Yvoone,
Saying that there can (or should) be rampant abortion, as long as there is not infanticide, is like saying that people can drive recklessly down the road, as long as they wear a seat belt.

The article is on infanticide and abortion, and I would have thought that infanticide and abortion are connected. It is difficult to have infanticide without abortion. Abortion is very important for feminists, similar to divorce, abduction of children from fathers, distortion of information, lying, denigration of males, living of the taxpayer, and artificial reproduction.

Celiva,
I have noted the huge outcry from feminists over the fact that fewer boys are being born in time. This appears to be happening world wide, and feminists all across the world have been calling on governments to investigate why. The noise has been deafening (like not).

http://www.redorbit.com/news/science/1412472/declining_male_birth_rate_baffles_scientists/index.html

It is also interesting that certain drugs taken during feminist supported IVF lead to more baby girls than boys. Feminists all across the world have been very concerned about this also (like not).

How amazing! Some men at a globalisation institute have noticed that sex-selection abortion leads to fewer girl babies. Feminist reproductive rights activists have been commenting on the issues for years. At any feminist conference the delegates from India discuss the complexities of the issue.

I have to say, the problem is not abortion nor medical technology. The problem is a continuing cultural preference for male children, a preference that used to require women to have how ever many babies it took to have a boy, now technology enables that requirement to be circumvented. Of course, the pregnant women may be in a bind - wanting a daughter but pressured to have a son. What the research doesn't say is how many women would personally call pregnancy and birth quits after a couple of girls if only there wasn't the pressure.

It strikes me that this is a challenge for all the hand wringing men. Have a go at being cultural change agents. Daughters are great. Moreover, better social supports in society would mean that offspring of either sex could look after old parents. Feminists are not to blame for the preference for boy babies described here. Go on, men, have a go at breaking down masculinism.

Should be a great campaign - lots of feminists will help once the men get it going - give it a go!

peony

Hi Peony,
Yes it is quite amazing that they finally noticed- but not until they became concerned about the shortage of brides to bring them sons and a fat dowry for their families. Marriage of sons fatten up the parents’ wallets, marriage of daughters is very costly. For parents, it’s worth spending money on their sons, on their education and well being, because the woman he marries will return all the costs to them.
Even though dowries have been banned, these laws haven’t been enforced so nothing has changed.
Women are not allowed any possessions like property or real estate- only sons will inherit from their fathers.

It’s a very complex issue that misogynists like HRS and Stickman deliberately trivialise, and treat the issue as if the women make these choices out of free will and then spin it into a men’s issue.

HRS “It is difficult to have infanticide without abortion.”
It is impossible to have infanticide without an infant. Are you confusing foeticide with infanticide?

Great article, HRS
The article states that globally the rate of boys being born is declining most likely due to causes such as pollution and stress. The fact that there is a naturally occurring drop in the birthrate of boys makes the point of female foeticide even more alarming; if the rate of boy births had remained stable, the discrepancy between the number of birth rates of boys and girls would have been even greater!

You don’t seem the slightest bit concerned about the difficult situation the women in these countries are in.
The whole point is that women are not valued, have a very low status, can improve their status somewhat by having sons and will reduce their status by having daughters.

BTW, IVF doesn't reduce the birth of boys, without IVF there would be no baby at all.

Rasil Basu, director of ‘Vanishing Daughters’ said, “Empowerment of women is the only answer.”

And Indian Dr Amrit Sethi, summed the situation up like this: “The day grooms become available without a hefty price tag attached to them, female foeticide will end.”

Great posts Celivia and Peony.

HRS: <Saying that there can (or should) be rampant abortion, as long as there is not infanticide, is like saying that people can drive recklessly down the road, as long as they wear a seat belt.>

Who says that? Who has ever said there should be ‘rampant’ abortion? Perhaps the male government of China, but not a woman. Men maybe, but not a woman.

Having an abortion brings risks, fewer than a pregnancy, but it has risks nevertheless, like every single surgical procedure. Only a person who hates women would advocate abortion as a first choice for contraception.

There are some of you who read the word ‘abortion’ and start foaming at the mouth. It makes it impossible for you to remain even slightly rational or logical and look at what is the real problem. I find that curious, especially if you are so against abortion.

You are not at all interested in saving foetuses, you don’t give a toss about foetuses, babies or children. You don’t even pretend you do. It is control over women you want. Uterus envy plain and simple. That women could have any power at all rankles deeply with some men.

The only issue in this debate is why are male infants valued and female infants not. This should concern those opposed to abortion and those in favour of choice. So, if you want to add to the discussion get off your anti-abortion-hate-those-women hobby horse. With so many women hating men about it is becoming clearer why a woman might want to spare a daughter that.

My comment about the value of women increasing because of a shortage of female births links directly to this. It should appeal to the male psyche. It is pure economics, capitalism in it's purest form, so beloved by the far right.

Celivia,
As an aware and loving feminist, I’m surprised you didn’t know that the rate of boys being born is declining in countries across the world.

As an aware and loving feminist, I’m surprised you didn’t know that the drugs women take during IVF often result in more baby girls being born than boys.

As an aware a loving feminist, I’m surprised that you call people misogynist, when you have no proof of misogyny (or perhaps feminists are simply trained in universities to call anyone else a misogynist).

Unregulated abortion leads to many problems, and I’m sure feminists would be aware of this when calling for more unregulated abortion. But I think a more urgent problem in India would be the huge number of orphaned and abandoned children (estimated 2 million). This is something I’m sure loving feminists would be aware of, but loving feminists still keep pressing for IVF in countries such as Australia (to be paid for by the taxpayer of course), instead of adoption of orphaned and abandoned children.

http://infochangeindia.org/20060307241/Children/Features/India-is-home-to-the-largest-number-of-AIDS-orphans-in-the-world.html

Feminism = abortion, divorce, abduction of children from fathers, denigration of males, calling other people misogynist, dissemination of misinformation, living off the taxpayer, and of course artificial reproduction.

Yvoone,
More boys might be born in India than girls, but what do you think of the situation where the number of boys being born worldwide is decreasing compared to girls. As another aware and loving feminist, do you think this is a good thing or not?

HRS your true colours are showing, Just because you had a bitter divorce and have no or restricted access to your children that is no reason to refuse women the right to terminate unwanted babies. It's immaterial whether the baby is not wanted because the mother can't care for the child, or can't feed another child, doesn't want a girl or the baby is deformed.