Sajo you write a nicely phrased badly formed argument. As a ‘scientist’ I am sure you have come across terms such as logic, and reason. I would suggest that you apply them to your comments before you post, then perhaps you would not contradict yourself so frequently.

Your post yesterday seemed to indicate you would not be returning to the discussion, however it appears you cannot keep away. You seem to be putting an inordinate amount of time and effort into this discussion, as you are drawn back day after day, making ill concealed malicious remarks. Your accusations against other members of this discussion would be perhaps more applicable to yourself. The homeschoolers who have posted here have shown far more tolerance and patience for your views than you have for theirs.

I have been reading articles on Online Opinion for some time now, and I have never gained the impression that it is the intention of the architects of this forum, that people should post comments merely to provoke an argument, or to cause dissent. Nor would they approve of you suggesting to other members that they find another forum.

By the way, the wikipedia is not widely recognised as a reliable or substantial source of information.

Re Swilkie's question of whether it would not be better (than opting out of schooling) to do the right things and fix school.

Point 1: There is not consensus on what those 'right things' are. There is not unquestioned agreement that the competition offered by mass schooling is, indeed, necessary or desirable to educate a person.

Point 2: There is not across-the-board agreement about what is optimal, or even acceptable, in terms of opportunity to learn about oneself, others and the world. Mixing with hundreds of other kids every day is impossible, rather than optimal or sub-optimal (or detrimental). A child may be surrounded by hundreds of other students and have interactions with a small percentage of them, but s/he isn't mixing with them.

I'm assuming 'mixing' to mean exchanging something meaningful with them, or trying to. Watching hundreds of other kids, I'm not counting, although I imagine one could learn a lot that way.

Do children who do not go to school see many different ways of relating? Do they learn to assert themselves? Do they get opportunities to meet young people who do not fit their parents' idea of 'friend material'? Do they mix with children from socio-economic and cultural backgrounds/contexts different from their own? Do they have opportunities to learn to resolve conflict with peers and others?

It is possible for children who do not go to school to mix widely. I know this from ten years' experience of meeting such children, but had I not met them and instead put my imagination to the task, I could come up with ideas for children mixing with others and learning without attending school.

Carol

Hello again'
I'm looking for facts, I've read the posts. My last post placed my position. Its not harsh, just questioning. You guys are right I know nothing of home ed, & neither does most of Oz Society. Hit me with some facts & or stats - I now have a general picture of the home ed scene.
I'm not criticising, I may wish to adopt the use of home ed for my own use- as I've said, it sounds viable. I could even support it politically. Not many are willing to give a detail of how they do it. Hit me with some details...

Sajo,

The English language is not used to the same effect as it once was, as mass education has reduced much of the population’s abilities to grasp and utilise the complexity of it. Both with the written and spoken word.
Mass production will always produce an inferior end product, and that is also true of mass education. The educational nutrients (so to speak) have been extracted from the education that is given in schools, and this has always been the case. Thus, the decline in standards.

Many educationalists reject the notion that literacy is a fixed, measurable competence, however your approach would appear to be a more technicist view. What I have been referring to is what is often called functional literacy.

Here are a few resources for you to look at if you are interested http://www.nea.gov/news/news04/ReadingAtRisk.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/24/AR2005122400701.html?nav=rss_education
http://www.abc.net.au/rn/talks/8.30/edurpt/estories/er301096.htm
There is also ‘Debating Literacy in Australia, History Lessons and Popular Fictions’. By B Green, J Hodges, and A Luke.

I make this post fully aware that I am wasting my time, as I do not believe you are truly interested in this subject. Merely you just appear to trying to amuse yourself by repeated attempts to provoke.

To disagree for the sake of disagreeing is not a debate

Swilkie, the previous posts on this discussion have much of the information you seek. People have provided details, facts and statistics, all you need to do is read. However if you do honestly seek more information, I would suggest you simply type ‘home education’ into a search engine.

To post or not to post? - that is the question. Either I cop abuse from Maya for actually showing some interest in this discussion (note that there are very few non-homeschoolers here at all) or I cop it from someone else and am unable to defend myself. Maya - have you made a single real contribution? So far it seems you have only posted to abuse me. Have you actually read my posts? There was no malicious intent at all. I was hoping for some actual discussion rather than ‘back-patting’ as it has been referred to which is why so many questions. I do have a genuine interest in the topic otherwise I would not be bothering. Swilkie – you are brave – surely you noticed the malice in some of the responses to even my most complimentary comments.

There have been so many contradictions about how homeschooling works that it is difficult to tell from the posts what it involves. It seems that some follow published curricula and some don’t, some believe you need expert help and others think you should sit back and leave the children to it. In other words there are lots of different approaches.

The reasons for homeschooling are also varied. Some have stated specific reasons for homeschooling such as flexibility, bullying or gifted or special ed which I can accept. Others seem to have based their decisions on very inaccurate and unfair opinions about schools and schoolchildren which is a point I have argued about as it is a slight on my own children,friends and choices.

The only answer I can really deduce is that the homeschooling community is very angry about something (presumably the Victorian Government) to be so defensive, as my views are far from hostile to homeschooling and really not all that important anyhow.

TonyC - Actually I am very interested in the whole literacy thing. I think we were both right as we were talking about different things. Thanks for the references.