Hi Romany,

I know that there's many good people outhere doing supportive stuff. But our suicide rate is still high. Doesn't this say that much more needs to be done?

Romany made a good point; why not a public awareness campaign for suicide? At first, I thought this was a good idea too. Then I remembered that awareness is not the problem, since we know it happens. What is is the fact that most people don't care. Whereas if they did, there'd be no problem.

Davidf

*Large magnitude slaughter does not become genocide. Why must you redefine the word?*

Aw really, I was making a point re media hyperbole. Accidents do not equate with slaughter either, do they? However, geno - as a prefix, can mean not only race or tribe but kind. Enough Australians suiciding could therefore be said to lead to the decimation of Australiankind - or the Australian race which would indeed be genocide, yeah?

*Suicide is a voluntary act. One reason not to do it is that the suicide may make others feel bad as his or her passing. However, if one harms no one else, causes sorrow to no one else and does not make a mess I don't see it as a problem.*

Suicide rarely causes sorrow to no-one else. The fact that the majority of suicides are young people means that not only does it *make others feel bad* but can ruin their lives.

Of course if you don't consider it a problem that's your prerogative. However coming into contact with people whose lives are affected by it I, personally, do consider it a problem.

Even if not considered as a problem in itself, wouldn't you at least concede that the fact that Australia has such a high rate of suicide would indicate that there were indeed problems within our society? The fact that significant numbers of young people in Australia prefer to die rather than to live here might also perhaps, give pause for reflection?

Hara - People do care. But its an issue that can't be fixed by something like lowering a speed limit or wearing a helmet. So they feel powerless and some even frightened. Media campaigns concerning mental health have proved effective but campaigns about suicide are very problematic. Raising consciousness is, I think, the first step and many see the mental health campaigns as indeed being the first step in raising this awareness.

ps. For some reason the inverted comma button on my keyboard is inoperable hence the asterisks.

Romany wrote:

"Aw really, I was making a point re media hyperbole. Accidents do not equate with slaughter either, do they? However, geno - as a prefix, can mean not only race or tribe but kind. Enough Australians suiciding could therefore be said to lead to the decimation of Australiankind - or the Australian race which would indeed be genocide, yeah?"

Why make a point through hyperbole? Why not make the point through reasoned argument using accepted meaning of words. It is a misuse of words to describe accidents as slaughter. That does not justify misusing the word, genocide. You use one misuse to justify another misuse.

Genocide is a horrible reality. Raphael Lemkin coined the word due to the Nazi mass murder of Jews, gypsies and others the Nazis considered untermenschen or subhuman because of their ethnicity or religion. It is something which is still going on today. It is a crime under international law. Using it in the way you do to refer to suicide fudges the reality. I find it objectionable.

Romany also wrote:

"Even if not considered as a problem in itself, wouldn't you at least concede that the fact that Australia has such a high rate of suicide would indicate that there were indeed problems within our society? The fact that significant numbers of young people in Australia prefer to die rather than to live here might also perhaps, give pause for reflection?"

Sure, a high rate of suicide like a high rate of alcoholism and other indicators of distress indicate there are problems within our society. That doesn't mean that suicide itself is a problem. It can mean a normal if extreme reaction to a life one finds is not worth living.

Why not try to remedy the problems that drive some people to suicide? For example, some teenage suicides are due to teenagers with uncertain sexuality being harassed. Homophobia is one problem of which suicide is a symptom.

This is relevant:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,,23830799-2702,00.html

$460,000 sounds like just enough to work out how big the problem is.

Kieth -

As I'm sure you can gather from my poster name - I need no reminding of the meaning of the word genocide or the word's genesis.

As I continue to think you missed the point of what I said, and you continue to think I misused a word which you personally find objectionable lets just agree to disagree - and if your sensibilities were offended I apologise.

I don't see why you wish to make such a point out of your idea that suicide is not a problem, especially as we seem to be in agreement that the causes should be addressed.

I posted here a) because this is a field I've been involved in for a long time and b) because someone seemed to be viewing life with a jaundiced eye at the moment.

I just wanted to reassure that person that the world is not uncaring - not to engage in semantic quibbles.

So hey, if you want me to accept that you are right and I am wrong thats o.k.

Just so long as the message gets across that people do care about the issue of mental health and things (albeit perhaps not yet enough things) are being done to address the fact that suicide is a serious issue and more awareness is needed. So o.k., Harambalos - the cavalry might not be ready to charge to the rescue quite yet - but at least the horses are getting saddled!

I really hope it comforts you to know this.