax. Nobody condones terrorism, of course, but in this case it is not our fight.

Or yours.

Quote
1/ Who is fighting [the Deccan Mujahedeen]?
a: they believe they are being persecuted by Hindus, particularly the police
Unquote

I wonder why ?

Today, I find myself being somewhat repetitive and ask for some one to translate One-under-god's obscure and esoteric post. Phil Metimein suggested yesterday that he enjoyed his rambling epistle as it taxed his intellect. Me ? I'm at a total loss to ever understand what he is on about........Spell check wouldn't hurt either, so if there is anyone out there in cyber space that could help......please, some kind of interpretation.

Austin Powerless: "Open your eyes. A high percentage of muslims is responsible for most ongoing terror operations." [sic]

Sorry, no. In terms of body count over time, I think predominately Christian nations are winning hands down (e.g. invasion of Iraq - about 100,000 civilians dead).

"Until this cancer of humanity is excised, we are all potential targets."

I assume you are referring to religion, and other superstitions, in which case I agree. The ticklish question is how to achieve it? Education I think is the key to a non-violent, human rights-preserving transition.

dear snake
here you go
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mumbai-attacks-to-be-linked-to-obama-target-pakistan.html

go to the main page tomorrow

it will be explained further as it unravels

[it is hoped currently [TODAYs broadcast seems a repeat of a pre election radio program]
so alex may have been shut down?

regardless see there is much revolt going on arround the world
that cleatly is either a black swan event[google that up]

or a red flag destraction

[to get us away from the financial collapse

just like 911 was[at 911 conveniantly [in building 7 [not hit by a plane] all the enron evidence [and great tonnage of gold simply disappeared

now gold melts
but it wasnt recovered
[to wit the gold was removed before the planes

anyhow enjoy the peace while it lasts

lets stop obsessing about money [and the money changers
there is evil that will stop at nothing to protect its finantial intrests

simply jfk signing pres order 11,110 was enough for his assisination 3 days later[put that into a 'spell'[fact]checker #]

some thing's 'children' dont need to know
thus why spell it out for um?

face your own fears
read what is said
not who is saying it

OUG's contention appears to be that the Mumbai thing is a 'false flag' operation..

But UOG does not then take it the next obvious step of allocating blame.
Seems a bit odd actually.. surely if you have compelling evidence that it's a false flag operation.. you must have an idea about who did it?

Pericles... thus far I'm aware of 2 major themes in this violent outrage.

1/ One (thus far to my knowledge) Islamist group has claimed responsibility.

2/ One of the (reported) 3 groups involved sought out British and American passport holders.

Putting those two facts together, it does not support your view that it is a local squabble.

The underlying idea is most important.

It remains to be known at this point who are all the groups involved, and this should become more apparent by the end of tomorrow I'd guess.

My view is that IF...(and it remains a bit blurry at this point) the seeking out of British and Americans is connected with "They are attacking 'us' in Afghanistan and Iraq" then we need to ask "who is 'us'" in such a statement.

Without even referring to your favorite surah, the idea which must be recognized (if the above is the case) is that of 'Muslim Ummah' i.e..a world community.

Such a community feels attacked even if the attacks are totally unrelated to local events such as in Australia. We now have convicted criminals/terrorists/Islamists to validate this.

The trial in Sydney will most likely further validate this.

On the other hand, if it is just the Kashmir issue, the same issue needs to be looked at. i.e.. The perception among the more adventurous end of the Muslim community that not getting their will, is tantamount to 'we are being attacked' and in accordance with Islamic precedents, and surah 2 this justifies retalliation.

Surah 9 is a step further removed from the simple self defense scenario. It is about outright world conquest.

Actually, I think the seeking out of foreign passport holders fully supports the idea of a local squabble. If they did not do this, how much coverage would they get in the international media? As a tactic to ensure that people discuss their motivations I think it has worked a treat.

Terrorism is about attention. They want you to know who they are and what their squabble is about. This is the same stuff as when the Palestinians hijacked planes and killed Jewish athletes or when the IRA were bombing English pubs. They want you to remember that they are still there.

They aren't going to slaughter you in your bed. They aren't able to take over the world. Taking over the world is an exceptionally difficult thing to do. Just ask any Bond villain.

I hate what they do. And to think that they do for their religion only makes me hate religion even more.

This is an awful act with it the predictable opportunism by some on OLO.

Isn't it bad enough to see this sort of hatred via these sorts of terrorist acts without seeing it reflected in our attitudes towards other religious of differing faiths.

Do we taint the reputation of all Christians by a few nutters like Koresh or the activities of closed communities and sects of the USA bible belt?

We all know terrorism is bad. The issue is what we can do to combat it. Spreading even more hate is not part of the solution.

>>One of the (reported) 3 groups involved sought out British and American passport holders.<<

Can we have a link please? All I've seen so far is that they attacked the wealthy, flashier part of the city, and that people from all parts of the world were killed and injured. I've seen the word 'indiscriminate' used, but not 'targeted'.

I'd be curious to know how they managed to tell the difference between British and American passport holders, and other passport holders. I haven't seen anything to suggest that anyone was asked to produce their passport at gunpoint

Boazpolycarp David must have been on his bike and pedaling within seconds of the first news.
I waited and heard 4or 5 news broadcasts then surfed the on line news first.
No one has yet proved who did it or why.
But if poly is right it supports my view religion divides men not unites them.
Now tell me I am wrong but some Christians posting here display some views that while God created all men he got it wrong with some?
The view that all Muslims are murderers is, well you can not say bigoted can you?
In time we will be forced to fight even harder than we do now against terrorists , we too will see death on our streets.
But why has your God let it come to this people?

I fully agree with Pelican.

Spreading more hatred is not going to
solve matters.

This was a terrorist attack, and I only hope that
retributions will not now take place.

We must keep in mind that the religiously minded
modern person is not a 'card-carrying' fundamentalist.
The latter are a tiny minority. Of whatever faith,
a psychologist would be likely to declare them to be
of unsound mind.

To analyze the situation in India, and the reasons
for why this incident happened, I'm not qualified
to do.

I'll leave that to the experts, people who would know
the situation in the country, and in Mumbai (Bombay).
Outsiders can merely speculate. In any volatile
situation such as this,
there are a variety of issues
that need to be fully researched,
before an intelligent analysis can be
made.

