Islam is Really a Political Movement
In reality Islam is a political movement whose policies are directed by the Koran. That is why Imams are so closely associated with the various terrorist organisations. An example of this was demonstrated on the streets of Lakemba on the 8th October 2023 by the Imam of the local mosque.

The intention is proudly proclaimed that Islam will conquer the world and that all countries will submit to Islam.
The intention is to remove the laws and constitutions of countries and impose Sharia Law.
There will be no democracies and any voting will be for approved candidates as can be seen in Iran today.
In Germany the path is seen in the demonstrations calling for Sharia Law and a Caliphate which is a governing body that does not recognise borders as they exist today. A caliphate if established would govern wherever it could enforce its will. Something similar can be seen with the influence of Iran in the Middle East.

Their proclaimed intention is to remove Israel and all Jews wherever they may be.
Then as in the old writings conquer Rome.
Of course today that means the western governments first and then the Great Satan, ie the United States.
Their planning will then include the completion of the conquering of India and eventually the conquering of China.

Now all that seems absurd but remember this is at the command of Allah and so cannot be debated.
In the UK there are already Sharia courts. At present they seam only to deal with family matters such as inheritance, but it is the thin edge of the wedge. The two level policing that has come into effect in the UK demonstrates the trend. Our governments appear to be falling over backwards to avoid the white anting of our civilisation.

The Pope was spruiking the other day that no one religion is better than the other. Nothing to worry about, then.

Bezz,

I'm sure you would know a whole lot more about Islam, and have a modicum of credibility if you actually took the time to read and understand something about the religion, but that could be asking too much. You make all sorts of claims, some of them might be factual, other claims might be simply fuelled by your fertile Anti-Muslim imagination.

What are you qualifications when it comes to the Islamic religion? Maybe you are the Grand Mufti of Baghdad or some such exalted being.

There's no need to explain about Islam. Its ultimate goal has been spelled out openly many, many times !
Time to wake the stupid Woke !

Seeing how incredibly idiotic many in the West have become ponders the question how many Islamists are following a similar track ?

The Koran says lots of alarming things. So does the Bible in the Old Testament. Unfortunately, there is no new “testament” to the Koran.

The Ottoman Empire covered a fair bit of the world 600 years ago. But, Islam ain't what it used to be then.

But in 2024?

Someone called Michael Kenny wrote a book called ‘The Islamic State in Britain’. I haven't read it, and will not at $40.

JD Vance, possible VP of the US, has been reported as saying that the UK will be the first Islamist state with nuclear weapons.

Anyone can write and say anything they want these days - as they are entitled too.

What we need to know is not what Islam is about, but what everyday Muslims are about. Just because the Koran says something, or a few lunatics carry out what it says in some places, doesn't mean Muslims are all nutjobs wanting to die for Allah. For instance, I am a Christian, but not a ‘Bible Christian’: I don't take everything in the Bible literally. There are many people like that; I would put money on there being many Muslims out there who are not ‘Koran Muslims’.

The notion that radical Islam is a direct result of
the teachings of the Quran, and the indication that
violence is an inherent part of Islam - sounds like
a rather simplistic view. Assigning blame at the best
of times is the easy option instead of trying to
understand the complex issues involved.

Remember the days when villains in action movies
were Russians, North Koreans, Asians? After 9/11
the villains became Islamic terrorists.

Very few of us look at global politics that have
destabilized regions and inflamed tensions. Few
of us take the time to study how dysfunctional states
create an opening for extremism.

It's a complex world. Few look at our own policies
in the Middle East and how military intervention has
changed the region. What effect UN policies regarding
Israel have. And so much more.

Instead of looking at Islam - perhaps we in the West
should look at ourselves

Spot on ttbn, there is I have seen hints that there is an undercover
organisation somewhere in Australia for moslems who have become
disenchanted with the religion and would like to leave or change
for a different version.
They are probably worried by the fanatics perhaps more so than we
are as they might be considered apostates. A capital crime.
In some Islamic countries there is a variation of Islam that is
considered to be blasphemy by main stream moslems.

