The Forum > Article Comments > The debacle that is East Timor > Comments
The debacle that is East Timor : Comments
By Jim Morris, published 7/6/2006Contrary to the propaganda it was always just East Timorese against East Timorese.
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Posted by Proud to be Indonesian, Tuesday, 20 June 2006 12:44:26 AM
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LOL, the GAM's sole aim was independence: they failed. Aceh has no financial nor political independence, they have legal autonomy to implement Islamic sharia law (with appeals available to Indonesian Supreme Court), but this was given by central govt in 2001 and has nothing to do with MoU. GAM does not represent Aceh, as 25% of the population are non-Acehnese whose hobby was to behead GAM rebels and who are now demanding creation of new province separate from Aceh. Most ethnic-Acehnese people themselves are loyal Indonesians; our current ambassador to Australia who are actively fighting against Papuan separatism is an Acehnese. The owner of Indonesian newspaper who bash Australia the most over the Papuan visa issue is an Acehnese.
Far from any "victory", MoU was a total defeat for GAM. It is only due to benevolent Indonesian amnesty, the armed rebels were granted extension on their lives instead of being shot dead like their "commander" Syafei. There is a lesson from the MoU: armed rebellion against Indonesia is useless. As I said, Indonesian people consider our borders as final and non-negotiable. Thanks to our democracy, it is there will never be any tolerance for Hitlerite separatism in the future in accordance with will of the Indonesian people. The most fervent defender of Indonesian unity has always been the nationalist PDI-P party whose most powerful base is in the extremely nationalistic Bali. Balinese people are the original Indonesians, our first president Sukarno is half-Balinese. The Balinese people will never tolarate separatism, Balinese soldiers always distinguished themselves in counter-insurgency campaigns in East Timor. It was soldiers from Bali who ambushed and killed the commander of GAM rebels along with his wife and his entire retinue of "bodyguards". Posted by Proud to be Indonesian, Tuesday, 20 June 2006 1:05:28 AM
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Proud to be Javanese says:
“Balinese people are the original Indonesians, our first president Sukarno is half-Balinese. The Balinese people will never tolarate separatism,” Dream-on! There use to be a country called Yugoslavia Its Leader (& chief advocate ) Tito was of Croatian extraction. Today Croatia is an independent state. There used to be a country called the USSR One of Its leaders Stalin was of Georgian extraction Today Georgia is an independent state. VIVA INDEPENDENT EAST TIMOR VIVA FRETILIN VIVA MAU-BERE PEOPLE VIVA 28th NOVEMBER VIVA DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF EAST TIMO Posted by Horus, Tuesday, 20 June 2006 6:20:33 AM
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@proud
It must be embarrassing for you that a "foreigner" seems to be more aware of Indonesian history and politics than yourself. Especially considering how partisan your malformed opinions are. With regards to federalism it is quite clear you have missed the point. Once again, federalism is merely a means to an end. The end itself is greater local autonomy and democracy. Instead of opposing federalism per se, perhaps you should be explicit about your politics and state that you oppose local autonomy and democracy. In contrast to your claims I would suggest that the continuation of federal systems in Brazil, Germany, Australia and even the United States are unnecessary and hold back further development of said nations. They served their purpose once; but no more. As a partisan and rigid thinker, you appear unable to consider the possibility that political science considers unitary states superior in some circumstances and federal states superior in others. In the diverse cultures of the Malay archipelago a federal system is a better system to ensure human rights which much have priority over the enforced unity of any state. Surely the relative success (stable democracy, GDP PPP 300% higher) of the Malaysian federation is an obvious hint. Your claims that Acheh has no financial or political independence is clear proof that you haven't read the MoU. As any other reader can discern the MoU counters your point of view in 1.1.2 (a), 1.3.1 - 1.3.9 (inclusive), and 1.4.2. Your example of Sukarno is hilariously irrelevant. Posted by Lev, Tuesday, 20 June 2006 9:50:37 AM
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@Lev:
LOL, it is hilarious you keep peddling your "federalism" here. Save your breath, online peddling is always useless. Indonesian people are the one who decide what system of govt we want. We are great country with heroic history, we've always choose our own path since independence, we value foreigners' "opinion" like toilet-paper. Indonesian people has always rejected inferior federalism in favour of our superior system of unitary state. We Indonesians know by choosing unitary state, we are defending the primacy of human rights by preventing Yugoslavia-like civil wars. Only unitary state promoted real autonomy and pure democracy, unlike the divisive secterianism promoted by federalism. Your inferior "federalism" ran against the will of the people, hence federalism continue being rejected while our superior unitary state will continue for eternity. Your reference to Malaysia hilariously shows your total ignorance, as Malaysia is not a democracy nor do they have real autonomy, but it is a virtual one-party state under UMNO where dissenters are jailed without trial. http://edition.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/05/15/malaysia.mahathir/index.html Aceh has no financial nor political independence as stated by the MoU, which basically just re-stated regional autonomy given by central govt back in 2001. In other words, MoU is basically just a document for the surrender of GAM. @Horus: Thanks for outlining examples of bloody failures of the bankrupt federal system in Yugoslavia and USSR. I hope these examples became food for thought for Lev. Indeed Balinese people will never tolerate separatism. Their party PDI-P strongly lobbied against MoU with GAM as they prefer to continue the fun of shooting rebels as ordered by our half-Balinese president Megawati. Balinese soldiers always enjoyed eating the hearts of dead Falintil guerillas and keeping their ears as souvenirs. Just look at the corpse of GAM "commander" Abdullah Syafei after Balinese soldiers were done with him: http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g110/rpurnomo/syafie_dies.jpg BTW shouting online is useless, mate. East Timor will always be a failed state, currently it is rapidly losing its "independence" and is well on its way into becoming an Australian colony. Poor East Timor, from a Portuguese colony to Indonesian province back to Australian colony. Quite pathetic indeed. http://www.wsws.org/articles/2006/jun2006/etim-j20.shtml Posted by Proud to be Indonesian, Wednesday, 21 June 2006 2:24:42 PM
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LOL, peddling your "federalism" in this forum is useless. Indonesian people has always rejected inferior federal system and rose-up to demolish it the last time an outsider try to force that backward system upon us. Today, no Indonesian want to overthrow our superior unitary state system and implement federalism. What a foreigner, especially some Australian, think about it doesn't matter for us. Our superior system is fine as it is, it works without serious problem. Deal with it.
"Unitary systems of government can only work in states where there is a single culture."
By contrast, federal system can only work in monoculture states. In indigenously multicultural states, federalism proved disastrous as it promotes ethnic-chauvinism and intercine hatred. Look at the federal states of Yugoslavia, USSR, or Nigeria where tens of thousands died annually in inter-ethnic violence. Federal systems that don't cause too much bloodshed was in monocultural countries like neo-European states of USA and Australia (dominated by Anglo-Saxons), Brazil (dominated by Portuguese), or Germany. Even there, the US federal system came close to collapse during the very bloody American Civil War while you said yourself federalism failed in Australia. It is clear federalism is a failed and inferior system. We Indonesians know this very well, hence our brilliant move to destroy federalism back in 1950.