Ah damn! I'd promised myself never to comment on a BD thread again. But you have to admit that sometimes it's value for money, yeah?

I have been visited by a mental image of him, and his like-minded companions, sitting with narrowed eyes, muttering to themselves tersely out of the corners of their mouths, and occasionally breaking off to tear at their hair and shriek "The Fools! The Fools! Why will no-body listen?"

It's a little like a Monty Python sketch where some action is going on in the background that is at odds with what the voice-over is saying.

And I am not offering that information with any underlying motives: simply sharing.

I see Foxy and Pelican have, for a nano-second, forgotten where they are, and have absent-mindedly sent in posts that treat this thread as though it really was anything other than yet another, single-minded journey into the dead-end of a one-track mind.

Save yourselves ladies!

Dear Romany,

"...single-minded journey..."
You're probably spot-on, as usual.

But you know what I'm curious about.

Why?

Polycarp has probably told us at some time.
But, I can't remember.

What has he got against Islamists and why?
There must be a reason for his behaviour, and I
for one would like to know what it is.
Or at least, what's in back of it. Did he have a
bad experience? And it changed his life?

I really would like to know.

The greatest terrorists will turn out to be the Central Banks of the world.They are the ones at the apex, who set this pyramid debt trap.

Banks can inflict far more pain than ever imagined by the entire Islamic faith.

The enemy is in our own camp.It is called greed.Achieve the greatest profit with the least amount of effort.

'The greatest terrorists will turn out to be the Central Banks of the world.' Actually Arjay the abortionist kill more than anyone else.

Foxy,

No I don't think he has ever told us. But whatever it is I bet its got something to do with being naked.

For a fellow who contnually harps on about those foxy women at Church wearing spagetti strap dresses, its strange how so many of his stories seem to feature him nekkid.

And there must have been a lot of people from Lebanon, and women with no shoes on, and harlots with cleavage, and people on the dole, and hundreds of people who were homeless and terrified...because those are some of the other groups he's got his knife into.

And us unionists Boaz thinks we are all left wing trouble makers, add the fact I vote ALP and ?
Yes Foxy not all who have a religion are fundamentalists, we are lucky it is true.

Wow... so many questions.. so many creative angles on the subject.. or is it angles on 'me' :)

It surprises me though, that folks see an analysis of an overseas act of terrorism, which has claimed at least one Australian life, is not relevant to us..or.. that to discuss it is 'spreading hate'.

The 'spreading hate' allegation would without doubt have to be the biggest single cop out and shallowest of responses to a serious situation I can imagine.

"Examine the ideas behind the act" is hardly spreading hate. In fact.. all I've done so far is raise questions.

If the answers to those questions result in a particular group being confirmed as having certain unpalatable characteristics and ideas driving them.. well let the evidence take us down the appropriate path... don't get off the bus just because you hear that the destination is not quite what you thought it should be.

Pelican...your post deserves some more than scant attention.

You at least recognize that the actions in Mumbai are hate based.
But you then jump to the "reflected in our actions toward religions of different faiths" red herring.

Let me ask..IF.. it is shown that the ideology of a particular faith is seditious, dangerous, hate filled......then.. how is discussing that fact a problem? Do you squirm and shy away from talking about the values driving the Mafia because ur worried that it reflects badly on us? Hardly.. please stop being a hypocrite.

Then you ask "Do we taint the reputations of all Christians because of a Koresh"... err ...not if you examine the ideas which DRIVE him!

You cannot understand Koresh unless you know what he believed....once you know that, you can simply compare it with the Bible and find your answer.

If Jesus said "If you live by the sword you will die by the sword" and many other ANTI violence type statements.. than clearly Koresh was NOT a Christian......a compound full of semi automatic weapons and explosives? give me a break.

ROMANY.. you should be a writer :) that was a colorful image "whyyyy won't they listen"

David, what a load of pathetic self serving rubbish.

Some muslims choose to interpret their sacred texts in a way that leads to hate, many others choose not to do so. Some christains have gone down the same track and many others choose not to do so. You read their texts and see the evil and read your own and see the good.

You have a lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng history on OLO of using almost any pretext you can find to attack muslims and absolve your own faith from any responsibility for wrongdoing.

You try to get FH to come listen to muslims who use their faith for hate but seem to have no problem with the naked hatred of unbelievers displayed in most of runners posts.

The acts in india are sickening and I sometimes wish there was a hell so that the perpetrators could get their reward.

Your own attempst to use these events to promote further hatred and discord are not in the same league but are contemptable. You hinder genuine discussion of the issues by your persistant attempts to misuse anything you can find to attack the competition.

Stop your pathetic bleating and look at your own behaviour. Your choice to try and use this horrific incident to further your own cause disgusts me and judging by the response many others. You are part of the problem not the solution.

R0bert

If someone other than Boaz had started this thread we'd be having a reasonable discussion about this. Is it possible to just ignore him and share information for once?

Kevin Rudd has offered Australian help to India, which I assume will involve policing if the offer is accepted. Would India accept that after the Haneef nonsense?

Also, the Indian Prime Minister has blamed neighbouring countries, which probably means Pakistan. Both have nuclear arms.

Does anyone have knowledge of the political situation in India and how that might play out? Pakistan I understand. India is a mystery. What's the Indian domestic response likely to be? Any clues?

I agree with R0bert. To extend the metaphor, we are not getting off the bus because the destination is not quite what we thought it should be. We know exactly what the destination is, we've been there before many many times. We know where it's ending up because Poly's the bus driver, it can't end up anywhere else. Buses follow a set route. Don't turn up in bus and tell me it's a cab.

FOXY and ROMANY

You ask 'why' does Poly persist in all this stuff?

I'm sure I've mentioned why many times.. or.. at least it should be apparent from my posts.

1/ Christians have been wrung out to dry financially..
to the tune of over $500,000 by a conspiratorial
and vexatious legal action by a stacked (so called)
Equal Opportunity Commission, (which employed
a person, May Helou who was ALSO on the Islamic
Council of Vic) by the representative body of
Victorian Muslims.

