Ever tried to use the word "Gay" in a sentence, without thinking about something other than being happy and joyous?

Lets all be happy, glad and joyous!

That's so gay.

Interesting word, gay.

Through my kids, I have seen its schoolyard usage change several times over the past fifteen years. The only constant has been that schoolkids very rarely use is in a homosexual context...

I think I am correct in saying that its presently accepted meaning is "unacceptable" or "untrendy", as in "Nintendo is so gay" or "I'm not playing footy this term, it's gay"

Also, poofe used to mean a stuffed footstool, while faggots were meat, a type of English rissole (rissole is not a mis-type).

There are a lot of dykes in Holland. In fact, there is a famous story of a boy who stuck his finger in one to stop a flood.

It has been pretty tough on people whose family name is Gay !

AHH yes how things have changed.

I had a friend whos name was Gay

I was in the shop the other day and I over heard a guy ask the check out guy how much it was for a gaytime. It went REAL quiet for a sec, then everyone lost it. The poor bugger was bright red holding on to the icecream.

It was a quieter time of course in those days. People had respect for Gods Word and what He was saying in it. We loved the Queen as kids. And the flag. No one cursed Canberra or state leadership. Not good people. There was mutual respect throughout society. We didnt generally talk much about the homosexual. Or drugs. Or porn. Then the music changed, probably around Elvis/Beatles/Stones time and things went wild. Kennedy got shot, conspiracy theory came to the surface, the world changed, Vietnam came and flower power, drugs became it, the homosexuals used the era to become "gay" in order to justify their behaviour.
I know many christians who believe that satan did the whole corrupting of youth thing through music. Look back at the music of the immediate post-world war2 period and see the changes in the beat from then on. Now its demonic. We lost gay as being joyous through the change of the beat.

Oh sure, things were much better back then Gibo, what with the Korean War and Second World War and young men getting their bits blown off and everything. Or were you referring to before then? The Great Depression, and the rise of Nazism and Communism perhaps? Yes, things were much simpler back then.

Gibo,
I don't share your religous aspect in this however, I agree that it was the Pop noise (music) which gave the unable to think for themselves a voice. In the earlier years it was totally the opposite. It was the intelligent elite who became decadent out of sheer boredom from excess. In the 50's & up to the present it is largely the working class consumers who blindly oblige the marketeers' who make these fools believe that they too can live the high life.
The fundamental difference is that the baby boomers still had some ethics despite their lack of morals in contrast to a great %age of today's youths who have no education, nor morals & even less ethics.
Yes, Bugsy things have been bad in the past but don't fool yourself about the very near future, worse has yet to come & it's not going to be all gay in either sense of the word.

individual and gibo.

It's rather amusing listening to your harsh criticism of the following generation.
I take some comfort from the fact that every generation has disparaged the one following it as unruly and reckless.
Though I must admit, it makes the adage 'respect your elders' much more difficult when in many cases, they're unable to show any respect for the younger subset, instead pining for a utopian past that never really existed outside of their own perception - which is probably shaped by the fact that it was the time when they were young, and thus seemed much more pleasant.

It's also interesting that the older generation loves to criticise the educational standards of the younger ones - however the generations of today are far more aware of what's going on in the world around them.

I suppose the overall fact of the matter is that generations today are harder to manipulate - due to the rise in media avenues, they're far more aware of what's going on in the world around them, and wuite frankly, they won't swallow the same bull that was fed to their forebears.

individual: "The fundamental difference is that the baby boomers still had some ethics despite their lack of morals in contrast to a great %age of today's youths who have no education, nor morals & even less ethics."

Actually, I consider the boomers far less ethical. They're the ones waging war right now. They had free education, and due to the population spike, they've been able to vote for policies that favour them. Soon they'll be aging and the following generations will have to support them in huge numbers.
So I find that statement a bit rich.

As for the 'evils' of pop music... gosh! How dare they express themselves!

Gay still means happy and joyous ... and proud.

There can be no dispute, it is different now.

When I was young I never heard of drugs. I now know that in certain
of the richer circles cocaine was used, but the average person never heard of
drug use.
Music was music and there was no undercurrent in the lyrics.

I can't remember when drug use became common, probably about the time
my children were reaching their teen years, but it was still uncommon to
hear about particular teenagers being into drugs.
It was the subject of TV current affair programs but was not widespread.

Now the cops in Victoria do a random check and come up with 25% on
drugs. Do you still say nothing has changed ? Rubbish !

