PALEIF, " said three times now I only came to read the last few comments and the title which I assumed the author had researched."

Just in case there is confusion my repeated requests for some evidence that live shipping is involved are directed to Nicki (or anybody else who has that evidence). I'm not hassling you. I've gone into discussions before assuming that the initiator had some proof of the claims made and discussing the issue on that basis later to find that the initial claims were not supported.

I don't think Nicki is trying to mislead but maybe needs to look further into this than the article by Martha Rosenberg article which seems to be at the heart of all the objections to the program. If the Gates were shipping significant numbers of animals to Africa, if there was no program to put infrastucture in place, if there was no work being done on soil replenishment, if african children were as lactose intollerant as african adults adults then I'd take a different view.

Each of those objections seems to have been met (although I don't know how effective the programs will be) so this looks like a great initiative rather than "Bill Gates ill-considered philanthropy; becoming a live exporter".

R0bert

Hi Robert

Nicky is correct. Heifer International have always exported animals to the recipient country though Heifer now appear reluctant to advertise this practice.

More recently, they’ve been flying in stock from South Africa. These animals are then quarantined for several weeks. Heifer Int. also source animals in-country but there remains an arrangement with other charities including the Irish charity (Bothar) too where animals are sourced from Ireland and presented to the recipients in other nations.

http://www.heifer.org/site/c.edJRKQNiFiG/b.3856653/

http://www.heifer.org/site/c.edJRKQNiFiG/b.201779/#

In addition, during the 70s, the Heifer Project International signed an agreement with the Cameroon government and the importation of Jersey cattle, Holstein Friesian cattle and semen started and continues to the present time.

The number of livestock in Africa often exceeds grasslands capacity by half or more. Some 230 million cattle, 246 million sheep and 175 million goats on the continent are supported almost entirely by grazing, The annual loss of rangeland productivity has cost Africa over seven billion dollars.

And yet the West continues to gift live animals to Africa and other developing countries despite the environmental degradation already caused by the huge numbers of livestock.

As a result and most unfortunately, these charities are also promoting intensive farming where the gifted animals spend their lives in huts with metal roofs.

The Heifer organisation is training dairy farmers to practice a zero grazing system with Holstein Friesian cows imported from Ireland since 1994.

Additionally, agricultural scientists are expressing concern due to the risk to Africa's gene diversity by the "innovative" practice to artifically inseminate the Holstein and Jersey cattle with indigenous stock and the disease susceptibility of exotic species:

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=2168113

http://www.catholicireland.net/pages/index.php?nd=47&art=626

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/79724

Heifer Int.et al has its critics too, who view these projects with a degree of skepticism – particularly by the vigorous push into Africa with GM and seed crop technology.

http://africanagriculture.blogspot.com/2007/06/african-green-revolution-aid-project.html

http://community.livejournal.com/yruuer/95588.html

Hi all

Robert, my apologies for not addressing your questions earlier, and Dickie - thanks heaps for the research. Been a little snowed under lately!

Cheers
Nicky

What we've got here is a classic legerdemaine - fleece most of the people for their software and give some of the people a few cows.

No doubt this gives Bill Gates a warm feeling in his pants but it doesn't detract from the fact that he's one of the worlds most successful ever monopolists dressed up in philanthropists clothing.

*Some 230 million cattle, 246 million sheep and 175 million goats on the continent are supported almost entirely by grazing,*

which kind of makes my point, that if the Arabs and their petrodollars
want so source live animals, there are plenty around for them.

The thing that has to be remembered is that if you want to use
high production genetics in Africa, you also need good nutrition,
as the Chinese have found out. Genetics is just one thing. If
the right nutrition is not going in the front, it won't come
out the back either.

*he's one of the worlds most successful ever monopolists dressed up in philanthropists clothing.*

Well his real claim to fame is breaking the Apple monopoly and selling
his software to anyone cheaply. Hundreds of millions bought it.
Today he is also the world's most generous man, giving away more
money then any other person. He's just trying to do it wisely, so
is devoting his time to that. Fact is Frank that without Gates,
you would now not be sitting in front of a dirt cheap computer,
having fun. You clearly like his product, or you would have bought
an Apple at a much higher price.

Yabby
I have been waiting on the others to reply but I will have my two bobs worth.
I dont care how he made his money or how much he is giving away- sorry.
Each and everyone of us have a moral obligation to do something about the terrible animal cruelty in this world.

Can you tell me what he has done in this area- Do you know?

I am not saying he hasnt. I am just saying I dont know.

Perhaps he has given to try to help the bears being milked- I wonder?

Anybody, I mean anybody who thinks its ok to send animals alive off shore to benefit humans is missing something.

Animals are earth bound creatures and should be milked or slaughtered as close to their origen as possible.

We need a Bill of rights presnted to the UN FOR ANIMAL WELFARE.

Another thing and I have seen you post thhis yourself.
We need people with the sense of sensibilty to demand birth control before we give these countries one more thing.

Just being rich and giving money away doesnt make you a god bloke either.
Which reminds me i dont suppose you would know how much Elders give by way of political donations to the Governments to uphold their evil trade - do you?