2/ The History of Islam shows clearly how it's
expansion is based on it's ideas. The content
of Surah 9 being of particular importance.
It was used in MOhammad's day, by his followers
after his death, and is affirmed toDAY (Literally)
by passionate Muslims who I will meet later
today at the Mind Body Spirit festival in
Melbourne; to justify expansionist actions
against non Muslims.

3/ We have a group of Muslims in RMIT seeking to Islamize the place with an exclusive mosque (which specifically excludes non Muslims) on State land. We have this same theme occurring at Monash, Melbourne Uni, Latrobe Uni.

4/ But ultimately, I seek to raise awareness about the IDEAS driving all this. There is little point in attacking just the symptom.. if you have a chronic headache, panadol will not fix the brain tuma causing it.

THE WAR OF IDEAS. Our mandate as Christians,
is to tear down the strongholds of falsehood
by spiritual weapons.. or.. non carnal weapons.
By argument, discussion, persuasion, exhortation,
interaction etc etc. This is exactly the same as
a political party seeking to advance it's ideas,
except we ought not to sink to the depths of
deception that many political organizations do.
Let the argument stand or fall on the facts.

Don't attack me.. attack the idea or facts behind
the posture. If anyone has a persuasive argument
against the facts.. it will succeed.
Thinking people know when an 'argument' is
addressed and when a person is simply
attacked because the attacker does not like their argument :)

look at how somehow
they found and killed the head of security,
and were landed by boat apparently[very james bond-ish]

it is reported that they specificlly soughtout british and americans?
to get obama/usa involved?
and the britts?

see how this is well coordinated

it is even reported they took over police vehicles[lateline reported]
the thing smells[the 'timming' is selected VERY CAREFULLY ;the day the gobbler gets its pardon from the war president

who;s 'independance day' is this serving

this thing smells like high [low] hell

lest we forget that many suicide bombers have been proved to be either retarded or under threat to kill thier families if they dont

only one SMALL group has claimed responsability

small groups are notoriously easy to take over by security agencies
[recall the 'extreemist group 'raided in the 70's ,it turned out EVERY member was a member of one security agency [or the next]

thing is this is a planned attack on india [and tourist income
even the extra bit of one israelie,NOT ALL[is like having a token 'black on the books]its like money in the bank; a credited]

[israel attacked thus clearly[lol] it must be arabs.

its just too clever by far ,too well organised

even the post that initiated this topic seems so well thunk out,
im told look at the timming [and the times]

if obama can be turned into a nervouse busche [war pres]
then the war mongers recieve a great payoff
[think who has the most to gain from that?]

anyhow as the media tells us 'the game is in play'
be watching for the double play

the more guilty the arabs look
all the better to suit non arab special op's intrest

Yep. Looks like I was right.

>>This, as we all know, is Boaz-speak for "let's use the terrorists' murder of innocent bystanders as an excuse to dig out bloody surah bloody nine and use it to prove that we are all in imminent danger of being murdered in our beds." Let's just see if I'm right, shall we?<<

Not that it is at all difficult where Boaz is concerned.

Your bleatings are entirely predictable, Boaz, as the many comments here must have reminded you.

>>Wow... so many questions.. so many creative angles on the subject.. or is it angles on 'me'<<

The reason you are the topic, Boaz, is because you insist upon it. You are pathologically unable to look at an issue from an objective standpoint.

And that's the positive part.

The negative is that you are pathologically unable to pass up an opportunity, however tangential, to further your whack-a-mozzie agenda.

This has the effect of obliterating, ahead of any real discussion, any chance to discuss a topic rationally and openly. Instead, we all find ourselves addressing your fear and loathing. Which of course is all a boost to your "lookitme lookitme" ego, but very frustrating for the rest of us.

>>Don't attack me.. attack the idea or facts behind the posture.<<

This, in the context of your last post (about Muslims in RMIT) illuminates precisely what I am talking about.

You had no intention of discussing Mumbai.

You merely wanted another excuse to get up onto your bully-pulpit.

For shame.

alex jones
is on replay AGAIN only his page seems to be uptodate
http://www.prisonplanet.com/#

India, Corporate Media Moves To Frame Pakistan For Suspicious Attacks

http://www.prisonplanet.com/as-predicted-india-links-mumbai-attacks-with-pakistan.html

As we predicted would happen in our early report yesterday,Indian government authorities are now blaming Pakistan for being behind the ongoing attacks in Mumbai,
providing a perfect pretext for expanded U.S. military aggression against a country that is also a target for President elect Barack Obama.

Sophisticated Attacks, but Al Qaeda Link Disputed
http://www.prisonplanet.com/sophisticated-attacks-but-al-qaeda-link-disputed.html

A day after the terror assaults in Mumbai that killed over 100 people,one question remained as impenetrable as the smoke that still billowed from two of the city’s landmark hotels:who carried out the attacks?



Mumbai attacks: Jumble of tactics and targets seems to indicate a homegrown Indian outfit
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mumbai-attacks-jumble-of-tactics-and-targets-seems-to-indicate-a-homegrown-indian-outfit.html

The style of the attack –more a mass guerrilla assault on a series of soft-targets in a major city than the standard spectacular blasts that we have come to associate with those strikes linked closely to the al-Qaida hardcore –

makes it that much more difficult to decipher.


Citizen journalists told to stop using Twitter to update on Bombay attacks
http://www.prisonplanet.com/citizen-journalists-told-to-stop-using-twitter-to-update-on-bombay-attacks.html

News on the Bombay attacks is breaking fast on Twitter with hundreds of people using the site to update others with first-hand accounts of the carnage.



FM: No Israelis in Mumbai Hospitals
http://www.prisonplanet.com/fm-no-israelis-in-mumbai-hospitals.html

Foreign Ministry Spokesman Yossi Levi said, mid-morning Thursday, that according to the data received by Israel’s control center for the Mombai terrorist attacks there are no Israelis among the wounded or dead in Mombai hospitals.



Mumbai Attacks Blamed On Al-Qaeda As Pretext For U.S. Military Response
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mumbai-attacks-blamed-on-al-qaeda-as-pretext-for-us-military-response.html

The majority of the corporate media has gleefully seized upon the terror attacks in Mumbai to claim that they are the work of“Al-Qaeda,”
despite clear and contradictory evidence suggesting otherwise, as a pretext to increase bombing campaigns in Pakistan and beef support for the ailing war on terror in Afghanistan.

and alex jones show is a re run?
of the pre election willie nelson intervieuw?

yeah right

big people are making big moves

how dumb our leader think we are?