'It's also interesting that the older generation loves to criticise the educational standards of the younger ones - however the generations of today are far more aware of what's going on in the world around them.'

Not true, show most youngsters an atlas and ask where such and such a country is or what is the capital of so and so and you'll receive a blank look. Ask about the wars that they protest and they can't always tell what started them (apart from the PC anti-western line). But ask for all the meanings of 'gay' and they'll open up.

I don't blame the music, though. A vast amount of it from the 70's to 90's and beyond is excellent.

I dont mind the baby boomers generation being the ones waging war TRTL. Without those wars TRTL the Chinese or the Russians or the Islamics would have been here long ago...chewing on the bones of the present generation. The generation of today is not strong. They have been fed far more comforts than the previous generation. They are weaker, and in the morals/respect area.
When the invader does come (I do collect visions and prophecies from the christian churches, as you know) most of you younger chaps are going to pike out due to those inherant weaknesses.

If "the invader" does come, you'll be the first against the wall Gibo.

Be strong Bugsy. Its not yet... but not forever away. Be strong lad.

TRTL,
On one hand it would actually benfit the world if the easily manipulated could be further manipulated into being gay (as in queer) as this would prevent overpopulation. That way the procreant could enjoy a more gay (as in happy) life.
Baby boomers fighting wars ? Of course! Would you rather have the maniacs who cause war
come to these shores before you act ? Mate, no amount of happy weed & Bob Dylan songs would save your gay butt then.

I regret a lot of changes to society. One is that dictionaries no longer adhere to an earlier truth. My The Australian Students Color Dictionary has left out 2 important words...sodomy and buggery. How is youth going to know the sin is wrong, if there is no description of it for them to study? The Holy Bible calls it sin and the consquences that go with the sin show in the lives of gay people. They sure suffer much misery from what Ive observed. Perhaps they just need to repent to get the curses lifted off them.

Actually individual, none of my post was about homosexuality. My butt ain't gay, but I'd like to think that if it was, I wouldn't have fundamentalist christian types dictating to me how I should live, based on prophecies they've foreseen.

There's an irony in the fact that the baby boomers have stripped things like free education away from the youth, and now criticise them for the education they have to pay for.

In fact, I had to work full time while in university. Something far fewer members of previous generations have had to contend with. So yes, I find it a bit rich to hear people prattling on about how shiftless this next generation is, when current generations now have to work to put themselves through university, or amass huge debt.
When you couple that with the fact that working families now tend to need two incomes to buy a house and the corporate world is more cut-throat than ever, it seems to me that if anything, this generation works harder than the previous ones that love to sit around whingeing about it. There's something decidedly hypocritical about the fact that most of them simultaneously say how much better things were back in their day, while also saying how the youth of today have it too easy.

Fortunately, the boomers are also in the process of stripping away free healthcare, so it's with some smug satisfaction that I note the swollen ranks of baby boomers will soon be needing geriatric care that they'll now have to pay for, and quite frankly, my sympathy is at a pretty low ebb at the moment.

TRTL,
People actually don't say that "things were better" years ago. It's experience that makes them say "things are getting worse". You say today's generation has to work harder. Ever wondered why ? Because they want everything now but can't afford it and go heavily into debt.
Baby boomers didn't have to pay that much for uni ? Well, maybe it's because they didn't force their governments to blow all the financial reserves on appeasing left wing idealism which in turn brought about the mindlessness of political correctness & society destroying social reform including the "gay" factor. Everyone makes mistakes & the b/boomers are no exception. Their biggest blunder was not putting a stop to the hand-outs & indiscriminate influx of non-genuine refugees which in turn has caused the breakdown of society we're experiencing now. Another factor is that there is double the population now to when the b/boomers arrived on the scene. More people equals smaller serves. it's as simple as that.

Turn right & left.
The only reason two incomes are needed to buy a house is that two incomes
are borrowed against.
Why is that ? Simple, back in the 1970s to 80s the women insisted that when a
couple was applying for a loan that the bank take her income into account.
The banks did not want to do that in case she became pregnant.
The government in the name of political correctness agreed.

Now a bit of simple economics;
What happens if you put twice as much money into a market ?

Prices rise to meet the amount of money available.
Simple isn't it and why was everyone surprised when house prices
went so high that two incomes are now necessary to buy a house.