Paul, I have no academic qualifications in the religious field and I
am just an ordinary Joe Blow who has read the reports of terrorist
activity and read up further to try to understand the risks involved.
I suspect that many moslems will not speak up because of the reaction
from their community and indeed their own family.
So we owe it to ourselves to understand what is going on and realise
that it is a program to take over "western" countries and impose
Sharia Law. It is as simple as that !

Baz,

We had an Imam in Adelaide who was given a run on TV for a fair while, speaking against violent, radical Islam.

It would be interesting to know what, if anything, happened to him. He hasn't been seen for a long time

Hi Bezz,

You talk about trying to understand Islam.

That's a positive sign.

So, regarding Sharia Law?

The link given below tells us that:

"Among Australian Muslims there exists a strong preference
to have legal questions answered and disputes settled by
persons with Islamic credentials. Except in rare cases, this
does not mean there is a rejection of Australian laws, but
instead there is a desire to conform with Sharia Law when it
is possible to do so."

" Muslims as minorities in secular societies like Australia
have been recognized as skilled "cultural navigators" able
to manoeuvre through two systems of laws, one of their
nation, and the other of their faith."

" Complying with both systems of laws is one approach that
can and is being taken in Australia."

There's more at:

http://aifs.gov.au/research/family-matters/no-84/legal-recognition-sharia-law#:

Foxy, moslems do have to obey the national law but after that they
can modify the decisions voluntary to comply with sharia.
I am thinking of inheritance laws such as girls inherit 1/2 of what
boys inherit.
So when a will goes through probate and they have received 50% the
property etc the girls have to surrender 17% of their share to the boys.
Some girls might object but the family pressure would be intense.
On other matters where possible Sharia would be applied even if there
was good case that could be made at court. That can be just ignored.
In that way a separate society can be developed.

Hi Foxy,

Well thought out post re Islam, and the complexity of that mass monotheistic religion. I'm not an adherent to any religion, but I can see positives and negatives in all three monotheistic religions, providing you brush away the mumbo-jumbo and perverted interpretations, then the basic concepts are good such as "thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself" The verse from the Koran seems to align with the Judaeo Christian Bible verse. Like many "Christians" there would be many "Muslims" who fail to honour the teachings.

“Serve Allah, and join not any partners with Him; and do good- to parents, kinsfolk, orphans, those in need, neighbours who are near, neighbours who are strangers, the companion by your side, the wayfarer (ye meet), and what your right hands possess: For Allah loveth not the arrogant, the vainglorious” (Qur’an 4:36).
(sayings of the Prophet):

Dear Paul,

The vast majority of modern mainstream Christians, Jews,
Muslims, and others, seek a better life on earth, rather
than seeking it in heaven. I've posted on this forum
in the past that we need to keep in mind that
the religiously minded modern person of whatever faith
is not a "card-carrying fundamentalist." The latter
are a tiny minority.

Still, I can understand some people's fears. Humanity can't
afford to have fundamentalists with their fingers on the
nuclear war button.

Hi Foxy,

"The vast majority of modern mainstream Christians, Jews,
Muslims, and others, seek a better life on earth, rather
than seeking it in heaven."

Absolutely agree, people are concerned with the problems of day to day living, and have little concern with getting to heaven. I've met folk over the years from other ethnic and cultural backgrounds, and indeed the majority if not all, simply want a better/good life for themselves and their families, and they hope to find it in Australia.

Fundamentalists are always a danger, they view the complex problems of this world in simplistic black and white terms, and believe those complex problems can be solved with simple solutions, which always involves exclusion of others in some form, never wanting inclusion. These people always believe right is on their side, and if they are religious fundos then they have the added bonus of having the perfect being in the form of a righteous god on their side as well, this can be a lethal combination for the rest of us.

Here we go again: Foxy knows what the “vast majority” of people think. Her little lapdog jumps in, and before you know it, the topic is changed.

I admit that I am not privy to what the “vast majority” thinks. I do know that if you ask people ‘what is the meaning of life’, you won't get an answer. Nobody, including me, actually knows.