Now there's a set of info worth having. Thanks OUG.

The Twitter article is intriguing. On one hand Twitterers are providing an info service for authorities and families, on the other, they're interfering with the authorities' ability to tell the story the way they want it told.

No wonder the government wants to control the internet. You can't control the message if you can't control the medium.

If it was supposed to be a pretext for Obama to invade Pakistan they got the timing wrong. Bush is the president, not Obama. And with all the Twitterning going on it would be harder to shift the blame, as Bush did using 9/11 as a pretext for invading Iraq.

Foxy and Pelican,
One of the problems I see is that people keep playing the terrorists actions down by saying it is only a few nutters or radicals.

I think it is far more than that and we have a situation where there are many attacks and only the biggest get much media coverage. Like deaths from car accidents have become so commonplace that they are hardly reported anymore and people become immune to the horror.

Consider this. Since 9/11 there have been 12313 ATTACKS. Not deaths but ATTACKS

For the month of October 2008 there were 174 attacks in 16 countries
This resulted in 832 people dead and 1412 injured.

If you do the maths on a per annum basis or even on a daily basis, to my mind that is considerable and not just a few.

For the week from 15 Nov to 21 Nov there were 38 attacks which killed 146 and injured 222.

I do not know what the answer to this is and I do not want to alarm anyone but i think we should be aware of the scale of the problem.

Something for us all to contemplate.

Banjo,
Where did you get your statistics ?

Sams, I agree that, in the past, christians were as gulty as muslims for terror but my statement was for 'ongoing terror' as in who are today's 'bad guys'.

As for invading Iraq, we all know that the WMD excuse was a fit-up but the 9/11 attacks started the ball rolling. ie they brought it on themselves.

Again I agree with you in that all religion is dangerous but some are more dangerous than others.

Education is not the answer or why would qualified doctors feature amongst some failed suicide-bombers (think Glasgow Airport)?

It has been suggested that, if this were a post by anyone other than BD, we would be able to discuss it productively. Yes, at times he posts a thread which ostensibly looks as though it would provide a good natter. But, knowing his mind-set so well by now, of course it never does.

For a couple of years I managed completely to ignore this nuisance by never reading his posts or replying to him. But even that didn't work eventually as I would catch the name Romany in one of his posts and simply have to read it! (yeah, yeah, I'm a very weak woman).

However, perhaps if we, in concert, ignored him for a while and simply went on posting around and in spite of him, this forum would stop being The Boaz/Polycarp Daily Repetition Board and give others a chance? I know from previous posts that I'm not the only one who resents the tendency of this entire forum to revolve around one person's paranoia. Though I suspect there are people who are kinda hooked on the interactions.

BTW, although we don't get the ceaseless flow of speculation and coverage here, we do get many serious discussions with Indian representatives, politicians etc. To date, shorn of speculation and opinions from Western commentators, the messge we are getting is: No-one is ready yet to name, definitively, the perpetrators. The reason that has been given for the action is that Western interference - especially American and British - with domestic problems is resented, hence the targeting of American and British nationals. Take that with whatever grain of salt you wish, but that is the message being sent by India to the one third of the world who live here.

PS. BD - I AM a writer. Please try to keep up.

Austin, "As for invading Iraq, we all know that the WMD excuse was a fit-up but the 9/11 attacks started the ball rolling. ie they brought it on themselves"

Do we then ignore the history from both sides which preceeded 9/11? There had been previous attacks on the other by both sides. Clinton ordered a missile strike against Osama during his presidency (1998) http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2006/osama_bin_missing_whos_tried_hardest_to.html
http://www.snopes.com/rumors/clinton.asp

Some of the atrocities by terrorists are discussed in the second document.

9/11 was an escalation of a conflict which had been occuring over a much longer period. A very ugly escalation but not the starting point.

R0bert

Dear Romany,

I'm with you on this one.

I've tried many, many times to get to
the bottom of the 'why?' behind all
of Polycarp's actions. And you're
right - he conveniently forgets all the
previous posts, discussions, and
explanations, given to his threads by
so many of us in the past. All he remembers
is his single-minded one-track stance, and
it never ever varies.

It is time that we simply en masse, stopped
responding to any of his threads

That's not a bad idea, Foxy.

>>It is time that we simply en masse, stopped responding to any of his threads<<

I had a quick look back over the number of times he has backed out of a discussion when he found himself completely out of his depth, only to reappear, like a weed after a rainstorm, as if nothing had happened.

The thought of him being allowed free rein to vent his fear and loathing, together with his constant repetition of wild assertions as to the authenticity of this and the vileness of that, in an unpleasant one.

But I'll try.

Mind you, I'm going to have to take it one day at a time...

Dear Pericles,

You've persevered so patiently in the past.

I'm just finding it a bit much to stomach
at the moment.

That's all.

what i like about olo is we can all have our say freely
even if your[ok i am]not as literate as i should be
i have a lot of time for those who call me their enemy

i will try to explain why
its the yes man syndrome

it is far easier to let a 'friend' slide one past the batsman
than an enemy

we respond vigerously to our percieved enemy
enjoying [perhaps]the brutal thrust of release

it is with this in mind i post my responses
hoping that we can arrive at a concensus peacefully

this nesitates us being able to be honest with each other

to be honest i heard it first here
i straight away 'saw' a submarine[letting off commandoes in a rubber duckie

[then seeing the rubber duckie in the midday news

ok its no proof it was THE marines
doing this comando raid

[but they clesarly were schooled in comando tactic's[perhaps even being trained to get off the transporter into the boat etc]

then i saw the visualising of a muslim[i will call mahamud]
now mahamud said lets use cammels
osama said
hey lets just get a taxi[or steal a car]

then dikkk chimes in hey we got that russion sub

we can train the latest batch of young-uns to do the red flag

well a few things are clearlty speculation
but hey why didnt they use helicopter's

what palistein[sorry paskistan;
[them arabs all look the same[quiet dikkk in writing]

anyhow pakistan got NUKES
but no hell-i-cop-ters
/DUH

COME ON

this was a black swan event
so lets beef up the security industry

a cop at every corner issueing speed fines

more cameras ,more drug sniffer dogs[clearly bomb sniffing dogs wouldnt have smelled the machine gunns[and gren-aides]

it is sad when anyone dies

that fools still believe in winnable wars
is the height of absurdity

that we negotiate with terrorists is bad
but not talking to them is worse

comeon gang we are in this together

i dont have so many peers
that i can afford to lose a single one

>>It is time that we simply en masse, stopped
responding to any of his threads<<

In this case he brought up a very interesting and timely topic. I'd argue that it's possible to respond to the topic without responding to the author.

