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The Forum > Article Comments > Is masculinity really in crisis? > Comments

Is masculinity really in crisis? : Comments

By Peter West, published 2/10/2006

Love, lust and conflict

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Masculinity in crisis? Only if the male population is too lilly-livered to stand their ground and stick to their guns (figuratively speaking of course). As a woman I get bombarded with messages on a daily basis telling me that I am not good enough (not smart enough, not pretty enough, not slim enough, not caring enough, not feminine enough, not tough enough - the list is endless). If I choose to listen to them, and suffer poor self-esteem as a result, then that's my loss. I say the same to all the men out there, particularly those that have posted whinging messages so far. Stop being such cry-babies! If you are worried about the messages that women are sending to men, then stop listening. Do what YOU want to. Of course you will probably need to come to some compromise from time to time - most of us do in order to get along in society, but you dont need to compromise how you think. There are plenty of men out there that are still unapologetic sexist pigs - I dont like them and they dont like me. Generally though, they can do as they please, socialise with like-minded people and think whatever they like. They, like everyone else, simply need to modify their behaviour from time to time to fit in with the social setting that they are in. Apart from that, who cares!
Posted by Country Gal, Wednesday, 4 October 2006 9:23:41 AM
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Silversurfer, what's the name of that town?
Posted by Hasbeen, Wednesday, 4 October 2006 10:40:24 AM
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Country Gal

Read what's being said above you. When man bashing has been institutionalised then it's hard to fight and both genders suffer.

Great idea silver surfer, just like you to know that at the largely female patrons of a health resort that I work at are feeling the pain and the younger generation is taking notice.
Posted by CARNIFEX, Wednesday, 4 October 2006 11:24:32 AM
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I find it unusual that based on Lathamsmost recent and wacky assertions that masculinity is some how in crisis it generates a response - it is as if his opinion carries more weight than the bloke who cuts my hair.

Lathams went on - at least in the a piece in the Age I read - to bemoan the loss of terms such as dinky di , ridgy didge and fair dinkum -,

Now I am older than Latham but not by much - and like poor poor Mark, as he ALWAYS reminds us he grew up in Commission housing in poor circumstances- Well so did I and squillions of others and we certainly dont go banging on about it.

In addition my old man was an alcoholic, my mother suffered from bi polar disorder, I spent my child hood in visitors lounges of mental institutions - but still my parents instilled in me values god dammit - just like Marks mum did for him! I even went to university - 3 of them - But I NEVER EVER EVER saw or heard the terms dinky di- ridgy didge or fair dinkum used all that often to the point I thought they were vital to the nations interest. Maybe I read them in Ginger Meggs comics - but even then they were dated.

I mean, this has bugger all to do with the topic I know, but lets relegate Mark to the dust bin of history along with David Flint and it seems sadly Margaret Whitlam. And as for masculinity - I'd rather be a person first
Posted by sneekeepete, Thursday, 5 October 2006 8:39:14 AM
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CITIZEN SAID:
"A man without a job is as useless as tits on a bull" to which I say 7fold AMEN!

GECKO SAID:
I have always maintained that the worst mistake made by the feminist movement was to presume that women could build their self-esteem by belittling the self-esteem of men.

For a change I totally agree with the lizardy one.

SEE this link for an account of how loss of male self esteem DESTROYED A WHOLE CULTURE !
http://www.anthroprof.org/documents/Docs102/102articles/steelAxes.pdf#search=%22lauriston%20sharp%20steel%20axes%22

We are DYING and we don't even know it. Because it is happening slowwwwwwly. Like the diseases smokers will get... it doesn't happen over night, but as sure as night follows day... it WILL happen.

We open a door for a female, and are told not be chauvenist ?
We give up our seat for a female... and we are looked at weird.
We walk on the 'road' side of the pavement with our female friend (so we cop the splashes not them)
We love to be told 'ooh.. strong man' when we shift something very heavy.
We expend ourselves and spill our guts on the battle field, in gut wrenching hand to hand combat and are told 'women can do this also' when we know they cannot.

Take away the social ques, the signals by which we define ourselves, and you destroy 'us'.

I totally support the idea of female access to independance, education, and I'd rather be a tit on a cow than on a bull, having purpose and useful function. But I'd encourage females to seek their independance in creative ways, preferably from a home based environment (those who marry mainly) opening up many more opportunities for 'bull tits' to take their needed and rightful place.
Not to mention the other outcome of lower housing prices, which quickly ROCKETED as most families became dual income, wiping out the temporary financial advantage of both working. Now we have TWO stressed and tired parents at the end of the day rather than one.
Posted by BOAZ_David, Thursday, 5 October 2006 9:38:28 AM
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Posing the question "Is masculinity in Crisis" avoids the real issue of whether men (and that includes boys and youths) are being well served by and are satisfied with, the masculinity that presently exists in Australia.

There are also issues surrounding limitations, especially structural ones, that mitigate against boys, youths and men having meaningful lives in our society.

Just consider one question: "Are men happy with the social mores, implied and otherwise, that cause men to be fragmented against one another, so that even the physical closeness that should exist between a father and his son, or brother and brother, is seen as odd and is frowned upon."

Another question: "Why is it wrong for men to have male refuges where they can share and care for one another, yet it is OK for women to have all women clubs and interest groups?"

To claim that men are 'cry babies' because they want to discuss their inhibited development and limitations is to go along with the cruel socialialisation of boys, where even an infant boy cannot cry lest he show weakness (and it is mum and women who chastise him for it).

What is wrong with men that they haven't leapt forward to ask Peter West to define, describe and defend the 'masculinity' he seems to be in favour of - one defined through (wrong) feminist notions of men.

Before anyone frvolously suggests I am arguing for a return to the male only bars of yesteryear, of course I am not.
Posted by Cornflower, Thursday, 5 October 2006 11:36:16 AM
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