The Forum > Article Comments > Why I am going to Gaza > Comments
Why I am going to Gaza : Comments
By Ron Witton, published 30/12/2009Religious and racial persecution should never again happen to any people, whether they are Jewish, Muslim, or Christian.
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Posted by Philip Tang, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 12:07:03 PM
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“December marks the first anniversary of the Israeli invasion of Gaza which brought devastation to a civilian population already suffering from years of deprivation and hardship”
That’s the problem when you throw rockets and bombs at a neighbor… the neighbor has the right to defend themselves. the point is the Gaza strip was handed back after it was forfeit following the failure of Palestinians and arabs against Israel during the 1967 war. “non-violent march from Northern Gaza to the Erez/Israeli border.” That will be a first… a non-violent Palestinian event “I see my going to Gaza as an expression of my rejection of aliya,” So who gets to express their rejection of the Palestinians presumption to a god-given right to push Israel into the sea? Doubtless this galah, in supporting the demands of Palestinian terrorists, would have likewise supported the German right of Lebensraum Posted by Col Rouge, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 12:49:07 PM
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I think you should stay home and rethink your objectives .
If you condemn one religion you are obliged to condemn all . You wouldn't want to find yourself in the awkward position of trying to explain why God failed to rescue 6 Million of your own from the machinations of Hitler , equally awkward , The Lord Jesus , one of your own ; apparently even the scale of the atrocity failed to prompt his miraculing powers . The only conclusion a rational man can draw on the matter of Hitler verses the Jews is that Hitler had God's consent and your fellow no influence ; so you should stay home where Peace will be with you among all us atheists. I hope you appreciate my assistance , have a good year . Posted by ShazBaz001, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 2:53:24 PM
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Good luck. I expect you will be detained by the israelis long before you get anywhere near Gaza and be deported but good on you for trying.
If you do get there please investigate the feelings of the locals towards israel. One of the problems in the middle east is that the arabs see the israelis as just one more in a long line of crusaders who will eventually be defeated and they will reclaim their lands. The israelis are the same with their "god gave us this land" crap and between them this is never going to end. Time to isolate the whole bloody lot of them and keep them from infecting the rest of us with their religion inspired madness. Before the arabs launch another 911 or the israelis decide its armageddon time. Posted by mikk, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 3:20:28 PM
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Dear Ron, there may indeed be parallels between Aboriginal Australians and the Palestinians in Gaza. It would seem therefore, entirely appropriate to put your effort into something a little closer to home like the aboriginal human rights. Then, when you have fixed them you could go off to Gaza with some degree of understanding and achievement under your belt. Otherwise your trip may be mistaken for guilt ridden political tokenism.
By the way whilst you’re over there can you just check a couple of dates for me? What was the actual date in 1947, that the Jordanians invaded the then League of Nations protectorate, Jerusalem and the West Bank? Also, was it Egypt that broke through the UN peacekeeping lines into Gaza in 1967? This would be whilst the Jordanians attacked from the West, the Libyans and Lebanese attacked from the North and the Syrians came in via the Golan Heights. Just thought you might wish to follow up on a few facts, wouldn’t want you to sound really, really silly. And please take all the time you need, after all, you might also experience a lightning bolt on the road to Damascus, just like your parents? Posted by spindoc, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 3:24:19 PM
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Go for it, Ron Witton. Only wish more Israelies were like you.
As an Aussie countryman, also wish congrats for your attitude to our Aborigines. Now going on 89, grew up in the WA Dalwallinu district when it also took in Paynes Find over one hundred miles to the East from Wubin. It is so interesting that years ago the Wubin Irish born blacksmith had married a sweet-looking Wongi Lubra from Paynes Find, another marriage to a Wongi Lubra was to the son of a very well-known German family who had been working for Gustave Liebe, at the time said to be the world's largest single wheat farmer. There was also a great interest in Aussie Rules footy as well as cricket in those days, and all in all there seemed a certain contentment in Dally concerning white and coloured relationships. Though now in our district there are very few non-white families left, many of us do feel that our natives though having had the privelege of the vote for many years, still need permanent representation in all Parliaments as proof of original ownership, not only as in New Zealand but also we understand has been established in Canada Posted by bushbred, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 5:00:45 PM
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One more day,
one less nutter. Posted by HermanYutic, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 6:10:17 PM
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You're wasting your time as long as Hamas is there.