We are born, we have no say in how long we live, then we die. There is no real reason for life on earth. There is no sense in it if a physical life on Earth is all there is. There is no sense in being a Christian, Jew, Muslim or having any faith at all if everything ends when you stop breathing.

Perhaps the purgatory or Hell spoken of is actually what we call life: a test for the hereafter.

Unlike some people, I don't claim to know what goes on in the privacy of the heads of other people, even those close to me. But, the older I get, the closer to the end of my life, I often say to myself, “there must be something better than this”.

In the meantime, while life goes on, I am pleased to see the resurrection of the Family First Party as another choice for people sick of the Coalition/Labor uniparty.

Family First voluntarily deregistered itself in 2017, but was reregistered on 20th. September by the AEC, the party is Judeo-Christian based and very pro-family.

The Albanese government, like all far Left regimes, fears the family: that's why it wants to brainwash children very early, and relieve parents of their responsibilities. So Soviet!

Protecting the rights of children and their innocence is one of their interests, which includes the alphabet people infesting the education system, plus defending the rights of parents.

Family First will work for “every Australian’s freedoms regardless of ancient ancestry, new immigrant status, believer or non-believer.”

I suppose that means even Sneery 1405 and Foxy.

You don't have to be a Christian to:

. Believe marriage is between a man and a woman
. There are only two sexes
. The family is the thing that holds society together
. Freedom of speech and opinion is essential
. Parents, not governments, should be raising children
. Mutilation of children suffering sexual dysphoria is vile
. Democracy is under threat in Australia

And, no. I have no connection to Family First, the ACL, or any other organisation, Sneery 1405.

We come into this world as "blank sheets," as every child
does. But then minds can be fashioned from an early age
by frightening nonsense preached by fanatical ideologues.

Most of us are willing to label Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot,
Idi Amin, as sub-human zealots. So, I guess it stands to
reason that some of us are going to also label those who preach
religious hatred against others.

The mistake that's made is labelling all who belong to
religious groups as being fundamentalists and extremists.
Not all Muslims are terrorists. Not all Christians are
"end-timers". Not all Jews support Israel's policies.
Not all Palestinians support Hamas. And not all posters
on this forum attack others personally - for their opinions.

I (ttbn) often say to myself (out loud), “there must be something better than this”. Maybe you'll discover what it is shortly.

You're one to speak about others, how often do you get on here pontificating about the "silent majority". Now its the 'Family First' Party who command about 3% of the popular vote. Well, that's better than your last mob, the Corney Banana Party with a massive half a percent of the vote in 2019.

Islam is different things for different people.
For some, it is even different things at different stages of their life.

So for some it is a political movement.
For others it is a religion.
For others it is a social framework.

For many it is a mixture of the above in different proportions.

Democracy is under threat in Australia
ttbn,
Not from the Conservative side ! The leftist Democrats (Labor here) are hell-bent on destroying majority agreement by combining minority groups against the majority ! That is as hypocritically un-democratic as it can possibly be !
That's why I have always described Democracy as one of the worst forms of Dictatorship.

Indyvidual

The problem is that we no longer have a "conservative side" in the form of a party capable of forming a government. The Coalition has been infiltrated by the Left. The best that Peter Dutton can come up with is nuclear power - even then only in relation to Scott Morrison's net zero nonsense - and he will remove the 'aboriginal ambassador'.

The Coalition came up with the vile idea of online censorship. Dutton is OK with digital ID, remove parental rights and obligations, abortion, protecting gender bending and unnatural "weddings" and sexual practices, abortions. To cut a long story short, the Coalition is in lock step with Labor on most things.

It's getting to the stage where the main difference between China and Australia is: China doesn't deny that it is a one-party state.

An Opposition is supposed to present an alternative to the Government, but Dutton is as committed to the ridiculous Net Zero by 2050 as are the lunatics in the Albanese regime. The only difference being he wants to use nuclear to do it - a waste of time and money - instead of admitting we have been bushwhacked by the Climate Cult, and getting back to coal and gas.

To put it mildly, Dutton is piss-weak.

