Once again I find myself agreeing with both sides of the debate.
I've been forced to allow my son to attend a christian school and am apauled at the values taught at the school.
A school uniform that loudly proclaims that he is "nothing without god". The day starting with a bible study where the topic is god punishing people who don't follow him. Not only is my son subjected to this abuse but my child support is paying for it, my taxes are paying for it and your taxes are paying for it. I have no expectation that my son will be taught to think critically where christianity is concerned. Anything I teach him is likely to cause him trouble at the school. I so want him back in a school where he is exposed to teachers from a variety of belief structures and taught to think about what he believes.

On the other hand the government sticking it's nose into yet another decision which currently rests with the family (if your not divorced). How often do they get that kind of stuff right.

R0bert

I've taught in both public & private schools & trust me schools in Australia are a diverse bunch. There's precious few generalisations you can make about any group, public or private. Now a few words to Anna & RObert.

Anna: ethics are taught in some public schools through philosophy. Where it has been provided it's been warmly received by the parents. It teaches the kids to think [not what to think] & provides them with the oportunity to form their own morality.

RObert: Some private schools can be VERY intolerant & bigoted but they aren't all like that. There are more than a few that teach their students to respect other points of view & to think for themselves. I don't know if there are any other schools where you are but if there are try talking to the principle & ask about their philosophy of education. That will give you a pretty fair idea what their priorities are. My best to you & your child & good hunting for another school. :)

Not far behind the idea of getting 'all' kids into public schools is one word "control" and the Left have been running the education unions for quite some time. The emptiness and barrenness I detect in the secular curriculum leaves me gasping for moral air.

They will portray ethical situations, but when challenged 'Why should I be/do like this' .... the eyes glaze over and the 'I don't really know, err we just should' look gradually takes over the countenance.

The types of material selected for English, the values they convey, (specially the atrocious and abysmal moral relativism of works by Albert Camus and others like Sartre reflected in his writings)are most important.
I prefer my kids shaped by the values that are eternal.

Many private schools, endeavor to inculcate specific values with a divine reference point. When young people apply, they are told the rules/presentation/story, and if they come in, they should simply abide with the system or move on.

If state schools were 'just' about education it would be good for all.
But we humans being what we are... its NEVER 'just' about education.

I do agree that all schools, secular or religious must have a core level of material for consistency, acreditation and social harmony.
But 'how' those things are taught, the associated values, can be poles apart between secular/private.

It seems to me that Dennis Altman wants Australia to continue to be a secular society, and his method for ensuring this is to force children to attend state schools where they can’t have religion rammed down their throats.

While his goal of a secular society may be broadly acceptable, I can't see many people supporting a reduction of education choices. Quality private schools keep the government schools on their toes.

I get the feeling that Dennis Altman is most concerned with the perceived division in society created by the Islamic community. Lets face it – Islam is probably the most overt religion in Australia and people are often suspicious of those who dress in a way that screams “look at me, I’m a Muslim”. Media reports don’t help the suspicion that mosques are used to brain wash impressionable people and are terrorist recruitment centres.

There have been policies in the past that tried to ensure the assimilation of society, such as the removing of Aboriginal children from their families and the White Australia Policy. Both were abandoned for very good reasons.

Let’s face it, until people who follow Islam get rid of clowns like Abu Bakr, denounce terrorism, treat women equally, and express their religion less overtly - articles like this one will continue to be written and it won’t be long before support for more extreme measures gain ground. Anyone remember the One Nation Party?

As I have stated previously, what Prof. Altman is arguing for isn’t new or rocket science. What he fails to understand is that cultural and religious differences do matter and children of multiple social, economic and cultural backgrounds are cohabiting in classrooms together. So the more obvious question is ‘how is this being managed in schools’?

Before advocating using public schools as melting pots I think Professor Altman should explain how diversity is currently attended to in schools. Does he know?

He might actually discover they are under funded tin pots full of dead wood ideas and people. From my experience and observations lots of dedicated and wonderful teachers are distracted from doing what they do best by authoritarian administration and the latest batch of bureaucratic desiged teaching strategies and interventions.

I can't help but wonder what the good professor does in his teacher education classes. I hope its not the same old ‘multicultural’ food and clothing analogies linked to those old hat cookie cutter teaching theories and approaches to curriculum.

In this environment everybody (not white, or not the right kind of white) is ‘different and no interrogation whatsoever into the core or central values and this culture of schools themselves. These are just assumed to be inherently good, liberal and egalitarian when often they are far from.

Like Flip Top, I reckon Altman is attempting to sneak in the back door with a bag full old quotes from a 1970's "how to teach to diversity' text book or he’s just simply out of touch with the real world of teaching. Perhaps its a bit of both?

Rainer (did you rx my email ?)

On your point about cultural and religious differences 'do matter' could not agree more.

Lets look at 2 ways of managing that.

Scene 1 in this class we have 7 religions/cultures. The culturally predominant one (Christian) and 6 others represented by a few here and a few there scattered among the class.

METHOD 1. "MULTI-CULTURAL"
The teacher does a crash course in 'all the worlds religions and cultures' and treats each person differently according to their culture. One student is a Lun Bawang from Borneo, so he won't ask him his name. Another is from India, so he wont ever pass something to him with his left (bottom wiping) hand. Another is Muslim, so he will do the 'greeting' prayer gesture of touching his heart, and will use 'Salam Walaikum'. Another is Japanese so he will bow when greeting...another is Chinese, and he doesn't teach about "Que's" (first in best dressed to the Chinese)...and yet anOTHER is...
and after he gets out of intensive care for his nervous breakdown :)......

METHOD 2. MONOCULTURAL Same kids. They are taught (as they have from primary school) that this is 'Australia'.. the idea of Australian identity and its cultural importance has been explained to them as migrants from the first interview, and repeatedly emphasised in every educational level. They fully understand where they live, and are well mannered enough to appreciate that catering for each and every one of the kazillion cultures in the world is a no-goer. They fully realize that this is not an attempt at 'cultural imperialism' but that its 'how it is' by virtue of their parents choice to move here (under our strictly conditional invitation) They respect our ways, and don't seek to oppose them.
The teacher goes home relaxed, focuses on the next step in the curriculum and his self esteem is enhanced, his culture not threatened. The kids ? They go home and their parents enrich their lives with stories of their own background. I see no losers in this :)