Posted by StG, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 6:23:09 PM
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Remember the twits that went off to Iraq, to be human shields.
They came scuttling back pretty damn quick, when they actually found out the truth about the place. Wonder how long it will take this one. Probably a while, he sounds really thick. Posted by Hasbeen, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 6:29:30 PM
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Glad to hear anniversaries are meaningful to you – this year marks my 15th anniversary since I went to Israel to serve in an elite infantry unit to help defend the people of Israel. Indeed I joined doctors, lawyers, diplomats, rabbis, students and members of parliament (though to the best of my knowledge no priests or imams!) from Israel and around the world.
Not sure what you mean when you claim that Palestinians will also be rallying on the Israeli side – perhaps you are referring to Israeli Arabs, Bedouins or perhaps Druze! For at least a little credibility, you might first want to point out why Israel launched its devastating military might on Gaza – did it have anything to do with over 8 years of incessant rocket fire targeting innocent Israeli civilians? There’s also no need for me to get into the fact that Hamas used these sites as launch pads etc. And as for the UN – in this instance, and for that matter in most cases, which countries are the ones that mandate such investigations? In case you’re not aware, it is the countries that have a seat on the UN Human Rights Council; countries such as Iran, Egypt, Bangladesh, China, Indonesia, Nigeria, Pakistan, Russia, Saudi Arabia, among others – all luminaries of human rights! Re the embargo, there are so many ways to respond to this. E.g. if Hamas would spend the money they receive from generous global donors for the right purpose (i.e. not bombs but food/books etc.) then the people of Gaza would be a lot better off! Another example is the unlawful kidnapping of Gilad Shalit – the Red Cross hasn’t been allowed to see him nor has anyone else. The same can’t be said of the Palestinian prisoners. Cont. Posted by MEBDA, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 7:01:33 PM
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Sorry to hear of your unfortunate family background – unfortunately, so many of us Jews have a similar experience. I’m delighted to hear you feel your parents provided you with a good education – so did my parents. Please, there’s no need to invoke the Holocaust in your cynical attempt to support your pathetic argument! Delighted to hear your father was heavily in the social justice movement – in particular with the Aborigines (as opposed to Amnesty International who have become more of a political movement in recent time – bashing Israel at every opportunity!). You may not be aware that traditionally Jews have been heavily involved in the social justice/human rights movement (e.g. US & South Africa).
Not quite sure what your dad saw on his only trip to Israel but he obviously hadn’t experienced living in a country as an Israeli Jew constantly being targeted by terrorism and Muslim armies attempting to annihilate him! I see no issue with Israel being open to all Jews – it is after all the Jewish homeland. Ultimately when a Palestinian State is established, they can feel free to open it up to whomever they like. There are 56 member states of the Organisation of the Islamic Conference – Muslims, it seems, can pretty much choose where to go. This, of course, is no substitute for a Palestinian State, nor does it mean that all Muslims can choose which of these they will next move to. But it does nullify the argument regarding the concept of a Jewish State. And if this Jewish State would like to welcome any Jew then I’m sorry but you’re just going to have to accept it! Cont. Posted by MEBDA, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 7:03:33 PM
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Dear Dr Whitton,
Firstly allow me to Congratulate you on the very brave stand that you've taken. Undoubtedly you will receive a great deal of criticism for it but the pursuit of truth and knowledge as you're undoubtedly aware always has risks. But as the author Antony Loewenstein will tell you, it's well worth the risks involved. As Roland Jabbour,Chairman of the Australian Arabic Council despaired at the negative image of Arabs in the wider community: "Arabs are continually associated with terrorism and violence, being primitive and anti-Western...this view is so ingrained here...it's much easier to be pro-Israeli than to support the Palestinians. One has to continuously explain and defend why one is taking that particular position..." Jabbour says it's an uphill battle for Australians to unlearn years of Zionist propaganda... "People seem to make no distinction between an occupied people and those who occupy them. Israel talks about the right of self-defence. How can an occupier claim self-defence but deny the same right to those who are occupied and have the right of self-defence with whatever means are available to them." I wish you and your party every success in getting into Gaza (and coming out - safe and sound). I wish you lots of positive media coverage - and good results. As Loewenstein sums up in his book, "My Israel Question," "The Kadima vision is of a concrete wall, with Jews on one side and as many Arabs as possible on the other. Sooner or later, Israel and the Palestinians will have to meet face-to-face, listen to each other's grievances and negotiate with honesty ... Only then - and on condition that both Israel and the Palestinian state achieve safety and security - will this conflict be resolved. Neither side has a monopoly on suffering, but only one party has the power to end the occupation and to recognise that Israel and Palestine are historically destined to share the same homeland." My prayers go with you all Sir! Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 8:17:54 PM
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Congratulations Ron, I would also like to participate in the Viva Palestina convoy which is trying to mount a peaceful display of solidarity with the long suffering people of Gaza and at the same time take vital supplies to the people who are under siege by the Israelis with the support of Husni Mabarak in Egypt who I understand is obstructing the passage of the convoy at the behest of Benyamin Netanyahu.
