Yuyutsu,
>It is not about the population still growing because human population is already many orders of magnitude too high.
Too high for what purpose? And who are you to say what the human population should be?

Of course we depend on strangers. Self sufficiency's overrated. It may make good TV, but in reality it doesn't make sense to devote so much time to stuff you're neither good at nor enjoy.

>and that paves the way for kings and rulers of sorts to take control of our lives,
No it doesn't. They were far more powerful over people's lives before electricity was available.

>Thus we must decide: freedom or electricity, can't have both.
I'd much rather have the practical freedom of what electricity enables me to do than the hypothetical freedom of life without it.

Dear Aidan,

Obviously we want different things:

You seem to prioritise survival and comfort while I prioritise freedom.

«Too high for what purpose? And who are you to say what the human population should be?»

Too high to avoid slavery and forced regimentation.
I say that human population should be as low as necessary to allow enough space for those who do not wish to live under the rule of society(s) whose values and morals they don't share, to go elsewhere and live decently either on their own or with other like-minded people.

I estimate that limit to be around 100 to 200 million people.

«Self sufficiency's overrated.»

Depends on what you want. I want freedom.

Now let's admit that we are both addicted to certain comforts, including electricity, that we both would find it extremely difficult to live without. Addicted people don't want their addictions to be taken away and cannot see beyond: again, I'm not suggesting cold-turkey, nobody is going to snatch away your electricity which you became so used to. One day, you or your grand-grand-grand-children will by themselves realise that keeping it isn't worth the prices, meanwhile I only advise baby-steps to start this blessed process.

Please also note that self-sufficiency isn't necessary: smaller independent societies are also good enough, within which there will still be a degree of specialisation, thus no one needs to "devote so much time to stuff you're neither good at nor enjoy". At present, while we not so much do stuff we're not good at, most of us spend a lot of time doing stuff they don't enjoy.

«They were far more powerful over people's lives before electricity was available.»

We may need to go a bit further back in time when people could and did escape when they so wished, but for example, should another Hitler arrive today, not a single Jew would be able to escape, whether hiding in forests, in monasteries, inside fake walls, underground, or Jewish babies adopted by Christian families, with present technology all will be rounded and murdered, possibly by AI robots without human touch.