Yes, but there is not a thing we can do about Russia or Russians; we don’t even have the will or the courage to resist the Marxists bullying we are now subjected to in our own lives. We also tolerated male-only conscription during a war in Vietnam that we had no need nor business being in.

Trust the ABC to moan about minorities only in accordance with the racial discrimination wank. The there is then silence of the feminists on women not being treated the same as men.

No…when the chips are down, men will decide outcomes.
Rainbow flag loses, forces of nature win.

Dan

Speaking as a former soldier, I don't see war as entertainment and anybody who thinks that way is far kicked in the head!

It's not us who see young Russian conscripts as cannon fodder just the criminal, Putin. And as long as the Russian people themselves roll over and beg for tummy rub, things ain't going to change.

All this was started by a Russian megalomaniac with an insatiable lust for power and the restoration of the USSR invading the Ukraine.

He needs to stop escalating, killing men women, children and babes and sue for an honorable peace. Which must include a unilateral withdrawable from all former Ukrainian territory, including the Crimea!

BS referendums conducted at the point of a gun, haven't made any part of the Ukraine, Russian territory!

Mark well my words. Continued escalation can only led to WW111 and nuclear Armageddon! No ifs, buts or maybes!

A sick Russian President may not care and may want to take the world with him, but only if the Russian people continue to roll over and beg for tummy rub!
Alan B.

ttbn. It wasn't any lefty government whatsoever that introduced conscription for Vietnam but your conservative mates on the far right!

Go to the library and do some verifiable historical fact checking for a change before you open your mind and disgorge your usual verbal vomit.

As for young Russian men being used as cannon fodder, I believe, your lack of concern shows a Nazi like lack of normal human empathy. Ditto DD who, I believe, hides his considerable lack/torrent of verbal vomit behind a forever waved, rainbow flag. Sick in the head, da?
I remain without bias, Alan B.

Alan B

Your reading is worse than your writing. I did not attribute our engagement in the Vietnam war to the left.

Roll on TRUMP

Trump is still odds on favourite to be voted President in 2024 http://www.sportsbet.com.au/betting/politics/us-politics/us-presidential-election-2024-5479667

As Trump's best buddy in Europe is Putin, if the Ukraine War is still going on Trump will withdraw US support for Ukraine, thereby collapsing NATO backing of Ukraine.

OLO's majority Trump supporters unite!

Trump supporters, unite!
You have nothing to lose but your brains!

David f. Nothing to lose but their brains? if the moribund idiots shared one between them, it'd be lonely! One doesn't need to be a brain-dead moron to vote for Trump, but it has to help.

ttbn. apologies, but you blame them for almost everything else. Even when, as on most occasions it's your lot that is responsible.
You'll have a nice day now y'hear.
Alan B.

ttbn. Can't get much further left than Marxism!
Alan B.

Anyone who can think Biden is an improvement on Trump, or the drovers dog, has to be soft in the head.

My "mob" Alan? I don't have a mob.

The most horrible thing to me about the war is that Putin has predicated it on the idea that you are good or evil based on your political allegiance. It is too much to hope that Putin will have an epiphany like the skinhead who walked into a pub, made friends with a black guy and realised what a load of crap his Nazi beliefs were?

Shall men be thankful that they were not born as ant/bee drones?
Only one male is needed to fertilize the queen, and that ratio in humans is not much different.

---

Dear Maverick,

«Trump will withdraw US support for Ukraine, thereby collapsing NATO backing of Ukraine.»

The US might withdraw alright, but Europe will continue to fight to the end, to win or to die with Ukraine.

Actually, if not for the US's lukewarm response, Europe would already be fighting Russia directly side by side with the brave Ukrainians.

Dear Yuyutsu,

A queen will mate with many males on her mating flight. She will retain the sperm, and the worker eggs she produces will be be fertilized by sperm from different males. Thus all the worker bees in a hive will have the same mother, but they will have many different fathers. Bee mating is different from human mating. However, sometime after the mating flight the drones or male bees will be destroyed. The unfertilized eggs will all produce males. The fertilized eggs will be all females/workers except a few which will become queens. There are variants to the above in different bee species.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_bee is a more detailed account.