I notice you have been under attack by the usual redneck brigade here on olo who have swallowed the Zionist propaganda about Israel having the right to defend themselves ( from Hamas radicals who have been firing Qassam rockets into Israeli occupied territory and so far have killed about 17 total in the whole period ) compared to the Israeli Cast Lead offensive that killed approximately 1400 innocents and wounded many more.If the Zionists participated in meaningful negotiations instead of encroaching even further to expand their settlements, perhaps Hamas who are theelected Government of Gaza, might stop firing their annoying little rockets. Your comparison of the Palestinian and Australian Aborigines dispossession is quite apt. Aborigines have had to fight every inch of the way to establish their prior possession as though the British act of planting a flag in the name of King George meant anything to the Aborigines. I note your mission is peaceful and intentions to further the cause of serving human suffering. The 1948 movement by holocaust survivors to establish a home in Israel received wide spread support around the world. Where it went wrong was when Zionist influences determined to establish an exclusive Jewish State when in truth they should have established a single secular state instead of having to isolate themselves by building walls. Like all Empires; they eventually fail. The walls will come down as they historically have in the past. Posted by maracas1, Wednesday, 30 December 2009 10:29:32 PM
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Has he gone yet?
Posted by HermanYutic, Thursday, 31 December 2009 11:26:09 AM
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It is obvious that Ron believes his own dogma. He writes
'For years the world watched in horror as sectarian and racist violence destroyed the lives of people in South Africa,' I suggest Ron visit SA and see how the coloured are now discriminated against by the more coloured. Ron might also see that he is likely to be a target of violence now in SA more than ever because of the colour of his skin (especially if he is white.) Ron obviously has his head in the sand in denying that many of Israel's enemies see the Israelites as pigs and monkeys. Using human shields is no barrier to many Palestinian terrorist. I hope Ron does not become one of them. Posted by runner, Friday, 1 January 2010 3:56:28 PM
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Cont.
Again you inappropriately and cynically invoke the Holocaust – no need to respond to your fallacious comments on this one. I’m glad you reject the notion of aliyah – should you change your mind & choose to apply it too might reject you! This is probably more wishful thinking (not sure if on my or your part!) – as a Jew, ironically (because of your views), you’d be more than welcome to relocate to Israel. And by the way ‘bushbred’, you need to distinguish between ‘Israelies’ (i.e. Israelis) and Jews – for your information, only around half (7million) of the entire Jewish population (14 million) are indeed Israelis! Posted by MEBDA, Friday, 1 January 2010 4:27:29 PM
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Ron Witton-< December marks the first anniversary of the Israeli invasion of Gaza which brought devastation to a civilian population already suffering years of deprivation and hardship.>
As usual people who condemn the Israelis are selective in their historical starting point. They don’t talk about the history of the Arab leaders collaborating and conspiring with Hitler in World War two. They don’t say that is why Britain was in occupation in Palestine after the war was lost. They don’t mention the all out attack by the Arab states on the Israelis when Britain pulled out , called the six day war; when Israel defeated them and occupied the disputed land. They don’t mention the handing back of a big section of that land in the previous few years in an attempt by Israel to forge a peace deal with the Arabs to stop their rocket attacks. We all saw on the news the Israeli soldiers removing their own reluctant citizens from houses on that land so they could hand it back. Did the Arabs keep their side of that peace deal. No; they fired more rockets into Israel. That’s when Israel again occupied the land. <a population already suffering years of deprivation and hardship> This is an ambiguous statement. Why had the Arabs suffered years of deprivation and hardship? Is this not the fault of their own religious laws which deprive them of so much and force them to have many more children they can provide for? Posted by sharkfin, Monday, 4 January 2010 12:11:31 AM
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correction of the above article:- force them to have more children they can't provide for.>
Posted by sharkfin, Monday, 4 January 2010 12:21:23 AM
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Dear Ron
