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The Forum > Article Comments > Self-defence or brutal occupation? > Comments

Self-defence or brutal occupation? : Comments

By Antony Loewenstein and Peter Slezak, published 4/4/2008

On the world stage Israel has been traditionally cast as David in a battle against Goliath. But this is too simplistic.

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Ginx

I really must say that I am incredibly offended by you remarks. When a well educated and balanced person like yourself attacks me in such a manner I must confess I feel the need to critically re examine my whole belief system. I am only thankful that you spared me from your famous ability to make sharp and witty nicknames for those who don't hold to your standards of intellectual rigour. And I suppose I should also be thankful you haven't used your verrrrry impressive powers of observation to point out my appalling spelling.

Whats that you say. You’re restricting yourself to 25 words or less. Hmmm interesting.
I've got to say that being "schooled" in such a manner by a hormonal teenage girl has really deflated me. I think I might have a cup of bex and a good lie down .... Please don’t pick on me anymore, I can’t stand it.
Posted by Paul.L, Thursday, 10 April 2008 2:34:13 PM
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No guaranties Paully. Enjoy your rest.
Posted by Ginx, Thursday, 10 April 2008 2:38:51 PM
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Bushbred,

I notice you didn’t argue any of my points. I had a quick look at the course “The Changing Global Political Economy” and whilst it seems heavily left wing biased they still use phrases like “ XYZ argues that …., while ABC sees the issue in terms of ….”. Certainly the course co-ordinator isn’t making the claims of truth in the manner in which you have put forward.

In any case I have provided you with two sources that suggest that militarily the Israeli and Arab armies had equipment of similar effectiveness and that the Arabs had significant numerical advantages, at least initially. Kissinger always said that he supported the existence of Israel and helping to arm Israel to prevent it from being wiped out is hardly an imperialist act. I mean how many billions of dollars of aid flowed to the soviets during ww2? How many billions did lend lease make available to the British in order to defend themselves. Roosevelt wanted the US to be the arsenal of democracy. In this context arming Israel is continuing a noble tradition.

Don’t you think that Saddams nuclear installation posed a greater threat to Israel than it did to the US? The US didn’t need to tell Israel to bomb the O’Chirac reactor. The threat it posed would have been obvious to PM Begin and his cabinet.

BBC 7/6/1981 The Israelis have bombed a French-built nuclear plant near Iraq's capital, Baghdad, saying they believed it was designed to make nuclear weapons to destroy Israel. http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/june/7/newsid_3014000/3014623.stm

"The American Century" is a term coined by Time publisher Henry Luce used to claim preeminence of the United States during the 20th century. It was not a statement of imperialism.

I actually have academic experience, I’ve been a tutor. But that is irrelevant. Whatever you are or were you have no claim as an historian because you aren’t arguing the toss based upon primary sources. You’re talking about having the “absolute truth” because an American tutor told you so, or you learned it in a class. That’s not even a decent tertiary source.
Posted by Paul.L, Thursday, 10 April 2008 5:27:17 PM
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OLO class mates please accept my apologies concerning Henry Kissinger’s role in Israeli-Arab wars when the passage used had only been taken from an outline which portrayed Kissinger’s role as covering both the 1967 Six Day War and the Yom Kippur War which occurred seven years after the latter.

Although the Soviets had supplied the Arabs with arms in previous engagements, it seems they were only similar to the lighter armaments apparently supplied from Soviet occupied Czecho-Slovakia mentioned previously

A different story was when the Soviets became more resolute about finishing off the Israelis once and for all, supplying the Arabs with their top range tanks and planes. Please read below from JEWISH NEWS et al:

With Egyptian and Syrian forces now inflicting heavy losses on Israel’s army and air force through better quality Soviet supplies, a panicked Jewish state pleaded with America for help.

Facing the worst possible losses, Prime Minister Golda Meir decided to fly to Washington personally to plead with President Nixon for help.

It was when US Secretary of State Henry Kissinger ordered hundreds of the latest tanks and planes to be immediately dispatched to Israel to counter the power of the latest Soviet supplies.

It was after the successful end to the Yom Kippur War that the US quadrupled its yearly aid to Israel from 535 million dollars to 2.1 billion. Also as a result of the special Camp David Awards Israel’s grants went up to 3 billion.

So it was from then on and doubtless with the help of Henry Kissinger , US Head of State, that the US came closer to Israel, but at the same time it has been interestingly said that Israel won't need America so much. (I wonder?)

Once again apologies for picturing Kissinger in a more extensive historical role, yet it was apparently only three years after the Six Day War that the youngish Kissinger had worked his way up to be US Head of State.

Looks like still some things to find out?

Cheers, BB - WA.
Posted by bushbred, Thursday, 10 April 2008 5:39:52 PM
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