So the women thought they were being clever but it turned around
and bit them, now they complain they HAVE to work and they have their
babies too late in life with all the problems they are coming up against.

individual:

"Well, maybe it's because they didn't force their governments to blow all the financial reserves on appeasing left wing idealism which in turn brought about the mindlessness of political correctness & society destroying social reform including the "gay" factor"

Whilst social policies are more left wing today, you'll find that economically speaking, governments have moved very far to the right.

Your comment: because they didn't force their governments to blow all the financial reserves on appeasing left wing idealism makes no sense.

How the social reform to do with the 'gay' factor in any way expensive? compared to left wing economics like free education and healthcare, it's a trifling amount.
Honestly, put things in perspective. In economic terms, our past governments have been infinitely more left wing and have taken a far more interventionist role in everyday life.

Gibo, I've responded to your question about suicide rates resulting from CSA on the thread where you posted it.

Then I read your post on this thread.

Have you ever stopped to consider the misery and harm done by views such as your own? That much of the suffering felt by homosexuals may not be the consequence of their orientation but rather by the imposition of views such as yours on how they live their lives?

How many people have met untimely deaths because of the actions of those who think their book is more important than the lives of others?

I detest CSA but it's not a patch on the evil done by religious fundamentalists who would destroy the lives of others to maintain their own beliefs.

I read an essay recently by a christain which I will try and locate and post sometime but in part it suggested that the contradictions in the bible (an eye for an eye vs turn the other cheek etc) were there to allow people to choose. That the real test for salvation is the rejection of an image of god that is about hate and vengence.

A rejection of the kind of god who would condem those born homosexual to a life of misery (and misery for those around them as they try and live a lie) in order to follow the dictates of the good book.

I don't believe in god but if one did exist that idea has a lot more merrit than the message of intollerance and hate dished up by fundamentalists.

R0bert

Sorry RObert. I cant ever condone homosexuality, not for anyone. I dont believe homosexuals are born that way. They may be affected by a spirit power as part of a curse that goes down the family line because of the lines' earlier sins. God curses down to the 4th generation of those who have hated Him and His Word. It does happen. Most homosexuals do it because they LIKE it. Its no more complex. "Fallen" flesh is fallen flesh and likes certain things that are detrimental to the species known as mankind. Longterm immorality corrupts a civilisation and God tears it down. Where now all of the old civilisations? Torn down.
Your christian friend would be apostate and false if he says there are contradictions in the Bible. I have found none in 24 years or reading and listening. Everything in The Word fits a circumstance or an event or a teaching. Sin is a snake and if we allow it, it will twist our thinking and we end up interpreting what we find is appropriate to lusts and person pleasures. Homosexuality has curses, so does any sexual immorality including masturbation and those curses include getting satans' authority to torment. Many masturbaters have "the voice in the head' problem and live on psychiatric medication. Many gays will have a similar problem. Their lives show their miseries. They need to go to Jesus to be set free. He's the Only Power that can do it. Fundamentalists follow The Word because they know its true because the Holy Spirit convicts that its true! Do shoot the messengers.

Gibo. We only have your word that what you say is true.

Personally, I think religion is a prop for those who cannot face their own mortality.

So, give us a rest from the sermons.

Gee Bazz,

So you would have all women barefoot and pregnant and back in the kitchen then (or at least not allowed a fulfilling career outside parent hood)?

'God curses down to the 4th generation of those who have hated Him and His Word', oh bugger, my poor great-grandchildren. They're cursed to mince around at the Mardi Gras.

'Many masturbaters have "the voice in the head' problem', I thought a picture in the head would be more useful.

Gibo, the piece was not from a friend but rather someone writing an article I found interesting. As for apostate and false, no rather he appears to be someone who values truth, who is able to face the inconsistancies in his own faith with courage and openness. You don't see the inconsistancies because you refuse to see them, you refuse to acknowledge the body of evidence being accumlated around a number of issues (evolution, genetic basis for homosexuality etc) because to accept that evidence will bring you face to face with stuff that you wish would go away.

You hold to made up stories about homosexuals and masturbaters because those stories make you feel better about the harm done by your faith than the truth would.

I've not known many homosexuals (or not known many who acknowledge being homosexual), I have known plenty of christains and quite a few who I assume are masturbaters (not mutually exclusive groups) and the only ones I've heard talk about voices in their head were christains (and only some of them).

Enjoy your faith if it's whats get's you through but don't try and impose it on others to satisfy your own needs.