I wish you Bon Voyage. You have great courage in making this trip and despite the rather sad comments from many on this site, in the eyes of the great majority of the world your cause is a noble one. What the Israeli government was doing at this time a year ago is indefensible wherever we start in history. And I mean the Israeli government and not the Jews. The attempts in some responses to seek to conflate or confuse the two serves only to weaken your opponents' arguments. I admire you and only wish I had the guts to join you. Gavin Mooney Posted by guy, Monday, 4 January 2010 11:10:49 AM
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Guy-<What the Israeli government was doing at this time a year ago is indefensible wherever we start in history.>
Don’t forget the Israeli children blown up in school buses by the Arabs before the wall was built to keep these bombers from freely crossing into Israel. I’d say that was pretty indefensible also. On the contrary wherever you look in history, attacks by one tribe or country against another have been met with violent retaliation. The trouble with the Arabs is they think they should be able to attack with impunity but scream victim when anyone shoots back. They use their own people as shields by firing rockets from the middle of towns and cities, then blame the enemy when civilians get killed when those rocket launching sites are targeted. When has it been indefensible to defend yourself when attacked? The Arabs attacked first in the six day war and have continued to blow up buses and launch rockets into Israel ever since. This is like you continually punching someone on the nose Guy, be prepared to be punched back, hard. Posted by sharkfin, Tuesday, 5 January 2010 9:55:24 PM
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It's quite Ironic when some people recognise Israel's "Right to defend themselves against Arab attacks" but refuse to acknowledge Arab's rights to fight against their occupiers who persist in pushing the boundaries and forcing even more Arabs off land they've farmed for centuries to erect even more jewish settlements, in defiance of UN resolutions.
http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/198C56FD6C0DDB318525768100612B83 Note Australia's decision to abstain in the previous resolution. Our Government has not to my knowledge ever asked the Australian people's views on the Palestinian / Israel situation but instead follow whatever the US decides. I believe Australians would not condone Israels actions against the Palestinians if they were made aware of the last seventy years of Israeli expansionism over Palestine Posted by maracas1, Tuesday, 5 January 2010 11:36:36 PM
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maracas1 “I believe Australians would not condone Israelis actions against the Palestinians if they were made aware of the last seventy years of Israeli expansionism over Palestine”
I am Australian and I am aware of 1967 attempt (failed) by combined Arab and Palestinian forces to sweep Israel into the sea 1972 murder of Israeli athletes in Munich Numerous commercial jets hi jacked by Palestinians in the name of Palestine and innocent bystanders killed by ruthless Palestinian Murderers Numerous incidence of stonewalling by Arafat – aka "the man who never missed an opportunity to miss an opportunity". Multiple rocket attacks by Palestinians on both Lebanon and Gaza into homes and schools in Israel I would seek your public, unequivocal condemnation of these unhuman atrocities before I consider any of “Israels actions against the Palestinians” Posted by Col Rouge, Wednesday, 6 January 2010 6:46:05 AM
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Col Rouge:
embellishing your 'facts' does you no credit. The 1972 Munich kidnap of Israeli atheletes was an effort by a black september faction of the PLO to have Israel release 234 Palestinian prisoners. The death of 11 Israelis along with 5 Palestinians was the result of a botched rescue bid by the Germans and Israelis. Israeli revenge was taken out on Palestinian civilians. Collective punishment is outlawed internationally but continues to be favoured by Israel. Hamas qassam rockets into Israeli occupied territories has killed about 17 people over a period of about 8 years and is mostly a source of annoyance and cannot be compared to operations such as 'cast Lead' that killed over 1400 in the space of 24 days and wounded many more. The real terrorists are the Zionists who control Israel. Palestinian actions have only ever been a struggle for liberation of their homeland from the Zionist decision to turn the 1948 exodus to Israel into an exclusive Jewish state that unilaterally continued to expand into land that had been occupied by Arabs for centuries. As a result of American support through AIPAC, Israel is armed to the teeth and the Palestinians are reduced to throwing stones and home made rockets while suffering Israeli siege and oppression. Viva Palestina ! Posted by maracas1, Wednesday, 6 January 2010 9:04:35 AM
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Thank you for this article! Despite the hate-filled comments you have received in response, I wanted to let you know that I (and probably many many more) was completely uplifted by it and that what matters is your compassion, your conviction and your support for people who have been victimised or oppressed, no matter where they are.
