Fester
Belly has made some good points and a few of your comments are certainly worthy of discussing further also.

You ask – Why not import what can’t be produced here?

That’s certainly a valid point fester unless you are implying that our Governments and authorities are so far out of wack they can’t run their own country and arrange a fair rate of wages.

I think what belly is saying is we should be able to stand on our own two feet and produce what we need to feed our families and provide employment for our future generations.

I find it really fascinating that nobody mentions the old school boys club – The National Party who have betrayed the farmers an flooded this country with cheap imports.

We can export after we value add and keep the money in our own country and still have enough left over to send aid.

Howard and the Nationals have failed miserable to provide a future especially in regional areas.
Australia will be in serious trouble in two or three years given this it will be right mate attitude while spending up big on credit cards.
Why do you think these countries are importing our raw materials fester?
It’s because they are buying jobs for their future generations.
Have you heard of sanctions?
Don’t ever think that can’t happen in Australia. It can and given today’s world I am sure it will. We will be in deep trouble if we don’t let some of the migrants come work and live in regional areas to re open the bush.
The country is our food bowl our real wealth and those who hasten to rush to the big mines are not thinking of the long term future of this nation and future generations.
I think you will find belly is.

To get his mining boom into perspective, the whole coal mining in the whole country is all of 26,000. I don't have the figures for the whole mining industry, but it shouldn't take a genius to work out that we should have easily be able to fill all those jobs and still have had sufficient skilled workers left over if the incompetent, indolent Howard Government had done its job properly and trained Australian workers.

Even now, I fail to see why need the distoritions caused by a boom in industry with such a minisucle workforce cannot be rectified soon enough without resorting to knee-jerk panic measures proposed by Belly.

Fester is right. If it is not possible to harvest agricultural produce economically without the use of slave labour, then we should consider importing it, at least unitil such a time as their is a need once again for those jobs by Australian workers.

Alternatively, we should consider re-erecting tariff barriers to prevent the import of fruit picked by slave labour overseas so that our own fruit pickers can be paid decently.

Many years ago, I read a story of an Australian pair who worked picking fruit. Their only signiificant asset they owned after many years of work was their car and the journalist noted that the male partner had lost most of his teeth as he was not able to afford dental care on his wages. I doubt if matters have improved since then. Is it any wonder that Australians spurn this kind of work?

Do we really want to continue having such classes of citizens in this country?

The argument that people from outside Australia can be made to accept such miserably-paid occupations and be made to go on doing so indefinitely without posing a threat to the wage levels of the rest of the community is not only illogical, but implicity racist.

dagett

The minning boom will run out in twenty or thirty years.

What then?

I can see it now Australia`s food for coal and uranium programe.

Good one. Perhaps we should have a back up plan in order to feed
ourselves.

Would you leave your neighboug the reasonsibilty of feeding your kids? No

Nor should the Governments leave us dependant on China who is going broke.

We are at the mercy of China keeping their prices down.

Clever race the Chinese. Take our raw materials and jobs with it to improve "their ecconomy' Make us 'totally' dependant. Then what.?
Anyway do you know they use human excrement to grow veggies.?
Enjoy your tin tomatoes.yuk

As you rightly said-but it shouldn't take a genius to work out that we should have easily be able to fill all those jobs pale
pale replies
I totally agree with you and I think belly also pointed out it is not just the Howard Government we must also be aware the States run their own shows.
So in that Bellys right isnt he? They all need to lift their game.

So I fail to see how these are knee jerk reactions given you agree the Howard Government along with Nationals have failed to address this problem in the past.
The real question then must be whats going to happen in the future?

draggett said
"Fester is right.
pale replies You kidding! So its been stuffed up in the past but why worry!
dragget said
'Alternatively, we should consider re-erecting tariff barriers'

Pale replies Absolutlty now your talking.
Even the importers themselves recigine that that distortions are the profitabilty not intrinnsic to the product itself, but rather a product of market distortion in form of tariff and non tariff barriers .

daggett said
"Do we really want to continue having such classes of citizens in this country?"
pale replies
Like what? Why dont you ask belly about this mob down his way.-
Perhaps both Governments might learn from the `real Aussies`.
The salt of this Nation
http://www.aussiebushhats.com.au/catalog/advanced_search_result.php?

Belly;
I agree that all Governments,State and Fed, Lib and Lab, have let us down. Industry forewent staff training to get maximum short term profits and our Governments have only been looking to the next election. Industry is now being rewarded for its ineptitude by being allowed to import workers.

Telstra, for example, closed all its linesman training schools in NSW, to make the privatisation look better and recently were advertising overseas for linesmen. Thats industry foresight for you.

We have lost thousands of jobs from secondary industry over the years and now have the highest population ever, so I just do not believe we are short of workers. I think the figures are fudged. Many people are in part time or casual jobs that pay little. They deserve better.

State Governments used to brag about how many apprentices they put on each year, but not anymore.

No we urgently need to train our own workers and give more incentives to those willing to work. Australians are willing to work but not for nothing.

Paleif

When you keep bowing down to the call for slaves to save the economy, what exactly are you preserving? The deep South? When you dont have slave labour you have to innovate to make things cheaper. Bow down to the economic argument for slavery and the technology wont get off the ground.

The government could do more by nurturing innovation than by doling out 457 visas.

While I am on my soap box.

It is not ethicly or morally right for us to poach trained workers from other countries,simply on the grounds that we need them. These poorer countries need their trained workers more than we do. We are just greedy and lazy.

Industry should be told straight, if they want more skilled workers they must train them. Industry can afford gigantic profits and massive payouts to their executives, not to mention gifts of millions to the major political parties. Its about time they were more constructive with their funds.

Why should our taxpayers foot the bill for staff training that puts money in industries pockets.