healthy scepticism; it will be rewarded by some unseemly attacks to follow.

I think the Bush/Howard link is not as relevant as it might first appear. Howad is too worried about appearing overly gushing when it comes to anything like organised religion - he will milk the link but in a more covert fashion than Bush tends to do.

And while the televangelist types are under scrutiny it would be a mistake not to take a close look at the more mainstream churches most of which are doing very nicely for themselves.

There are also some disturbing reports about some churches and the way they operate in the South Pacific, exacting unreasonable tithes from village people and in at least one instance in Fiji - running the village and insisting villagers pay rent to use a tractor they own - they probably see it as teaching the poor natives the value of money or have some other equally patronising rationalisation.

Yep; watch the hot gospelers by all mean but don't forget the rest.

Christian churches have always been a mixture of "weeds and wheat".

1. Wheat: Most Christians are genuine participants, within the human race, testifying to the life of grace, and making a valuable contribution to society .

2. Weeds: Always, some have loved their money, and power, and guilt more than true freedom. Judas - Jesus very own treasurer - is a classic example.

The New Testament is full of corrective writing, telling the church to get their act together.
Thanks for reminding us that there are crooks and politicians among the churches.
That will not invalidate the heart of message: Christ Jesus is Lord of the Nations.

And it looks like sneekeepete is going to be the bishop - overseeing the rest of the churches - so all should be well, in that regard.

All religions are money making enterprises. Always have been, always will be.

Dont be cluoded by your faith as to what you are giving for, and what you are giving to.

Give your time, money, whatever, expect not to recieve anything in return but your inner knowing.

People will get very rich off poor honest folks, and religion is a easy string to pull as it taps into a persons belief system. A great business model with loyal, willing subscribers.

DVDS, CDs, giving money, spending your time....if you need that support network great, but dont be under an illusion, they are just another motivator. Tony Robbins would far you better, and at least you wont go to hell for worshipping false idols, and you will get motivated to change your NLP at least.

Nothing to see here, move along.

Religions have been extracting money from the faithful since time immemorial, as has any organization or class of folk that preys upon the gullibility and emotions of people less savvy or self-confident than themselves.

Witchdoctors fit the bill, as do those Catholic entrepreneurs who sold indulgences across Europe in the fifteenth century. All we are seeing is today's equivalent. A thousand years hence, they will still exist.

The current crop is no different from their predecessors; some are sincere and rich, some are insincere and rich. By and large, their adherents are much less rich. Just normal commerce really, and I don't see that there is much to get upset about.

Just a known reality of religion. But it is good to see a christian speak about it, until you see their own hidden agenda. Wonder what that may be, money his church should be getting, or a genuine concern for unethical religious practise. Me thinks he may be lost on that one.

ASSEMBLIES OF GOD AND THE FAMILY FIRST PARTY

While the message of organised religion is usually benign its growing alliance with professional politicians is the kind of thing that can distort secular democracy.

In the 1950s and 60s the efforts of Catholic Archbishop Mannix, right wing Catholic “groupers” and the DLP, kept the Liberals in power past their use by date.

Its pretty clear that Family First is closely related to the Assembly of God. http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2004/s1217824.htm

This article in the Age http://www.theage.com.au/news/National/PM-gives-Family-First-preference/2005/03/03/1109700607983.html pretty well explains Howard’s love of Family First and consequently his special attention to powerful churches. Hence "conscience vote" issues like abortion and birth control are increasingly under pressure from rightwing churchgoers (princibly Abbott).

Family First preferences have given Howard more power, through the Coalition majority in the Senate, than he ever expected.

Howard’s courting church votes can come unstuck though – when his appointment of an Anglican Archbishop as Governor General exposed the seamier side of organised religion.

I think the message of Christianity is largely a good one. But the organisational objectives of Christianity’s self appointed representatives, be they high church or rapidly expanding charismatic churches, often frustrate the goodness.