To poly/boaz

Many before me have pointed out that this "analysis" of your is just another in your pantheon of personal attacks on one of your preferred topics.

In your opening post not once did you express sympathy to the people killed by this appalling example of religious fervour.

Over 120 people killed, the majority of them local Indian people - where is your empathy?

Your credibility continues to languish; you are not ever to be taken seriously - this is my first and last comment on this thread.

from
http://www.infowars.com/

Evidence Mumbai Attackers were Anglo-American Intel Operatives
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6222

Kurt Nimmo | Supposed Indian Muslim terrorists had fair skin and drank alcohol, according to firsthand accounts.



Mumbai Attacks Blamed On Al-Qaeda As Pretext For U.S. Military Response
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6212

Paul Joseph Watson | Despite clear and contradictory evidence to suggest otherwise, corporate media brings out the boogeyman once again as a poster child for the ailing war on terror, Pakistan link claimed.

Experts doubt Al Qaeda link in Mumbai attacks
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6213

International Herald Tribune | The style of the attacks and the targets in Mumbai suggested that the militants were likely to be Indian Muslims and not linked to Al Qaeda or Lashkar-e-Taiba.


Israel Warned Not to Attack Iran Until Obama Takes Office
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6179
Time | Israeli military officials had hinted to the media that if Israel were to carry out its threats to strike at Iranian nuclear installations,
it might do so before Barack Obama enters the White House in January.

Tehran: West Responsible for Terror Attack in Iran
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6171

Press TV | Three men accused of carrying out a fatal bombing in a mosque in Iran have confessed to being brainwashed by a Western terrorist cell.

‘Israeli Air Force is ready to attack Iran’
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6078

Press TV | Israeli Air Force Commander General Ido Nehushtan claims his forces are ready to follow any order to thwart Iran’s nuclear programs.

Fractelle

The killings indeed are appalling but certainly not unexpected by those who are not blinded from the ideology behind Islam. Secularist who kill the unborn are the only ones I know who commit more violence than Islam.

Runner,
"Secularist who kill the unborn are the only ones I know who commit more violence than Islam."

After they're born it's the Sectarians who have no problem killing them and it's actually the Christians who hold that unenviable historical record of killing the innocent.

<<1/ Have the Britons and Americans attacked anyone in Mumbai?>>

Well, I think you'll find the British have racked up a bit of Indian blood over the years.

Not that it's got anything to do with this, of course. Just wanted to point out it was a dumb question.

Hi Veronika
actually it's not a dumb question.

The point though, which should not be missed, is that the mindset which wants to reclaim all previously Muslim ruled or.. Muslim inhabited land, is very much a part of the more serious Islamic thinking.

Pericles (and gang). Your silly infantile claim that I am 'out of my depth' is ludicrous. Coming from one who does not know one end of Surah 9 from the other.. you are just demonstrating your complete ignorance. How can you say I'm out of my depth when you don't even understand the basis of the position I take?

TOPIC. Any analaysis of the Mumbai events must consider many aspects.

Thus far we still have very limited information.

The only 'factual' nature of the following, thus far, is that it is 'a report.'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/nov/28/british-terrorists-mumbai

"Vilasrao Deshmukh, the chief minister of Mumbai, was reported to have said that two British-born Pakistanis were among eight gunmen seized by Indian commandos who stormed buildings to free hostages."

The Foreign Office said it was investigating reports on NDTV, a local television news channel, that the terrorists – who swarmed into luxury hotels and other tourist sites in the city – included "British citizens of Pakistani origin".

Leftist sites (predictably) have found that blonde haired people who drink alchohol could not be Muslims. Dream on. Nope..that means they were "British/CIA operatives". Evidence? :) "blonde hair/drank booze"

The mind boggles.

Brown playing down the reported Brit connection is hilariously predictable. Millibrand is a fool.. a complete idiot, just saying what he needs to say to gain localized political gain.. probably says the opposite in other places.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkAiT_BRwYc

Goto 1.50 and listen....then read Surah 9:29 and 30 and see if what he says is true. It isn't..he lied outright.

"Islam is an enemy of no-one and a friend to all"

You have to be more than stupid.. ignorant.. in total denial to not see this, you have to be psychologically unbalanced.

'Fight'...means 'pat on the head' ..right? :) duh.

your hatred has blinded you
roly/poly/holy/carper

your hanging your confusion on the word fight[as in resist evil]
even if that evil is only in your own mind

it begins by explaining why the promises of man are not binding upon god NOR his apostle

[please explain why they should be][a retoricle question your clearly blinded by your own hate]thus deaf to anything not confirming your insane ravings[re sura 9]

read[9;3]IF YOU REPENT
ALL WILL BE WELL WITH YOU,but if you give no heed
KNOW you will not escape
HIS judgment

if an idolater seeks assylum with you

GIVE HIM PROTECTION
so he may HEAR the word of allah
AND THEN convey him to SAFETY
[for idolaters are ignorant men

the boood thirsty savages[LOL]

[seems xtians believe much the same judment type belief]

or''so long as they keep faith with you
# KEEP FAITH IN THEM''

wonder why the messenger calls the sura repentance?

it should be called'leave the revenge thing to god'
or'who are you to judge another'

try to find a torah some time

it has in it the right to molest any child under a certain age
mate if you live in glass houses dont be throwing stones

you are mindless yet fail to realise it

by mindless i mean
you have stopped thinking

your fixated ON SOME LINES
or rather[INTERPRITATIONS OF REMEMBERED LINES]

[MAHANOUD DIDT write THE WORDS[THEY WERE ONLY MEMORISED]
till they were gathered in time into a collection
then translation into a book

grow up son

you
cant force the world to repent
nor call it to acount

but can chose to repent yourself;account for your own deceptions

only YOU can chose for YOU

IS the'torah'is so hard to find
because the quotes i have come across of it are discusting?

its the only'holy'text i cant find
surly in this is a sign for the thinking man

let ye without sin not cast the first stone eh?
leave it to god to judge others

you should perhaps read the whole book
before you judge YOURSELF better than its followers

Romany
I laughed at your colourful images. Yes I think you have a good point - I too have resisted posting to these sorts of race/religious hate threads but there is something about bashing those keys to get out a retort to Boazy's usual nonsense. But alas it takes a reasonable level of self-awareness to be able to question and look at a situation rationally without the strong dogma that dictates to Boazy. We will just have to accept him for who he is.

