Thanks BD for your patience and input. However, I am still somewhat at a loss what the Christian belief in the apocalypse has for the greater community.

Sells article did make me think about the paucity of articles on this website from other faiths.

Is there a belief in apocalypses from others such as Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, Islam, Wiccan or even Pagan? Or even a philosophical take on the need for religious beliefs.

Personally I am not too concerned about any imminent catastrophe - by the time the sun runs out of nukes the human race will be long gone. This is why I questioned the relevance of Sells article in the first place. I feel it would've have been more pertinent to a Christian website than here. Or if we are to expand our world views then this is why I am asking for input from other faiths.

This is an open forum isn't it?

Hi Scout,

In answer to a couple of your questions – yes, lots of other belief systems talk of the “end of the world”, and in many (not all) cases this is linked with the ushering in of a utopian new one. This is true not just of religions but of secular worldviews too – cosmologists’ exploding suns and collapsing universes, eco-apocalyptics’ fears of anihilation by over-population or greenhouse gases or over-consumption, Marxists’ longing for revolution to usher in the “dictatorship of the proletariat” and “withering away of the state”. It would be interesting to hear their perspectives, too, and to critique them as esctatology.

As this forum demonstrates, there is no agreement within Christianity on exactly what the coming of the kingdom of God means. Those of a fundamentalist bent take the apocalyptic writings as literal predictions of future historical and political events, and some see entering into God’s kingdom as meaning “pie in the sky when you die” – going to heaven after death as a reward for doing or believing the right thing while on earth. Liberals often see these things as metaphorical statements about how God wants the present world to be, and the role of Christians as being to work to achieve those goals as nearly as possible. Hence they often emphasise political, economic and social action now – charitable work, social justice campaigns, etc.

As I understand Sells’ argument, he takes neither of these views. The coming of the kingdom of God is not a future event or “the end of the world” as predicted by science or depicted in horror and disaster movies, nor a deterministic or progressive political agenda, but an action of God (not us) which has happened, is happening and will happen through and as a consequence of Christ’s crucifixion. This is not something we should embrace for fear of the end of the world or in the hope of a pleasant afterlife, or even with humanistic good intentions of improving people’s wellbeing, but because it is the most profoundly important fact about our human existence.

nice one Kenny

Hi Scout,

Re your question on apocalyptic views in Islamic religion, it is defined in our Holy scripture as a physical form: quakes, volcanos (referred to in the Holy Quran as 'smoke').

It is the last chapter following Jesus second return and 'reign of peace' over the earth for 7 years.

There is no evidence in our faith to support a matching view to what Sells thoughts on the Bible.

At the end of each Oor Ernie adventure in the Knockout comic, his phlegmatic North of England father would comment “Daft I call it!”

Well, Oor Sells, daft I call it! Or, as I put it in another post, blind faith, surely not leavened by your own experience.

I can’t go head-to-head on scripture, I’ll stick to “The Kingdom of Heaven lies within you.” Not above the clouds, not in a post-apocalyptic paradise, but here and now, in your own mind and body. The end of the world may not be nigh, but we never know when our own end will arrive. So if there is an afterlife, in whatever form, it’s as well to be prepared for it. And, strangely enough, the best preparation for death is learning how to live, here and now, from moment to moment, understanding reality as it manifests within you, changing, unsatisfactory, egoless. This understanding leads to a happy, harmonious life, and (though I’ve yet to test this) a happy, harmonious death.

There are various takes on any prospective afterlife. The Buddha taught that at the point when the mass of rapidly arising and decaying particles we call the body can no longer sustain life, then the rapidly arising and decaying mental phenomena – consciousness, perception, sensation and reaction – jump to a new physical location. The last mind-moment of this life is the first mind moment of the next. If that is correct, then having a mind filled with wisdom, love and compassion will be helpful at death - just as it is helpful in one's daily life. So the kingdom of heaven is truly within, and dependent on our efforts to realise it rather than “understanding ourselves as being caught up in a movement that has already been initiated in the cross of Christ and which has transformed and is transforming the world.”

Whether we have one life or many lives, it is self-realisation, self-reliance which will help us, not dependence on an external being, whether real or imagined.

This is a good article. Its meaning, though, will be beyond all but the spiritually (not religiously) inclined.

The great strength of Western christianity, unlike the religious conviction of more primitive people, has been learning how NOT to take the Bible literally. (Funamentalists excluded here!)

The end of the World is the end of our perception of how the world is not the physical end of the earth.

The return of Christ is not literal, its the return of "Christ consciousness" a more functional way based on love and not hate. Its an unstoppable wave which changes ones perception.

Religion, which is generally dysfunctional, has actually clouded this issue in the past.