RobP:

You've hit the nail on the head, but here's what I gather Professional Aboriginalists such as Stephen Hagen (and their white enablers) don't want Aboriginals to become western. They want the benefits and the trinkets, but not the thought processes that create the benefits. They deride assimilated Aborigines as “coconuts.” Is this just an Internet phenomenon, or is it real? You tell me.

Jim:

You accuse me of ignorance about Australia, while your comments betray your ignorance of US/Indian history. After the Plains Wars, Indian tribes received reservations, some of which are bigger than smaller states. They have mineral rights and royalties are paid to them when their land is used by the Federal Government – which I support totally.

It's clear you don't respect intellectual achievement and you suffer from a huge inferiority complex as regards the US, having turned this entire exchange into a slanging match based on nationality.

I would LOVE to see an Aboriginal kid do well in the Maths Competition. That would do more to boost pride in Aboriginality that all this ochre-and-face-painting and pseudo-traditional dancing nonsense. And unlike you - I think it's possible. You just have to want it badly enough, and work for it.

Col Rouge:

I wish I were as pithy as you.

Poverty in remote areas is no mystery. Indian reservations tend to be poor, because they are isolated, but do not exhibit the utter degradation I read about in “Little Children are Sacred.”

What is at the heart of this? What's the difference between a remote Indian reservation and a remote Aboriginal community? I'm not asking this to act superior. I just want to hear your perspective.

Paul:

Thanks for advice – follow it yourself. I quoted from a book by a well-known scholar, not only internet sources. Australia is a 14-hour flight away and hard to get to by train. I didn't realize this forum was for Australians only.

Since it requires a certain amount of wit to have a sense of humour, it's unsurprising that bitter old Col doesn't have one. However, as an Alf Garnett clone he does provide a certain amount of amusement to those of us who do have one.

Col recommends travel in order to broaden the mind - perhaps if he'd travelled as extensively, and actually lived and worked in non-Western societies as I have, his worldview might indeed be broadened from its current smugly neocolonial straitjacket. I'm not surprised that he was happy in Texas, where there's not only heaps of jails but also an impressive execution rate.

Actually, a superciliously racist prat like Col wouldn't last 5 minutes in some of the places around the world where I've lived and worked, so perhaps he should continue to restrict his travels to Western countries.

Massachusetts, eh lizz? I'm sure you have wide experience of indigenous people in that most genocidally conquered of American states. That might help to explain your apparently almost total lack of understanding of indigenous issues. Mind you, if you're reading books by people like Jo Flood now, there may be hope for you yet.

"I wish I were as pithy as you"

Yeth, he ith, ithn't he? Hith argumenth are pith-weak too.

Welcome Liz, pay no heed to the leftists who actually do live under lichen covered rocks and only emerge to attack those people who desire plentiful use of 'common sense'.
For years everyone has gibbered about the Poor Aboriginals and how badly they are treated.
As soon as someone tries to do something positive to get these folk out of the dark abyss, the cries of racism begin.
In truth the status quo of keeping the natives down is quite profitable to those with vested interests. Hence the shrieks.
Your comments are valuable and interesting.

Lizz-the-Yank I am not familiar with the environs of Native American Indians, however I suspect they display many similarities to Australian aboriginal settlements.

The problem is the same, appeasement of the vanquished by the victor, at the behest of the limp-wristed, spineless and guilt ridden socialists among us.

I abhor and deplore any sort of institutionalized racial or social differentiation.

I think the worst thing I found in USA when I lived there was the continual requirement to disclose ones racial origin on just about every government document and the affirmative action agendas, which meant that anyone could qualify for a soft government business loan provided they were not of Anglo-Saxon origin and not male.

On a positive note, I believe and cherish the notion that everyone is an individual, that we only deserve what we achieve for ourselves and that, regardless of what hand we are dealt, we are all equally responsible for making the most of it.

If people stopped looking for excuses to why they should be excused from being all that they might become, then the world would be a happier and more contented place.

CJMorgan “Actually, a superciliously racist prat like Col wouldn't last 5 minutes in some of the places around the world where I've lived and worked,”

LOL I have obviously got under your skin.

It is a dullard who brags their “superiority” by suggesting others could not endure their experiences (in CJM case, I am likely to find the "mediocrity" of the experience the real challenge).

It is the faux-bravado of the under-achiever, pretending their existence actually mattered or meant anything.

For myself, I made conscious decisions about where I would go to live and where I would not (eg I have knocked back offers from Caribbean, Zimbabwe, UAE, Saudi etc, and crossed South America and most of Asia off my “choice list” before I even started).

CJM your observations to “worldly travels” confirms the likelihood that when it came to it, as a “beggar”, you are were not a “chooser”

(I trust my “pithiness” is not too “acerbic” for you

Alf Garnett: "I have knocked back offers from Caribbean, Zimbabwe, UAE, Saudi etc, and crossed South America and most of Asia off my 'choice list' before I even started"

Absolutely - very hard to get good fish and chips in those places.

The worldview that Col displays so eloquently in this forum seems entirely commensurate with his world experience. I guess he survived in Texas because there's plenty of beans to count there too - I wonder if he got into one of the true delights of Texas (chili) while he was there? Mmmmm.... beans.

Col, have you ever managed to get out of the city since you've been in Australia - like to places where you might actually get to meet some of the Aboriginal people about whom you have such disparaging views? I live in the bush and I interact with Aboriginal people every day, very few of whom resemble the stereotypical mendicant that you and lizz apparently think is typical of Indigenous people in Australia.

Your racism, like all racism, is derived from ignorance. Your comments betray the artificiality of your prejudice. If I was of similarly odious temperament, I could suggest that this is what we'd expect from a whingeing Pom and a crass Yank.

But I'm not, so I won't :)

Spare us the imported racism of immigrants (Col) and foreigners (lizz)! Maybe the closed borders crew have a point after all :)

"perhaps if he'd travelled as extensively, and actually lived and worked in non-Western societies as I have, "

Note the past tense. Lefties like "CJ" always make sure to return to a nice, comfortable Western society. It's fun to go on a humanitarian tourist spree, then come home and run down Western civilization - with a computer (created by eevil white men) and a nice refrigerated drink (brought to you by eevil white men) in your hand, after you've taken a shower with clean running water (more stuff brought to you by eevil white men...) and so on. Third World conditions are so ennobling - let someone else walk the walk, while the noble leftist talks the talk.

"Pith-weak". Not funny. I would suggest speech therapy, but I think CJ's problems go much deeper than that.

Col Rouge, I did not mean to turn this into a US/Australia slagging match, but to try to figure out why things are so bad with the Indigenous Australians. American Indians vary - some groups such as the Choctaw in Georgia do quite well. The Navajo (with which I am somewhat familiar having lived in Arizona) own a good chunk of the state and also do fairly well. Yes, life expectancy is 7 years lower, alcoholism, diabetes and heart disease are bad. But the situation with Aborigines is waay worse. Why?

mickijo: Thanks, and I'll definitely drop by when I think I have something to say. I think Australia is a great country. Thus its anguish with Indigenous issues puzzles me. I have sympathy for the Aborigines because they are trying to do something very hard: join a globalized, technological society for which they quite naturally have much suspicion. I'm familiar with the CJ type of leftists: long on abuse and insult, short on facts. I note that he has not addressed one issue I brought up rationally. I am fairly sure he's a man with aggression issues. With friends like that, the Aborigines hardly need enemies.