Boaz
You ask me not to be a hypocrite when talking about hatred and then you proceed to use the Mafia as an example of religious belief or as a parallel. Your mind knows no bounds. There are many religions who have fostered violence including Christianity in the push to convert the world. I know you like to ignore this similarly to acts by the West against other nations without due cause. It surprises me that your faith assumes humans to be intrinsically bad (hence needing God's hand) yet you are blind when those same humans might perpetrate violence on another both economically and physically.

I don't think there is any point arguing with you. You never respond to the deeper questions posed to you which suggest you don't look beyond your own blind faith or question whether your entrenched view might actually be wrong.

Romany is right I think I might save myself for other more worthy debates.

The word "analysis" in this thread title is something of a misnomer, isn't it?

Veronika writes
'The word "analysis" in this thread title is something of a misnomer, isn't it?

I would say the word 'denial' is far more appropriate. It is not surprising that we have so many secularist defending the 'religion of peace' when they deny the corruption in their own heart. Secularism is certainly full of blind dogmas. You can only laugh when they accuse others of dogmas.

runner
How is secularism affecting your life? Secularists are not forcing you to have an abortion nor are they forcing you act against your own beliefs. They are not dictating to you to do anything that you do not believe in.

Would you rather a dictatorship where only one narrow view of the world was allowed. A nation of only one religion that dictates to you what you should believe and risk punishment if you deter.

Or would you rather live in a nation that accepts that people are different and free to worship as they see fit (assuming no laws are broken of course).

Runner: "I would say the word 'denial' is far more appropriate."

I agree. Can you tell Polycarp to change it? He listens to you.

Oh Dear, This whole discussion shows how pointless the attitude to
Islam both pro and anti is and yet while I think everyone realises
that not all moslems advocate terrorism, it seems there is no point
in trying to decide who are the terrorists.
Many of the rest give passive support or at minimum see no evil.

Why should we bother, just remove them all and not allow more to come.
How do we handle those that were born here ?
I don't know but if they are unhappy pay them off and give them an airline ticket.

They seem to be the most incompatible migrants that we have ever had.

Pelican Romany Foxy et al

I try to avoid being sucked into discussion as morally, perverted religiosity, intellectually moribund as in Polycarp’s concerto “Rondo in fear minor” played on his rubber band.
i.e. All topics he responds to or creates have one purpose. I am often reminded of the bard’s epithet “me thinks he protesteth too much”.
I feel for his fear and apparent sense of “lack of control” in his life. Beyond that I would be intruding into his privacy which I abhor.

We should all remember that any contact or our words etc are windows into our personalities, problems etc. at a subliminal level, much like body language. The more obsessed we appear the clearer that window vision becomes and more the subject becomes the individual rather that the faux issue. This is stock and trade for any crisis councillor.

Back on topic It is sad that so many commenters project their own irrational out of perspective fears as analysis of what is indeed a tragic event.

Ludwig has yet again attempted to add rationality into the debate. Yet to little avail.

I must admit that PC’s defence of Koresh based on what he was trying to do is both superficial and disquieting. A bit like defending Eugenics

This thread has gone way off topic and has become nasty: a moderator should shut it down.

Exammy.... I don't know where you get 'defending' David Koresh from?

I don't defend him for a moment. He was a crazy cult leader.

Any Analysis of the Mumbai attacks needs to be based on much fuller information. I've been hoping more would come out by now, but it's still early days and with only one surviving militant.. it might be some time before the Indian authorities 'coax' information out of him.

HERE'S WHAT WE KNOW.

1/ Some Militant terrorists have attacked the financial hub of Mumbai, murdering over 170 people and wounding countless others.

2/ Those terrorists were clearly ready to die for their cause.

3/ We have speculation about '2 British born of pakistani origin'

4/ Westerners (British and American) were targeted and killed.

5/ Defense experts estimate that at least 100 people were needed to support such an operation on the ground.

6/ The militants targeted a Jewish centre, killing a Rabbi.

Based on the above. It is unlikely that the perpetrators were maoists.
The operation has the hallmarks of Al Qaeda (suicide/Anti Western/Anti Jewish)

Only time will fill in the gaps.

If point 3 turns out to be true, then my initial post about the 'ideas' driving the operation is where the discussion should be focusing for answers.

what do we have so far
22 foreigers were killed
not including the 8 landed by rubber duckie?
or the 7 waiting for them

all terrosist but one dead
dead terrorists is 9

but clearly the numbers of terorists are at;least 15
[not a hundred]
why dont the numbers add up?

by far the biggest murder death toll was a railway station
where indians were machine gunned en mass[to get the numbers up]

as hotels were targeted[and not the stock exchange]
i see no attack as such on the finantial'center'

as for the jewish'center'
[the planned?timing
seems to have gone astray]

sadly a rabbi and his wife were murdered

and at least two terrorists were killed with them
it is not reported if the terroist or the resque killed them,

pakistan deneys it set this up

[and to accuse your neighbour of setting this entrain isnt helpfull]
reported was[an indian minester]accusing pakistan

#when clearly the facts arnt in

this reveals either a bias,a fear or a hate but not a fact

the british link[british born]
means at least two CAME FROM BRITON[not pakistan]

based on the abouve
it is clear there is a red flag operating

the issuie having all the hall marks
[of a suprise attack and media spin]
and a rampant blogger sphere accusing pakistan

time will not fill the facts
it will muddy the waters

if point 6 is true it dosnt fit in with the other murders[as being'well planned']
apparently the attackers even missed getting the nanny and a child