Inspiring! Thanks. Posted by kate99, Wednesday, 6 January 2010 12:24:48 PM
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Maracas 1, <The Munich kidnap of Israeli athletes was an effort by a black September faction of the PLO to have 234 Palestinian prisoners released.>
What were those Palestinians imprisoned for , not attacks on Israel by any chance?. <Hamas rockets into Israel occupied territories have killed about 17people over a period of 8years and cannot be compared to operations such as lead cast that killed over 1400 in the 24days and wounded many more.> The rockets have only killed that many due to Israeli fortiforcations not because Hamas wouldn’t have liked to have killed thousands with those rockets. What if it was arranged for a terrorist group to lob constant rocket attacks into your neighbourhood , I am sure you wouldn’t mind, after all it would be just a bit of an annoyance. Just when in history did the Jews become so displaced? Was it when the Romans were in occupation of the area? It has certainly lead to some serious conflict, in Germany and now in Palestine. Above and beyond the who’s right and who’s wrong in this conflict it is a battle for survival over the land on both sides. In that respect I find it hard to blame either side. They are both fighting to survive Posted by sharkfin, Wednesday, 6 January 2010 11:16:55 PM
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Maracas1 deny Palestinian atrocities against Jewish athletes , ignore Palestinian attacks on civilian airliners and the Palestinian penchant for taking hostages.
Next you will be excusing Idi Amin for kidnapping Israelis and suggesting the only reason one died was because Israel flew overnight into Entebbe to rescue the others Your puerile defence of Palestinian terrorist regime(s), who murder their own, re - Hamas versus PLO, ranks as one of the most pathetic excuses for a post I have ever seen. Posted by Col Rouge, Thursday, 7 January 2010 2:04:58 PM
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Col Rouge,
So , are you therefore saying the Zionists are free to rain death and destruction on defenceless civilians in Gaza because they are Palestinian Civilians and for them having the temerity to elect Hamas as their elected Government ? Are you supportive of the US in supplying the weapons of war for the Israeli's to do it ? and then support Barack Obama remaining silent in full knowledge of the siege ? What value do you place on a Palestinian child compared to the value of an Israeli child ? Do you have a white robe with a pointed white hood in your closet and burn a cross with your fellow rednecks as you chant your racist garbage ? Posted by maracas1, Thursday, 7 January 2010 7:56:07 PM
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In September 1970 the Jordanians carried out a massacre of their fellow Palestinian Arabs. About 25,000 were killed.
The fact is that fellow Arabs hated the Palestinians Arabs. The Islamists (Hamas) made used of the chance to establish themselves and killed-off the non-Muslim Arabs. Today, the Palestinian conflict is between the Islamists and the non-Muslims. The war is now fought in many fronts. In south-Thailand, Philippines, in China -- Xinjiang, Russia -- Checnya, in India --Kashmir, Middle East -- Jerusalem, and a very hot area of conflict is Nigeria, http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,670178,00.html. Whether you are Jew, Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Communist, Marxist, Left or Right, as long as you don't subscribe to Islam, you are at war with Islam because Islam has declared war on you. Islam mandates that you either become a Muslim of be killed or pay a non-Muslim tax. You have no choice when Muslims become the majority in your country. Whatever was true in the Palestinian/Israeli conflict is no longer true and relevant today. Posted by Philip Tang, Thursday, 7 January 2010 9:45:01 PM
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Recently an Muslim-Afghan soldier fired on US and Italian killing some of them.
http://news.brisbanetimes.com.au/breaking-news-world/afghan-soldier-shoots-us-italian-troops-nato-20091230-lixc.html
You can never tell when a Muslim is going to be radicalised and become a jihadist bent on killing non-Muslims.
The West should withdraw from Iraq and Afghanistan. They should instead concentrate on dealing with Islamism on their own country.
Close down all mosques, Islamic schools and expel all the Saudis in Western countries.