Europe will continue to fight to the end, to win or to die with Ukraine.
Yuyutsu,
Europe has nothing to fear from Russia !

"As Trump's best buddy in Europe is Putin, if the Ukraine War is still going on Trump will withdraw US support for Ukraine, thereby collapsing NATO backing of Ukraine."

Well, Trump Derangement Syndrome is strong in this one. Of course, if the Ukraine war is still going in January 2025, it might make sense to do something different - Trump or no Trump. But with the TDS crowd, whatever Trump does is definitionally wrong and whatever they think is wrong is what Trump will do - evidence or no evidence.

Speaking of NO evidence...."Trump's best buddy in Europe is Putin". These are memes that the left just fabricate and the TDS crowd accept without a further thought. Putin's worst nightmare would be return of Trump. Let's remember that he only launched the invasion because Trump was gone and he was facing the moron of Kabul.

Perhaps, if there is a second Trump presidency, the Europeans will pay more attention. Remember how he tried to get them to increase military spending and to wean themselves off dependency on Russian fossil fuels. They laughed at his then, but they're not laughing now.

Speaking of Europeans holding together, today (well yesterday) is the anniversary of the Battle of Tours where the Europeans stopped (as it turned out, forever) the Islamic invasion of Christian Europe.

If the Muslims had won the battle of Tours Europe might not have descended into the Dark Ages. At that time the Muslims were more open to new ideas than Christian Europe. The victory of the Christians at the battle of Tours kept Europe Christian at a cost. The cost was to delay the emergence from superstitious Christianity for many years. Later the Muslims had their own Dark Ages, but the battle of Tours kept Europe under the dominance of ignorance. If the battle of Tours had gone the other way we would not have suffered the Inquisition, the martyrdom of scientists like Servetus and Vanini and other Christian horrors

" If the battle of Tours had gone the other way we would not have suffered the Inquisition, the martyrdom of scientists like Servetus and Vanini and other Christian horrors".

Or the Renaissance, Magna Carta, industrial revolution, Da Vinci, Mona Lisa, Newton.

But some only see the dark side of their culture, hoping that gives them a veneer of virtue. Some look at the Mona Lisa and see the smile, others see the cracks in the paint.

Of course, using the same counterfactual mumbo-jumbo one could argue that, had the Battle of Badr had gone the other way, Syria wouldn't be the utopia it is today </sarc> and Mahsa Amini would still be alive.

Still david, you'll be pleased to know that you're not alone in your hatred for all things Christian and barracking for the Mohomedians....

"Had Charles Martel not been victorious at Poitiers — already, you see, the world had fallen into the hands of the Jews, so gutless a thing was Christianity! — then we should in all probability have been converted to Mohammedanism, that cult which glorifies heroism and which opens the seventh Heaven to the bold warrior alone. Then the Germanic races would have conquered the world. Christianity alone prevented them from doing so." A. Hitler.

Instead, the Moslem invasion was put off till recently.
The Immans of Sweden & France have announced they will be the
majorities in those countries before the end of this century and
everything will then change.
The Germans are only now waking up to what is happening.

What brought the soviet army out of Afghanistan was primarily the consistent stream of bodies returning to Russia and the women becoming very vocal.

Until recently the war in Ukraine was someone else's problem with people they didn't know dying. The mobilisation has brought the potential of death to every household and now it is everyone's problem.

That these latest recruits have bugger all training means that their life expectancy is very short. If they were well trained the war could go on for years.

The Renaissance and the Enlightenment marked the emergence from the Dark Ages of Christianity. Had the Muslims won the battle of Tours Europe would possibly not have entered those Dark Ages. Sometimes the barbarians win. That happened at the battle of Tours.

In spite of the victory of the barbarian Christians Europe emerged from the Dark Ages, but without the clutch of Christian barbarism Europe might have emerged earlier.

"One doesn't need to be a brain-dead moron to vote for Trump, but it has to help."

- That said Alan B. one would definitely have to be a brain-dead moron to vote for Biden.

Dear David F.,

Thank you for correcting me.

Still, in the context of this article, men are dispensable because women cannot reproduce more often then once in 9+ months (even longer due to feeding), while much fewer men are sufficient to keep them pregnant/feeding all the time (including men that are below or above military age).