#but i guess it was important to the play
to have a clear israelie victim[as excuse to attack iran

[will that be called an act of terror[or an act of war?]

any death blasphemes god

murderors come in many shapes and sizes
all religions and of many beliefs

why media ,finance ,science ,film ,game shows music,transport , strock marketeering, art ,law ,govt ,lobby , banking ,security industries are so controlled by just one in particular

noting during war time[ww1/ww2]
the financial centers are never attacked
that makes this one a black swan

im now getting my facts from the sunday mail
front page[row;ling has another best seller A NEW BOOK]

kids feature on the front page;utilate toy guide[rawlings
and in the header'love the kids'

46 hours of hell
''teror hostage''
[he wasnt held hostage[he decided to stay put?]

his name dont ring any bells?
david jacobs

but go to page 4
david jacob[lawyer]
two security EXPERTS?
bravery humour,grace,telivision/raio intervieuws

[and 3 pages of the news paper so far[he must be palistinian going by his dark hue and nose and narrow eyes[who's company hires security analists that specialise in hostage situations]

page 5 reveals the emails[or rather an extract]

im sure security will note the times[as well as note EVERY comunication in and arround the'hostage'sites]

killers are british page 9
2 australians confirmed dead
[from other sources i hear 2yanks,2israelies and one brit]

hardly targeting and holding hostage
[in the real,non spin of the word]

helpfully we have in the center page
the way to know who thse murderors will likely be
next time

[ie their BATTLE fatiques are jeans,t-shirts and trainers
['trainers';a subliminal reminder of al Cia-da][duh?]
the terrorists dont wear suits
thus target kids

thus pick on the young hot heads wearing jeans[genes?]
and a blackberry[mobile phones]

the article informs is the new BREED of terrorist
-using'EVERYDAY'teqnology as a weopen of war

like phone detonation is a'new'thing
not that the phones detinated

regardless phone records
and closed circut vision will explain more

noting our white
isnt the same as indian'white'

calling indians'white'is admiting them as'higher-cast'.

this redflag play
has an interesting cast of charictors
#most on the lighter shade of pale

likely carrying a 'maritious id card,
carrying chinese grenaides....
7 credit caRDS[FROM DIFFERENT BANKS]
DRY RATIONS AND THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS IN CASH

[SO CLEARLY THEY WERE SOLD ON A PROMISE TO GET AWAY]
how could they swallow that?
being welcomed by the police chief?
under orders to teminate him?

who KNOWS

doing the numbers 6 of them did get away

who are they?

I'll pre-empt comments that this post may be seen as off-topic at the outset by admitting that it may seem so. But it does have a bearing on the way people percieve the subject of the Indian attack.

Earlier on I outlined how the incident was reported here: i.e. some factual interviews with members of the Indian government and police ( which included brief outlines of the Indian history of unrest), and the fact that, as yet no-one had claimed responsibility. Resentment of British and American incursions into (what is considered) domestic problems being universally resented in Asia, this was accepted without question as the reason Americans and Brits. were targeted.

We have not been treated to public speculation by: journalists; someone who once lived in India; someone who once worked in Pakistan; Anti-muslims; people who are paid to give opinions in journals or magazines; church leaders; the ubiquitous person-in-the-street, representatives of the military or, in fact, anyone at all. Of course various blog-sites and groups have talked about it.

This incident does not scream at anyone from newspaper headlines because other incidents both at home and abroad, have happened in the interim. Without speculation to feed it, the incident itself becomes one of the many iniquities happening all over the world.

It could be opined that this is the "the party line" (whatever that is is 2008), or that the very absence of speculation is propagandising.

But couldn't one also build the case that this highlights the way in which the West propagandizes through media speculation, artificial build-up of non-news, encouraging public speculation, division, and pandering to the fears of the easily panicked?

You think?

Too true Romany. The crazier parts of the American media were spruiking it as deliberately planned to coincide with Thanksgiving and therefore an attack on the American way of life. As such, it was interpreted as a clear signal for Obama to invade Pakistan at the earliest opportunity. Nuts.

As OUG points out (or at least I think this is what s/he's saying), nobody knows the precise details and by the time they filter through they will have been through the spin cycles of several political entitites.

On the red flag business, if I understand the red flag thing right, it's obviously got some of the nuttier bulls ready for stampede, but I predict it won't have desired effect.

People are more worried about their wallets than India.
It's India, and it's so complicated nobody, including Indians, try to understand it.
It's not white country so who cares?
In Australia, Julie Bishop will be the story of the week next week, maybe even next fortnight.
Bush has sent the FBI, not the military, so it can't be all that bad, right?
The disruption to the cricket season will be more meaningful here, in India, and in Pakistan. The ICC and BCCI could sort this out way faster than all the military and police power in the world.

You want to find out who the perpetrators were and bring them to justice, foil any future terrorist attacks in the region, and ensure this never happens again? Point out to the Indian and Pakistani population, Muslim, Hindu and Christian, that they stuffed the cricket. The thing would be sorted in a week. Tops.

Just read your links, RObert.

It would appear to anyone reading them that Clinton's attack of 1998 was in retaliation to the first four attacks on the USA as detailed in http://www.snopes.com/rumors/clinton.asp, the link that you provided.

So, basically, your information supports my viewpoint. i.e. they brought it on themselves.

Indeed, 9/11 was not the starting point but it was the major catalyst for the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq.

Austin "Clinton's attack of 1998 was in retaliation to the first four attacks on the USA " - and what were those attacks in retaliation for? When you've worked out that then check what those incidents were a retaliation for and keep going till you run out of initial incidents. Who started this? Can we really relate the initial in

The problem when we try and exclusively blame one side of a conflict like this is that when you dig a little deeper there will be something else behind it. We then have to make judgement calls about the validity of a response to provocation. It's rarely clean cut and clearly is not in this case.

R0bert

extra links here
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=8240#128796

some more updates

Mumbai attacks‘were a ploy to wreck Obama plan to isolate al-Qaeda’
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mumbai-attacks-%e2%80%98were-a-ploy-to-wreck-obama-plan-to-isolate-al-qaeda%e2%80%99.html

The carnage may have been an attempt to put Pakistan and India at each other’s throats and kill US hopes for the region.


