Quote *OliveR*
" ... Perhaps, religionists could seek to be treated with SSRIs? These pharmaceutals might inhbit the growth of neural networks, supporting obsessive thinking. ... "

Thanks for qualifying Oli. Of course, SSRI's are only for certain types of depression, and highly not appropriate for others. I of course wanted to point out that agonists/stimulants, are not likely to inhibit growth of neural networks unless perhaps given to kids in high concentrations, but then, my knowledge also is limited in this area.

I haven't seen *WEST* for a long time.
;-)

*RunneR* U just say things to support yr own conclusions. If u read a bit of science, then u would b aware that some things we can measure. Say, the speed of light and thus, we can get a pretty good idea of how far and how long ago something say like a star went nova and turned into a black hole. So, to say, oh, but yr just guessing about these things no different from fanciful interpretations of old scriptures is nonsense.

(No sex makes some people go potty you know?)

And Brother *bOAZy* What's this U say?
" ... After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time, most of whom are still living, ... "

PrayTell Brother *bOAZy* Did he giv the boys a mission? Some guidelines? I'm guessing JC didn't make an appearance just to make wine and party on?

No Dreamy..he gave them the Great Commission:

"GO into all the world, make disciples of all nations, teaching them all that I have commanded you, baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and I am with you to the end of the age"
(Matt 28:19ff)

GENTLE REMINDER.... for all those who consider the Christian faith as a result of human imagination. (say what you like about other faiths..and ur probably right)
The human imagination generally invents things which it perceives as beneficial to this life... good crops.. lots of kids... lots of money...lots of power.

Jesus said:

"If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. 35For whoever wants to save his life[c] will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me and for the gospel will save it. 36What good is it for a man to gain the whole world, yet forfeit his soul?

Does 'THAT' sound like something humans would invent

I know you are again trying to duck the issue Boaz, it's par for the course with you. But I thought just one gentle nudge might be in order.

I asked:

"So the antics of some first-century religious extremists, and their possible fate, shouldn't be too surprising. Incidentally, who were they? And is there any actual evidence that they were 'were WITH JESUS.. during His ministry'? Or is this just hearsay too?"

Can I assume perhaps that you rely on your claim...

>>that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve. After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time, most of whom are still living<<

Still living, Boaz? I somehow doubt that - even Solomon only lasted 950 years.

Who were these people? Where are their stories? Where were they when Jesus "appeared". Was this in the same way as he "appeared" to Saul? Who had difficulty remembering the details, and gave different accounts at different times? Did these five hundred have similar difficulties, perhaps, in recalling events?

Documents are one thing, Boaz. Accurate reporting entirely another.

Incidentally, do you believe that Noah lived for 950 years? And Methuselah even longer?

Ancient documents. Accurate reporting.

Pericles....the evidence is there for your perusal and study.

The extremely long ages of the early patriarchs/identities fits in rather well with many other observations. (Population/City names)

Regarding the reports of those who witnessed the risen Lord.. Paul was the one who related the events, including the bit about 'most of whom are still living'.. i.e. at the time of his writing.

The main problem for you Pericles is the evidence. "Ancient document rule" :)

Hearsay does not apply to such.... rememmmmber?

But if a Jury is convinced of a persons guilt based on their reputation... no amount of evidence to the contrary will persuade them otherwise.. just so for you..

You need to help me out here with a little more explanation, Boaz.

>>The extremely long ages of the early patriarchs/identities fits in rather well with many other observations. (Population/City names)<<

Boaz, there is no archaeological evidence for any man living for anywhere close to that length of time. All available evidence points to lifespans considerably shorter, not longer, than our own.

>>Regarding the reports of those who witnessed the risen Lord.. Paul was the one who related the events, including the bit about 'most of whom are still living'.. i.e. at the time of his writing.<<

And as I pointed out, Paul was even unsure of the circumstances surrounding what was apparently the most important event of his life.

Not a particularly reliable source.

"After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep" 1Cor15:6

What would be surprising to me, and possibly to a jury, about this statement is the lack of corroboration. Where did these people meet, and what was said? Does it not strike you as just a little odd, that an occurrence as apparently momentous as this, doesn't rate the tiniest mention by anyone other than Paul?

Wouldn't one of the five hundred, considering that "the greater part" were still alive to do so, give Paul some idea of what went on? And would it not be natural, given his normally verbose nature on such topics, for Paul to have let slip even one, tiny detail?

>>The main problem for you Pericles is the evidence. "Ancient document rule" Hearsay does not apply to such.... rememmmmber?<<

The ancient document rule, let me remind you, allows a court to accept the legitimacy of a document, given certain physical conditions. It does not, repeat not, speak to the veracity of the document's contents.

A fact that you conveniently, and perpetually, ignore.

>>But if a Jury is convinced of a persons guilt based on their reputation... no amount of evidence to the contrary will persuade them otherwise<<

Not reputation, Boaz.

Credibility.

Hi to all,.

We live in three different worlds. one is real and positive the other 2 are false and negative.

The real world is the universe and all of those beings and things that have no choices. They can only be what they were created and gifted to be by the Creator.

The second world is the man made world which had it's beginnings about 4 to 6,000 years ago. When the first kings appeared who were the gods representatives on earth and they had more power than the priests. The kings and the priestly class ruled without any checks or balances but for the masses they were governed by state laws as well as religious laws.
They were enslaved by laws. The thoughts from this the world was the criteria used by the early doctors of the Christian church law down the irrefutable and unquestionable truths. They are false.

The third world is the one that is locked into our attitudes as that are full of those unquestionable and irrefutable truths. They are imbedded into our language These came down from the man made world in which all of the gods were man made.

Having a spiritual as well as a physical dimension, having a body and a soul, having a thinking feeling heart when it is only a pump need to be challenged as well as the sin /salvation theory is a load of man made garbage dersigned to keep the masses under control. This negative world is the result of all of the violence and destruction that we are experiencing today and it will pnly get worse.

We were created and gifted to live in the first world itt was specifically designed in the minutest detail to support our existence. We will never be happy nor reach any positive potential outside of of the Creator's world.

Doxa