R0bert

Gibo,
"I don't believe homosexuals are born that way"

The tabloids are full of stories and actual life experiences, how "they" came to be.
It is very possible that gay people are in fact born with a prefference for same sex and there are those who only find out at a much later time in their lives, that they are gay.

In this day and age, it's an "in" thing to anounce one is coming out of the closet and I say good for them. The only point I really feel sorry about, is a gay person coming out of the closet once he/she is already married and with children, that is a real @rse kicker!

SPANKY, "The only point I really feel sorry about, is a gay person coming out of the closet once he/she is already married and with children, that is a real @rse kicker!"

That is one of the great tragedies of the social and legal pressures that fundamentalist religious types bring to bear on homosexuals. Trying to force people to deny what they are and live something else does not work in the long term but it may work long enough to get people into a marriage with kids.

R0bert

Gee Bazz,

So you would have all women barefoot and pregnant and back in the
kitchen then (or at least not allowed a fulfilling career outside parent hood)?
Posted by Iluvatar, Friday, 5 October 2007 1:09:26 PM
Unquote
Who said anything about not allowed a career ?
Well Iluvator, I did not say who should work or who should borrow,
if you can get out of the PC think mode you will realise that it is the
borrowing on two incomes that causes housing to be so expensive.

As they say, "Its the market Stupid !"
Twice as much money means twice as much price.
All it did was make the developers rich.

To all; there is something wrong with the thinking processes of the
PC trendies. They are unable to get their minds around the fact that
being politically correct can lead to problems as has happened with
the price of houses.

No. I have to disagree SPANKY and RObert. Its all to do with fallen spirit powers, is homosexuality. If you dont understand, thats ok. Its the way it is for you. But what Im saying about homosexuality and the Bibles condemnation of it, is the way it is too. People sin because they like it. Gays do their thing because they like it... because of falling into the weakness of the lifestyle offered by the satan and accepted by the victim. Its easier to chase a man than start a relationship with a woman, and for some if not most it is. If they want to go to God through Jesus, they will get rid of it. Its a cop out to say I was born that way and cant help it. God is always there to set the addict free.

Is it possible for you Gibo to take a non relgious line in ANY of your posts? I find your constant use of the same theme to justify your holier than thou stance, to be so close to thread crapping that it's not funny.

All who behave differently to you are evil or need saving and all things Christian are the way everyone should think and behave according to this constant line of yours. I find that arrogant and offensive.

I'm sure you'll find my comments less than polite too, but thread crapping has never been my cup of meat.

Ditch, you are missing all the fun. We have Gibo telling us that homosexuality and masturbation cause voices in the head "Many masturbaters have "the voice in the head' problem and live on psychiatric medication. Many gays will have a similar problem." http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=1099#19584
and then telling us that his voice in the head (I paraphrase) tells him that the bible is true "Fundamentalists follow The Word because they know its true because the Holy Spirit convicts that its true!" http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=1099#19584

What irony.

The sad bit is that the tidied up version of Gibo's thinking does get milage with our lawmakers. That those who don't believe in ancient middle eastern shepherd gods, invisible wars between someones god and the devil, the tooth fairy etc have their lives damaged as a result.

That any threat to narrow blinkered thinking is challenged using any pretext the fundies can think up to try and hinder the progress of the human race. Gibo's claims about voices in the head on this thread, his claims about concern for the environment as a reason not to like NASA elsewhere.

How many suicides are the result of persecution by people who can't accept any truth outside their own faith?

How many families are disfunctional because of legal and social pressure on homosexuals to be something they are not?

R0bert

I see youre bitter RObert about the christian message. If you have the gay problem you can get rid of it by going to The Lord.

RObert, yes I could perhaps just laugh at Gibo. He takes himself seriously enough for all members here. The mark of one who is self righteousness is to ignore all criticism and to carry on as per usual. Of course, when you think you have all the answers how can anyone else know more than you can.

Gibo if you have any misuderstanding of what a thread crapper looks like, take a look in the mirror.

I guess you have the problem too Ditch. Dont hide it from God if you have.

Gibo,
Sorry, but some preachers, deacons and certain heads of various beliefs, some of them who are gay, seem to think differently than you do, so your comment on homosexuality being a decision made by the individual, holds no water.

This has nothing to do with christianity and certainly nothing to do with this thread, s'funny, someone already mentioned the fact of religion always raising it's head, in all of these threads, I wonder why?..could it possibly be due to having to dare talk of such apparent blasphemous chit-chat in a thread, could someone actually feel threatened by talk of gay paraphenalia?...mmmm, makes me wonder.