Mumbai attacks - city fears five terrorists are‘missing’
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mumbai-attacks-city-fears-five-terrorists-are-missing.html

At least five terrorist gunmen have evaded capture in Mumbai and could make a secondary strike on India’s financial capital,it was feared today.

Ministers offer to quit over Mumbai attacks
http://www.prisonplanet.com/ministers-offer-to-quit-over-mumbai-attacks.html

A second top Indian politician offered to resign on Monday as the Indian government came under intense pressure over its handling of the Mumbai attacks, which claimed at least 192 lives in a rampage by a team of well-organised terrorists.

CIA Foreknowledge of the Mumbai Attacks
http://www.prisonplanet.com/cia-foreknowledge-of-the-mumbai-attacks.html
Yesterday, Outlookindia.com reported that the CIA’s station chief in Delhi approached one of India’s intelligence agencies,the Research and Analysis Wing,

and passed on a fairly specific warning.

Mumbai attacks part of ‘blowback’ for CIA double-cross
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mumbai-attacks-part-of-%e2%80%98blowback%e2%80%99-for-cia-double-cross.html

The violence that is sweeping Mumbai’s tourist and business areas is the work of rival Hindu nationalist terrorists and Muslim gangs, according to WMR’s Asian intelligence sources

Mossad role in Turkey coup plot revealed
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mossad-role-in-turkey-coup-plot-revealed.html
Israel’s national intelligence agency Mossad has been behind a failed coup in Turkey,the Turkish daily newspaper,Milliyet reports.

Massacre in Mumbai: Militants ‘could drive nuclear-armed India to brink of war with Pakistan’
http://www.prisonplanet.com/massacre-in-mumbai-militants-could-drive-nuclear-armed-india-to-brink-of-war-with-pakistan.html

Pakistan President Asif Ali Zardari has appealed to India not to punish his country for last week’s attacks, saying militants could precipitate a regional war.

#related

Anti-terror laws used to snoop on nursery suspected of selling pot plants unlawfully
http://www.prisonplanet.com/anti-terror-laws-used-to-snoop-on-nursery-suspected-of-selling-pot-plants-unlawfully.html
A council used controversial anti-terror powers to spy on a nursery suspected of selling pot plants unlawfully, it has emerged.

Commons Backlash After MP Arrest
http://www.prisonplanet.com/commons-backlash-after-mp-arrest.html
Commons Speaker Michael Martin is under pressure to explain why police were allowed to raid the parliamentary office of Tory frontbencher Damian Green.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/welcome-to-soviet-britain-the-labour-heartlands-where-figures-reveal-that-half-the-population-relies-on-the-state-for-a-job.html

Labour’s public sector spending has created a wave of ‘Soviet’ boroughs where around half the population depends on the state for work, figures revealed yesterday.

RObert, 'Clinton's attack of 1998 was in retaliation to the first four attacks on the USA ' The links that you yourself supplied directly inferred this conclusion.

'and what were those attacks in retaliation for'. What's your view on this? Have you worked it out but don't want to tell? Your link started with the muslim attacks. It didn't stste any predeeding causes. How far back do you want to go? The Jewish resettlement after part two of the War? Further? The Crusades?
Before the extremists came to the forefront, most of the Arab world was on friendly or, at least, neutral terms with the West. Or at least they gave that impression while possibly they were scheming behind our backs.

the results are emerging
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=VGDmQdzUTlE
the first part [but check out part two for the next stage]

also just before it was a expose on gmo /infertility

but the vidio reveals it is the same mob that killed ghandi
[for the same reason [ghandi] wanted to talk with the muslims too]
and neo con hindi' s didnt

same old same old
[after iraq then pakistan]
but the neo cons need a world war[be it not this attack [then iraq
failing that they will interfere with europes gas supply from russia hoping to suck russia into their needed world war

its time to see that the neo con dont want peace
they want armogeddon[that all life die]
and certainly not pakies talking with indies

its discusting but they arnt like us [neo cons] they are so fearfull they just need us to be in more fear[fear no evil]

cheers
there is nothing hiden that will not be revealed

[remember we are spirits having an incarnate life experience
all others are our br-others]one living loving god whose light sustains life[that life live to love][love neighb-our [love god]

Arrest Provides More Evidence India, Israel, and the U.S. Behind Mumbai Attacks

It is becoming increasingly a hard sell to pin the blame for the Mumbai attacks on Pakistan and thus set the stage for an attack on Pakistan after Barack Obama enters the White House in a few weeks. It now appears Indian intelligence played a large part in the terrorist attacks.
http://www.prisonplanet.com/arrest-provides-more-evidence-india-israel-and-the-us-behind-mumbai-attacks.html

Pak on track to being named terrorist state
http://www.prisonplanet.com/pak-on-track-to-being-named-terrorist-state.html
The United States is dusting off a long-discarded proposal to declare Pakistan a state sponsor of terrorism.

Pak extends ‘war exercise’ along border
http://www.prisonplanet.com/pak-extends-war-exercise-along-border.html
Intensifying its activities along the Indian border, Pakistan has extended its war exercise “Zarab Alwar”. The Pakistan army’s move comes close on the heels of Mumbai terror attack.



Pakistan feared Indian attack after Mumbai: report
http://www.prisonplanet.com/pakistan-feared-indian-attack-after-mumbai-report.html
Pakistan feared India was planning a military strike amid heightened tensions between the two nuclear powers following the Mumbai attacks, Pakistan’s high commissioner to London told the BBC Saturday.



McCain warns Pakistan of Indian air strikes
http://www.prisonplanet.com/mccain-warns-pakistan-of-indian-air-strikes.html
United States Senator John McCain has said there is enough evidence of the involvement of former Inter-Services Intelligence officers in the planning and execution of the Mumbai attacks.

Man arrested in Mumbai investigation is undercover cop
http://www.prisonplanet.com/man-arrested-in-mumbai-investigation-is-undercover-cop.html

One of the two Indian men arrested for illegally buying mobile phone cards used by the gunmen in the Mumbai attacks was a counterinsurgency police officer who may have been on an undercover mission, security officials said Saturday, demanding
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