This is not a behaviour I support, in fact I propose a moratorium on pregnancies in order to reduce human population, but well, it could be an approach which Putin supports.

Dear Indyvidual,

«Europe has nothing to fear from Russia !»

Yes, as far as conventional weapons and troops are concerned.

Should one fear a nuclear war?

I guess there is no point in fearing there because nothing can be done about it, there is no way to prepare, so if it happens then we just all die.

Anyway, my point was simply that Europe will never forsake Ukraine, even if the Americans do.

Dear Yuyutsu,

I used to keep bees and still have a great interest in the subject. Unfortunately, the pesticides which kill insects that feast on plants also kill bees who promote the growth of plants.

I agree with you on a moratorium of pregnancies.

Dear mhaze,

I do not hate all things Christian. Christians have done some good. However, I think it would have been better if the battle of Tours had gone the other way. Sometimes a military defeat will result in desirable, social change. The present German nation is a democratic country and a good place to live for many people. Germans were forced to confront themselves. If the Nazis had won they would have extended their genocidal policies. If Christians had lost the battle of Tours it might have actually resulted in making Christianity better. It might have resulted in making Christians less intolerant of other cultures. It might have resulted in Christians examining themselves as the defeat of the Nazis caused Germans to examine themselves. Two Christian adages come to mind.

One is:

“Hate the sin but love the sinner”

One can hate the sin of Christianity but love Christians.

One can hearken to the words of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount, Mathew 7:16 “By their fruits shall ye know them.”

Some of these fruits are the occupation of lands inhabited by Aborigines, American Indians and other indigenous cultures and the extirpation of those cultures along with the enslavement and murder of the peoples and forcing Christianity on them, massacres of Jews and other non-Christians, murder of Servetus, Hypatia, Vanini, Bruno and other scientists and thinkers who questioned the Christian worldview, house arrest of Galileo, Wars of the Reformation where Christians of one kind killed Christians of another kind, the slave trade, the Inquisition and the support of most of the churches in Nazi occupied lands for Hitler.

In South Africa there was a Truth and Reconciliation Commission in which the powers in the Apartheid regime acknowledged their crimes and made peace with those they have oppressed. Christian churches might do the same.

"The present German nation is a democratic country and a good place to live for many people."

Tell that to the 100k Germans who came out to demand an end to Russian sanctions and to turn on Nordstream 2...
- The day before the West blew it up.

The west has become so corrupted it conducts willful collective punishment of its own national citizens now.

<< The west has become so corrupted it conducts willful collective punishment of its own national citizens now. >>

And those of its allies.

Should one fear a nuclear war?
Yuyutsu,
If that happens, then there's no point in worrying about it. The corrupt West has started the trouble in Ukraine but they only just start to realise what they've done. The only one to prevent this from becoming a global catastrophe i.i. end of the world as far as humans are concerned, is Zelensky & the people of Ukraine ! Putin has been pushed into a corner & has nothing to lose !
Now he gets blamed for it !

Yep, it has ever been the corrupt west for all manner of extremists. Be you a Marxist, Nazi, religious fruit loop or conspiracy nutter, the "West" is always becoming "decadent" and headed to Hell. Never mind that the "West" keeps getting better whilst all those pure societies remain economic and humanitarian failures. It is better to just keep doubling down with the nonsense.

I believe it has been a great surprise to western intelligence as to how poorly the Russian army has performed. I think the only things the Russian military has excelled in is murder and destruction. I hope the Russian military is as close to depletion as intelligence analysts speculate. A few long range Himars salvos for the Kerch Bridge wouldn't go astray.

Dear Indyvidual,

«The only one to prevent this from becoming a global catastrophe i.i. end of the world as far as humans are concerned, is Zelensky & the people of Ukraine !»

Oh, you may have forgotten - the only one to prevent this from becoming a global catastrophe, is God - in whom I trust. Should it be God's will to end humanity now, then so be it, let His will be done - at least we in Australia will still have some 6 months to live before the winds bring in the radioactive air from the northern hemisphere.