Gibo, does this turn you on? oohhh!..aaahh!

Gibber; it is interesting to note that you seem fixated on all things sexual....

Was the cause for this the unfortunate incident with the sheep?

Yes, it is fascinating that the Christian fundies of the forum seem to be not mereley obsessed with sex, but with sex of the homosexual, bestial or paedophilic kind. Perhaps it's a Freudian thing?

On topic, I agree with Pericles that the word "gay" now seems to mean something like what we used to mean by "uncool" in my younger lexicon, at least according to its usage by my youngest kids. My son tells me that homosexuals of his age group tend to refer to themselves as "queer", or perhaps "fluid" if they are bisexual.

I think that the more enlightened members of my own generation adopted the word "gay" for homosexuality, as it is a happy, positive and affirmative word, as in "Sing if you're glad to be gay, glad to be happy that way". Personally, I prefer that meaning to the negative one that my son's generation attaches to the word "gay".

Damn, Gibo, you've outed me!

Now it's time to come out of the closet yourself. Feel free to talk about it Gibo.

Gibo, try this word association test. It should help free up those repressed desires.

What's the first word that comes into your mind when reading the following words?

Penis
Vagina
Anus
Orgasm
Sperm
Cliteros
Testicles
Penetration
Cunnilingus
Fellatio
Blow job

How are you going so far? You should start to feel better very soon

SATAN!

Damn that felt good. :D

"If you have the gay problem you can get rid of it by going to The Lord." - Oh there is so much I could do with that.

I'm so tempted, I even looked up the Wikipedia reference to Necrophilia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necrophilia but it seem to be in bad taste to run with that interpretation of Gibo's suggestion. There are christains around who deserve better but then I've not noticed any attempting to pull Gibo into line. Those who enjoy a bit of bad taste can toy with that in the privacy of your own homes.

I've spent time thinking about the merits of commenting on my sexual orientation but that seems to add little to the discussion. Maybe I'll just have to accept that Gibo has had a word from the Lord and take it as truth. I may have to consider myself outed as has Ditch.

On the other hand it could be that I like others wish to stand up against oppression even when we are not the oppressed. Similar to christains of some time back who stood up against slavery despite not being slaves themselves. It could be that Gibo cannot understand those who would stand up for the freedoms of others and against oppression by those who hold an image of a sex fixated god dear to their hearts.

As I read some of the latter posts I really am feeling quite gay (thats the happy, amused kind of gay).

R0bert

Allow me to respond on behalf of gibo:

Q) Anything.
A) Go see god about it.

Of course, it's not very helpful for actually solving problems, but hey.
It must be nice to be able to respond to any given conundrum with - 'go to the lord'.

Unfortunately it also means you can't actually communicate with these people, but hey. I guess that's our problem, not theirs.

"Unfortunately it also means you can't actually communicate with these people, but hey. I guess that's our problem, not theirs"

Yes, and this is the problem, when all that is offered to any discussion is the same old, same old.........just change one or two words to relate minimally to the current topic and bingo, all is resolved.

However, the problem isn't just for those who want to debate rather than preach as you say, it's Gibo's and others who reason his way. It's worth pointing out though that taking issue with Gibo and his ilk does not imply any lack of religiosity on the part of his critics. It is simply an objection to the constant, predictable line they take in refusing to discuss any topic outside of their narrow frame of reference.

I don't know..(shaking shaking his head in utter disbelief)

It goes to show, one cannot,(or will not) discuss a topic without the influence of religion.

At some stage in our lives, we have all asked the big guy upstairs, for some kind of moral boosting assistance, yet we never hear of those in a same sex affair, asking for help with their relationships.
(which i'm pretty sure they do, we just don't hear it)

Is it due to the complexity of the situation? or is it due to the bible condoning such activity? If the latter be the answer, then the big guy upstairs does not in fact, love his creations...oops..did I dare mention that?

In that case, one had better watch his or her step whilst tripping gayly through a meadow full of sheep. Who was that guy holding a crook in the middle of a field anyhow?

But we do hear of same sex couples/people asking for guidance and help from above. Look at the efforts to have gay clergy accepted as ministers. They pray for help, no? And yes, most of us at some stage asked for help from above. I include myself in that group.

I have no objection with religion being introduced into a discussion, per se. However there's a limit to what degree of input, I believe, is appropriate, but I won't repeat what I have already said several times already