The next federal election is less than a year away
with the dates being mentioned around March to May
2025.

There are many issues still to play out in the lead up
into the 2025 election. But based on current policy and
economic conditions and the probable path for factors
that influence voters, Labor with some good management
should win a second term.

It will be interesting to see how issues such as immigration,
population growth, housing, employment, nuclear power versus
renewable energy, health, education, defence, income and
wealth distribution, gender equality and a myriad of other
issues can sway voter preference.

"Labor with some good management..."

Well that's be a welcome change.

The next election will be about cost of living issues. As was the last one. But the government has very little it can do about it because of the dire economic conditions in which it operates (as I predicted before the last election ....http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=9813#333463).

The solutions to these problems are there for all to see but are beyond the capabilities of either government or opposition to articulate let alone implement.

So the government will sit around hoping the inflation rate drops enough to allow the RBA to drop interest rates a little. Thereafter they claim credit (where none is due) and race to the polls before the faecal matter hits the cooling device.

In Australia, first term governments almost never get the flick, even one as bad as this one. So they'll probably stagger over the line, helped by a slight drop in interest rates and a bunch of sweeteners thrown at various groups - money the country can't afford to spend bit which the government can't afford to not spend.

What's another $30 or $40 Billion added to the national debt when they have their phoney-baloney jobs to keep. Give me a harrumph!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTmfwklFM-M

"To put it mildly, Dutton is piss-weak."
- His whole party is piss-weak because he leads it.
He's not going to win you any elections but he's probably helping you lose them.

I saw him moaning a day or so back that without nuclear we won't reach our 2050 targets.
Stupid fool.

"The next election will be about cost of living issues. As was the last one."

If we all say we're 'undecided' until the last minute, they'll all try to throw something extra in to buy us off.

I am undecided actually.

I'm not sure dumb is any better than dumber, and I'm not sure it even matters anymore whose running this clownshow.

they'll all try to throw something extra in to buy us off.
Armchair Critic,
That is just so typically opportunist thinking ! It actually makes you more hypocritical than the Govt !
What you should promote is the idea of telling the Govt to tell us who they're going to waste our Taxes on next time so we can decide not to vote for them.

My message to Dutton would be, drop the nuclear-is-the-only-way-to-achieve-net zero mantra and drop Net Zero if he gets elected. Despite the continuing deprivations Australians are experiencing due to the net zero scam, emissions are not coming down - rising in fact - while foreign companies are being allowed to ruin our environment and get rich.

Nuclear is a load of horseshite. Other countries have been using it for years: long before the climate scam. Nuclear power made no difference then, and it never will, because climate will do what the climate does.

Of course, Dutton would ignore any message: he is as big an arsehole as any other politician.

And WTF has this to do with the subject: Islam? SWFA. Another example of posters not having the guts or the brains to start a thread of their own, preferring to piggyback/bludge on those who do contribute.

Talking about politics?

No matter what topics are raised for discussion, sooner
or later the topic of politics finds its way in. As we
can see from this one. Be it reviving the "Family First,"
party, or - "piss-
weak Dutton," or democracy in Australia. Islam, of course
is going to come into the conversation as well - condemnation
and discrimination of certain religions and minority groups
is part of the political scene after all. A "them" and "us"
attitude always seems to raise its ugly head.

That's life - as a famous Aussie said.

It's not what Islam is all about. It's what we're all about.

And WTF has this to do with the subject: Islam?
ttbn,
Yep, see how easy it is to get side-tracked ? Islam or rather its leaders, has only one goal, controlling humankind !
Nothing to do with afterlife or a bus full of virgins etc etc. simply global control for the good of no-one ! If it is not that than i for one would appreciate some evidence that it is not so !

Well I see that recent events have illustrated my premise that Islam
is a politico-Religious movement. Right from its beginning it was so !

On the other hand, we can't really blame the Muslim World exploiting the stupidity of the Westerners !
I mean, knowing what Islam has been & is promoting & stupid Westerners still think they can live in harmony with Islam then why even bother doing anything about it at all ?
Just look at these protesters here ? Many of them even look stupid !