«Putin has been pushed into a corner»

By his own desires to restore the Soviet Union.

The ancient Assyrians had a policy: when they conquered a rival kingdom/city, they exiled its inhabitants to the opposite end of their empire, there they dispersed them all over, no more than one person or family per town/village, so they were made to live among total strangers and be forced to forget their culture and assimilate, so within a generation or two they became just blend loyal Assyrians with no historical memory.

Let alone the murdered, wounded, raped and homeless - Putin just did the same to some million Ukrainian in his occupied Ukrainian territories, whom he exiled from their homes and dispersed in Russian villages, giving them Russian documents that do not allow them to leave their village/town. One has to be extremely naive to believe that Putin would not do the same to the rest of Europe, one country at a time, if he could.

Let alone whether or not the West is corrupt (I personally believe that only the U.S.A is corrupt, not Europe, not even Canada), no decent person should accept such horrendous atrocities and allow Putin to continue to afflict them. Should we die as a result, then that would be a worthy cause! I also prefer dying this way over slow death in a nursing home from Alzheimer or Parkinson.

Hi Yuyutsu,
"This is not a behaviour I support, in fact I propose a moratorium on pregnancies in order to reduce human population, but well, it could be an approach which Putin supports."

I don't think so, Putin's offering bonuses for women who have 10 kids.
http://www.cnbc.com/2022/08/18/russia-offers-mother-heroine-medal-and-16800-for-having-10-children.html

Hey Indyvidual,
"The only one to prevent this from becoming a global catastrophe i.i. end of the world as far as humans are concerned, is Zelensky & the people of Ukraine"

West Killed Peace Proposal to end Ukraine war, Russia supported Negotiated Settlement
http://multipolarista.com/2022/09/03/west-peace-proposal-ukraine-russia/
"Russia and Ukraine agreed to a negotiated settlement to end the conflict in April, but British Prime Minister Boris Johnson intervened to stop the peace deal, and the US and EU escalated the proxy war to try to weaken Moscow."

Hey Fester,
"I believe it has been a great surprise to western intelligence as to how poorly the Russian army has performed."

I'm not sure Russia's performed as poorly as you suggest, but they've certainly made numerous mistakes.
Putin's exercised enormous restraint with regard to the use of his military power, and hasn't yet committed any more than 20% of his ground force to Ukraine.
I think he was holding out for a negotiated settlement, but has now come to terms with the fact that the West wouldn't allow it.
So now he's going after critical infrastructure and decision making centres, yesterday launching over 200 missiles all over Ukraine, many people right now are without power, internet or running water.
He has shown he knows whats going on in Ukraine and can hit anywhere.

Unless the west stages a false flag by detonating a nuke and blaming it on Putin, Russia is going to launch offensives in the coming months that completely annihilate whatever remains of the Ukrainian armed forces.

Right now I think he's sending troops to Belarus, the thinking is to force Ukraine to divert troops from the other fronts to protect Kiev, which will result in less troops defending in the south and east.

Zelensky's now asking for NATO troops.

The West are now fully invested in this conflict, they're not going to back down, even at the expense of their own citizens and economies, it's probably part of Schwab's Great Reset anyway.

- Anything could happen right now, on the one hand we might see a peace deal offered soon, on the other hand the West might double down with a false flag nuke attack or decide to officially send NATO troops in to defend Kiev.

Dear Yuyutsu,

You wrote: “Let alone whether or not the West is corrupt (I personally believe that only the U.S.A is corrupt, not Europe, not even Canada), no decent person should accept such horrendous atrocities and allow Putin to continue to afflict them.”

I appeal to the Bible. Sodom and Gomorrah were the paradigms of corruption. In Genesis 18 Abraham argues with God about destroying the cities:

31And he said: ‘Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the Lord. Peradventure there shall be twenty found there.’ And He said: ‘I will not destroy it for the twenty’s sake.”

The above is part of a long going argument between Abraham and God. God destroys the cities, but he listens to the pleas of Abraham and allows Lot and his family to flee the destruction. However, even Lot’s family is not free from corruption, and his daughters lie with Lot after getting him drunk.

