Salam

you may not find too much support here, but don't despair at least you've got our Kim, who has pontificated (with apologies to catholics) on the evils of the cartoons.

I found the virgins cartoon amusing, but I'm an atheist and I think all religions are legitimate targets for ridicule. Unfortunately Atheists do not lend themselves easily to cartoonists.

ButI think you miss the point of the cartoon.

The figure of Mohammed is not intended as a charicature of him; the cartoon must be seen as a whole, which is to ridicule (possibly extreme) islamic beliefs concerning heavenly incentives offered to suicide bombers.

If you look at it this way, does this change your view at all?

One other point, I suggest that originally there was no intention to direct the jokes at Muslims, since Muslim Numbers are very low in Denmark,and hence readership; perhaps also an expectation that any Danish Muslims reading it would be sufficiently broadminded to see the intended humour, or to ignore it.

Perhaps you will also advise this forum your position on Sharia Law; would you like it to become Australian Law? Just interested; I am trying to put a picture together. I want to understand how an intelligent person can become so upset by something so trivial.

In 1784 Immanuel Kant wrote a short essay: "WHAT IS ENLIGHTENMENT?"

(see http://www.english.upenn.edu/~mgamer/Etexts/kant.html)

His answer:

"Enlightenment is man's release from his self-incurred tutelage. Tutelage is man's inability to make use of his understanding without direction from another", it is akin to a state of "domestic cattle"

Enlightenment "is the freedom to make public use of one's reason at every point", a public use that "must always be free, and it alone can bring about enlightenment among men"

"To unite in a permanent religious institution which is not to be subject to doubt before the public even in the lifetime of one man [eg. present-day uncritical Islam], and thereby to make a period of time fruitless in the progress of mankind toward improvement, thus working to the disadvantage of posterity—-that is absolutely forbidden”

Indeed, anything that hampers the human capacity to progress "would be a crime against human nature"

From this "spirit of freedom" is deduced a “right of mankind” which extends beyond one's own community (ethnic, religious, etc.) or national borders, since every human is "a member of the whole community or of a society of world citizens"

Moreover, rather than any Allah deciding, "the touchstone of everything that can be concluded as a law for a people lies in the question whether the people could have imposed such a law on itself". This question also goes for "what they find necessary for their spiritual welfare"

And the primary duty of any sovereign is "to prevent one of them [citizens, sub-communities] from violently hindering another in determining and promoting this [spiritual] welfare to the best of his ability".

Thus, Hamas’ "democratic" victory is nonetheless a human rights violation (http://www.jcpa.org/text/Christian-Persecution-Weiner.pdf).

Democracy only has a chance amidst "open-minded criticism": "Our age is, in especial degree, the age of criticism, and to criticism everything must submit".

That is, one must "freely submit for public testing their judgments and views which here and there diverge from the established symbol"

In your last article you were unsure what our flag represented. Answer: an open-ended, transformative secular culture, and therefore one of true substance and bravery.

seiko-jin,

You make a very good point. All the more reason to condemn Muslims in the middle-classes as the REAL political antagonists sending their poor off to war.

Pericles,

If u knew violent Anglo rednecks or neo-Nazis would, as "your target", "become upset ... As you knew they would", would u not publish?

Donnie,

Would u also “understand” the daytime Cronulla rioters as

“a large [small] number of people, many of whom feel victimised and powerless already and feel they have no avenue of retort, so they snap back at small provocations in the only way they know how and the only way they see will have any effect, and unfortunately that is often violently”?

Would u answer: “Justified, rational? no, but it can at least be understood. It's like the kid who gets victimised by bullies at school who lashes out and attacks some other kid who makes a smartarse remark because he can't fight back the real bullies”?

green-grin, trade215,

Apart from answering the questions I posed to Pericles and Donnie, do u think those who threw bags of urine and faeces at One Nation supporters are a danger?

The alchemist,

Spot on!

YngNLuvinit,

I agree; given what the Europeans put up with from some members of the Muslim community, they should have more widely published the cartoons.

Col Rouge,

How many abortion clinics were blown up?

Rainier,

Again you betray and project onto others your tribalistic thinking.

What makes u think the posters here would, say, NOT condemn the likes of a Hearst too? (providing evidence of course).

You’d make an INEPT TRIAGE NURSE; the posters here are only dealing with the more intense wounds first. You want to heal a scratch (your imaginary “Evil Empire”) before a cancer (nihilistic Muslims)!

Yabby,

Excellent point. Nihilists never care for those not of their own tribe (be it race, religion, or even class).

GZ Tan,

Excellent! Definitely the middle-class Muslims, the so-called “educated” ones who manage to exercise physical restraint, are the real antagonists here. Responsibility fully lies with them, which includes Salam.

I wonder what the "journalist" thinks about the dozens of websites depicting the "prophet" in less than flattering poses.

This country will rue the day moslems were ever allowed to enter.

Salam your faith is vicious and wicked.

Well here I am adding to the tally of 64 posts to a thread about humour (or lack thereof), whereas an article about water desalination published on the same day received a total of four.

Yup, we Aussies in our wide brown and parched land sure have our priorities about right.

Apart from timing, one can say that confidence is everything. A positive and sincere belief within an individual or organisation is all that is needed to rise above insult. Irfan has done that with aplomb. Salam has not.

I cop blonde jokes all the time. I usually laugh along and supply a better one of my own.

The reaction to Piss Christ by many Christians ensured the artist received maximum publicity. Had the Christian community remained silent, the exhibit would’ve remained an obscure work – although it did have merit for water recycling ;-)

This latest storm in a tea-cup is an opportunity for the Muslim community to show the world just what is meant by grace. Now is the time to be confident and proud of Islam. I note that Fellow Human has shown alot of grace. Whereas certain other non-Muslim posters have not.

In the world of humour, timing is everything so I have to ponder, as other posters have noted, why now?

What is our attention being deflected from this time?

It probably isn’t water shortage in Australia.

Scout, water isn't a problem in this country, we have lots of clean water, they just found enough water under the ground to put the desalinition plant on hold. If water supply in this country becomes an issue we'll start reading and posting about water.

People are posting now about this because the furore has only recently erupted. It concerns freedom of expression which is an important tenant in our liberal democracy, so there's a lot of concern about it.

The best you can do is use it as an opportunity to attack "ordinary" Australians, and you want to tell us about priorities?