"Just look at these protesters here ? Many of them even look stupid !" Mirror, Mirror on the Wall, whose the stupidest of them all? Stop looking into the bloody mirror, and work it out for yourself!

'You live like a state within a state until you are strong enough to take over'

Gentlemen,

Obviously you don't realize the diverse mix of people
who took part in the protests. They weren't all Muslims.
And the organizers co-operated with the police and
shifted and changed their plans so that the protests
would be peaceful.

So much for your attempts to inflame and spread fear.

"Shalom" (Shalam) - Hebrew. = (Make it good)

And -

"Salaam (Salam) - Quranic - (peace).

Are part of the teachings of each religion.

Please make it so.

They weren't all Muslims.
Foxy,
No, many mindless morons wag Uni to make a nuisance of themselves & just as many incompetent bureaucrats facilitate the idiocy ! It would not surprise me if these hobby anarchists receive a demonstration allowance !

Last week in the supermarket I saw a woman all togged up in a hijab buying meat. I wonder if the bloke who insisted she wear the hijab knows that he is not getting halal tucker.

I am so surprised that you missed the point Foxy.
Of course they were not all moslems, that is the tactic, put them to sleep;
worked for more than 1000 years, why change now ?
I see a report that the UK Labour Party has warned our Labour Party
of what they are facing.
There is no secret about it all, they state it often enough.
Get control by numbers, nb birthrate numbers, immigration, votes etc
and then delete our laws and impose Sharia Law.
Watch Europe closely, already some countries are making moves to expel moslems,

G'day ttbn,

All the Muslim families I've known shop at the supermarkets, just like you and I. My Jordanian mate shopped at the Middle East Deli, only for those foods he couldn't get from Woolworth's. A BBQ at a Turkish mates place, sausages, steak, chicken, do you know where it come from, yep the supermarket, washed down with a few cans of "Halal" VB. Living in the back blocks of SA, you probably don't know any Muslims, or have any social contact with them.

Hi Foxy,

A good news story, our group have been helping out a young Asian girl who was subjected to DV. She was able to get into some local short term crisis accommodation, but unfortunatly that's ran out, and despite efforts so far, there's nothing affordable for her to rent. Who put their hands up to take her in, one of our regulars, Muhammad and his wife.

One bloke who has to get out from where he was. Get this, offered a back yard shed, literally, not even a granny flat, $250 week, use the outside laundry and toilet said the "landlord". Rang me, he's gone down to the Gold Coast, thinks he's got something there, but not sure yet. Been camping in his old 4WD, could end up homeless.

Dear Paul,

I was raised by my parents to do the "right thing."
Be polite and respectfull and treat people as you'd
want to be treated. So I've learned to take people
as I find them. I try not to stereotype or make
sweeping generalizations about minority groups.
Hopefully they'll return the favour.
I find that most do.

Although I do have some funny incidents that I
still remember. An Irish priest telling me that I
was not a "typical migrant". That I spoke English
so beautifully. I told him I was born and educated
here.

Then the nurse who asked my husband while he waited
to be seen by a doctor in a hospital, whether he needed
an interpreter. I guess she assumed he was "foreign"
because of his non-English surname. To which hubbie
replied with his English accent - "Why, doesn't the doctor
speak English?"

And there's so much more. I remember laughing out loud
when reading the book - "They're A Weird Mob,"
by Nino Culotta.

Thanks for sharing your stories. You always manage to
brighten my day when things get me down. I've met many
people from different walks of life - but on this forum, it's
the first time that I've had to deal with such nastiness
and toxicity.

Watch Europe closely, already some countries are making moves to expel moslems,
Bezza,
Considering Australia is usually 20 years behind Europe we'd better brace for the inevitable !

Amazing how un-patriotic people are when it comes to a little thing like to open their mind !

This link is to a talk by Robert Spencer. He has written many books on
Islam and this talk I found of much interest especially because of the
historical context.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jK0HdrchkMk

He obviously has a wide grip on the subject and is a well known authority on Islam.
I would be interested to hear others comments.