Genesis 19:30 And Lot went up out of Zoar, and dwelt in the mountain, and his two daughters with him; for he feared to dwell in Zoar; and he dwelt in a cave, he and his two daughters. 31And the first-born said unto the younger: ‘Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us after the manner of all the earth. 32Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.’ 33And they made their father drink wine that night. And the first-born went in, and lay with her father; and he knew not when she lay down, nor when she arose.”

The point of the story is that even in corrupt Sodom and Gomorrah there were virtuous individuals. Even though they lapsed from virtue they were saved from destruction.

I believe no country is completely corrupt or completely virtuous. In present day Russia people are standing up against Putin and suffering for it. In Hitler’s Germany there were people like Dietrich Bonhoeffer. In current US I know many virtuous people.

david f write: "I do not hate all things Christian. "

Well I can only go on what I see and I see someone who has consistently blamed Christianity for all things bad and sought to excuse other religions for their worse behaviour. Here we have a david f-antasyland claim that Islam would have defeated the European Dark Ages and ushered in a European enlightenment and industrial revolution, when, in fact, the evidence is that Islam, in the lands it controlled, ultimately created a sustained dark ages which was only alleviated when the Christian west dragged them, kicking and screaming into the modern world.

Thinking that the enlightenment and industrial revolution could have happened anywhere other than in a Christian west, fundamentally misunderstands the forces behind those advancements.

Still if you don't want to offer Christianity any of the credit then why not just create a david f-antasyland where it never happened.

Me? I'll remain in the real world.

"I'm not sure Russia's performed as poorly as you suggest, "

A pithy summary of the last six months.

At the start of the war we all thought Russia had the second best army in the world. We now know they have the second best army in Ukraine.

Hi AC,

Restraint? A quarter of a million troops, with about half that number killed or injured, and almost 50,000 war machines deployed, a third of which have been captured or destroyed. As to whether Putin has committed 20% of his ground force is anyone's guess. With all the corruption in his military it it hard to know how much of his "on paper" army is actually deployable.

Also, the army is systematically murdering and displacing the population as well as destroying all in their path and targeting civilian infrastructure across Ukraine, all under orders from the top.

As you know AC, I believe that Russia could be the most developed and prosperous nation on earth were it not run by cleptocratic gangsters. My take on the Russian army in Ukraine is that its forces are close to the point of being critically depleted: Once their front lines start failing they will have serious problems. They are starting to lose a lot more artillery.

Dear David F.,

I fully agree.

AC,

Russia committed 100% of its troops, most of its tanks and artillery and all it could get or strip from Syria etc. A large portion of its experienced soldiers are dead or wounded and its tanks have been shredded and are being replaced by T62s from the 1960s.

Russia is retreating or frozen on every front and the untrained soldiers will be going home in body bags.

It used to be considered that Russia was the 2nd most powerful military in the world.

Now Russia is the 2nd most powerful military in Ukraine.

Shadowminister

The Russian army is still wreaking havoc in Ukraine. I think it unfortunate that there was such delay in providing western armaments to the Ukrainian forces. Even now they cannot get long range Himars munitions which could be just as devastating against the Russian forces as the short range Himars, and a few more aircraft would not go to waste either. With Putin now targeting other Europeans, there is every reason to provide extra assistance to drive out the Russian army.

A humiliating defeat and exposure of war crimes will seriously threaten Putin's tenure, and with Russia's terrorist army so depleted I hope that democracy might establish a foothold there.

Also, it is believed that Russia has used 1200 of its 1800 precision missiles, which is why it is repurposing its anti-aircraft missiles. The attack on the Kerch Bridge made Putin waste 100 of the inventory, presumably before his generals talked some sense into him. Now Ukraine has the promise of many more missiles from Europe and the United States. A further attack on the Kerch Bridge would be a priority for the Ukrainian military I would hope.

For Bronwyn and AC's enjoyment, here is a video of some of psychopath Vlad's genocidal terrorist army receiving Ukrainian justice:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCIg01sj0wE

Hi Fester,
I'd rather not do tit-for-tat over people blowing other people up.
- It's not a sporting match, but I am quite capable of finding footage of Ukrainian body bits as well stories of Zelensky conscripting teens and elderly at gunpoint and deliberately attacking innocent Russian-speaking people in Luhansk and Donetsk.

