The reality is that the supporters of porn and abortion are the murderers and rapist of our day. The arrogance of those who question the right of God to be God is incredible. Yes He did order the destruction of people who offered kids up as sacrifices (in the name of culture) and gave His land to the Israelites. It would be hilarous if it was not sad that the created try and give the Creator a moral lecture and question His goodness and kindness. The fact that He allows such arrogant people to breathe is testimony of His long suffering and patience.

"Not all Muslims are inherently violent."
"Moderate" Muslims are mostly sitting on their deceitful and cowardly asses, doing little or nothing to actually STOP the lunatics in their midst from DELIBERATELY blowing up women and children in marketplaces, cutting off the heads of hostages with a dull knife while the hostages are still alive, stoning women to death on the mere SUSPICION of infidelity, passing the death sentence on 15 year-old girls in Iran, Pakistan, etc. who have been charged with "prostitution" after being raped, murdering Christian schoolgirls in Indonesia with machetes, executing apostates and "heretics", carrying out acts of terrorism against the very democratic systems of Europe which have given them legal residence and refuge, and becoming more enraged over pictures of naked men at Abu Ghraib than they are over the body parts of children who have been shredded by suicide bombers who knew exactly whom they were targeting. These ongoing atrocities are not accidents. They are not "collateral damage". They are PREMEDITATED. It is NOT the moderate Muslims who are setting the agenda for international Islamic expansion. When you hear Muslims talk about "peace and tolerance", just ask yourself how tolerant they will be when and if THEY become a majority in western democracies within a hundred years, given their birthrate and volume of immigration. Among Muslims, western "imperialism" is always defined in the most expansive terms, even if the alleged imperialism only involves trade. Essentially forgotten is the fact that most of what is now the "Muslim World" became Muslim mainly through naked military conquest and frequent genocidal pillaging campaigns that were excused, of course, by the rationale of religious "cleansing". Jihadist ideology is explicitly imperialist, yet, it is often portrayed by its apologists in the West as "resistance" to imperialism. Ludicrous!
When will Leftists and other apologists for Islam actually LISTEN to what Muslim fanatics are openly saying? Do they think the medieval lunatics are simply engaging in hyperbole? When will we finally wake up to the fact that Muslim immigration to western democratic nations is, indeed, a long-term suicidal security risk?

BOAZ,
I didn't accuse you of implying that the death of children was "Good" but it was you who brushed off the significance of the numbers as "spin" (ie creating a false bad impression).

Meanwhile here are just some of the things that were banned under the sanctions -

Agricultural pesticides
Baby food
Bandages
Blankets
Cannulas for intravenous drips and catheters for babies
Cobalt sources for X-ray machines
Dialysis equipment
Disposable surgical gloves
Drugs for angina and epilepsy
ECG monitors
Medical gauze, swabs and syringes
Nasogastric tubes
Soap, sanitary towels
Specific umbilical catheters
Stethoscopes
Suction catheters for blockages surgical instruments
Tooth brushes and toothpaste
X-ray equipment and X-ray film

- but one of the biggest problems was the banning of chlorine and other water purifying chemicals.

Although medicines per se were said to be exempt, many basic ones were banned because of their potential to be used in the manufacture of WMDs.

You figure out what impact this would have on a war ravaged society.

Hi Goodthief: “In tracking this back to the establishment of Israel, are you saying that, if it weren’t for that, Islam and the rest of the world would be at peace?”
I think that there would still be some tensions between the different sects of Islam, and Islam and the West but I don’t think there would be anywhere near the level of terrorist activity and hence not such a widespread fear and hatred of Muslims. This is not an indictment on the creation of Israel as that is altogether a separate issue. As I have said, Islam has its fair share of problems. The main one being that the absence of a Reformation and Enlightenment means that there is a wider prevalence of fundamentalism in Islam than there is in Judaism and Christianity. I think that anger at America for its unconditional support of Israel and for example, the arming of Saddam Hussein, is what gave rise to groups such as Al-Qaeda.

I think the terrorist masterminds exploit the religious devotion and helplessness of many Muslims who feel utterly defeated. Notice that it is not bin Laden or his fellow leaders who volunteer to strap on a bomb, they are quite happy to get others to do that. If they truly believed that a reward awaited them, you’d think they would be the first to do the deed.

I disagree that Fitna is a call to awareness. Propaganda such as that is not designed to spark dialogue but incite hatred and fear. Wilders has often stated that he thinks Islam is incapable of reforming "not now, not in a million years". These are not the words of someone interested in promoting dialogue. I do think something needs to be done about the prevalence of radical Muslim clerics and I wish I knew what the answer is. But I truly believe that films like Fitna make an already dangerous and fearful situation so much worse. In my honest opinion, I think the more the West demonises Islam, the more Islamic fundamentalism will increase.

I really appreciate your intelligent comments,
Ruby

The “West” does not have to demonise Islam. Any rational person who studies the Quran and Hadith will come across the constant incitement to violence and other insane rantings. Even if the Jews did not exist, Muslims would still hate Jews because the Quran and Hadith tells them to. Islam demonises itself.

With all the apologetics and “Islam means peace” rubbish that is spun, it is only inevitable that films like Fitnah are made. More films like Fitna would be made if it was’nt for the harassment and death threats issued by followers of Muhammed’s insane message.

My hat off to Mr Wilder’s for being brave enough to expose the violent message of Islam.

In reply to RubySoho's post of Sunday, 13 April 2008 1:13:54 PM

Actually I do think that the Malay Muslim (not Malaysian) hatred or dislike of Australia has a lot to do with Islam and it this twisted victim mentality which seems to permeate the Muslim world which was easily inflamed by the former Malaysian Prime Minister. Why else would the adherents of a so-called "religion of peace" find it so easy to hate or dislike another people and nation, especially when that country had been supportive of their own nation in the past? (In 1965 Australian troops served in Borneo as part of Commonwealth forces during the period of Konfrontasi between a belligerent Indonesia and Malaysia.)

I brought the Malay Muslim opinion into this discussion because Malaysia is seen as a "moderate" Muslim (dominated) nation. One can only imagine that the popular opinion regarding Western nations is far more hateful in less moderate Muslim-dominated nations.

You also mention in your very last post that, "I truly believe that films like Fitna make an already dangerous and fearful situation so much worse. In my honest opinion, I think the more the West demonises Islam, the more Islamic fundamentalism will increase".

Could it be that sympathy and support for Islamic fundamentalism arises independently of films like Fitna or the Danish "Mo" cartoons? Was it "revenge" for the Danish cartoons that led the Sudanese authorities to act so appallingly in 2007 during the case of British teacher Gillian Gibbons and the teddy bear that was to be called Mohammad? Or a desire to distract attention from the actions of the Sudanese government in allowing the murder and repression of non-Arabs in Darfur? Are people in the West somehow supposed to ignore actions like these - both Darfur and the teddy bear incident - when they are orchestrated by governments that call themselves Islamic?

And what too are we supposed to make of the peddling of the vile anti-Semitic fabrication known as The Protocols of the Elders of Zion as an historical fact in much of the Arab world? Ignore that as well?