If you go back to the beginning, I always supporting peace talks and a negotiated settlement.

It's because I don't support sanctions and overthrows, that I blame the West for this entire mess.
- And that I don't like the US 'Rules-based-order' a unipolar world dictated by US interests that leads to endless wars that I want the West to lose.

- Beyond that it's the average Joe Blow that is paying for this war in blood and money, while leaders continue the war against the interests of their citizens, and give themselves pay-rises (EU yesterday) and have their snouts in the trough over energy deals and Marshall plans.

Who's paying for this war - we all are, but not the elites.
- They're making bank.

[Cont.]
Also FYI, from what I heard about Russian stockpiles, they can keep those 100 a day air strikes going for the next 6 months, and this doesn't include their industrial capacity to restock in the meantime.

Ukrainians were jumping up and down and celebrating the hit on the Kherson bridge, which actually was duping an innocent to drive a truck bomb full of fertilizer over it.

EXPOSED: Before Ukraine blew up Kerch Bridge, British spies plotted it
http://thegrayzone.com/2022/10/10/ukrainian-kerch-bridge/

And one day later their energy grid was largely destroyed, which cut off their water pumping stations and military transport with trains which are mostly electric and they were crying.

You think Putin wont hit diesel locomotives yards, Ukrainian bridges and more substations, 750kw and 330kw transmission lines again next?

Also, Musk is backing out of footing the bill for Starlink support for Ukraine.
He proposed a peace-deal and the Ukrainian ambassador Andrij Melnyk told him to "F--- off", so he decided he best do what they say and told the Pentagon to start paying for it themselves.

Russian troops will outnumber Ukrainians soon.
They've almost completed the mobilisation, the reservists are either in training or pouring into the front.
Ukrainian defensive lines in Bakmut are about to fall.

Territory can easily be recaptured, but trained soldiers can't easily be replaced.
Russia will make strategic withdrawals to save it's men, but Ukraine just keeps throwing theirs into the meat-grinder.

This constant talk of Putin detonating nukes smells a bit off though.
I'm sure the US is up to something.

Hi AC,

100 a day for six months is Russian speak for six days. If Putin could keep up the precision bombardment for six months he would. And were advancements so easily made then why has there been so little progress by the Russian army? Hence Putin's targeting of civilian infrastructure. The video link I provided was to show you how devastating accurate fire can be, and that is the advantage that the Ukrainian military has been acquiring. Long range Himars munitions would have plenty of useful targets.

Evidence of Russian war crimes are plentiful and from a variety of independent sources, whereas evidence of Ukrainian war crimes are almost entirely from Russian state controlled media. But propaganda is an aspect of war, which is why I am more interested in the actual conflict. You can give whatever inflated opinion of the ethical conduct and ability of the Russian army you like, but the flattened cities, destroyed equipment, snails pace advances and huge personnel losses suggest otherwise. Oh, and the footage I have seen of the Kerch Bridge explosion is more indicative of something lower down, possibly a remotely detonated drone as has been suggested. A truck bomb getting through would make the security detail look like clowns, not a good look for tough guy Vlad and his "Best in the world at everything!" Russia.

There's footage out there of the moment the truck detonated on the bridge, have you seen it?
http://youtu.be/S-juPsPG6FE
Looking at the footage just now, it almost looks like there was a smaller second detonation around the pylons (at 52 seconds )

Russia has said that the explosives were hidden in rolls of plastic for use on construction sites, I can't exactly remember the weight, maybe 22 tonnes or 22,000 pounds, but I'm not exactly sure if I remember that correctly, certainly more than what any drone can carry, and not like the attack on the military base in Crimea, which was said to be a South Korean drones modified to drop mortar shells (which they dropped on fuel tanks)

AC,

It seems as though your sources are permanently wrong. Russia is running low on missiles or else it wouldn't be converting S300 missiles into inaccurate surface missiles. The 100 missiles a day for 6 months is a fantasy.

The latest tantrum from Moscow has reduced their stockpile even further. And for the $1bn in missiles used Russia has hit very few strategic targets with Ukraine shooting down more than half. What it has encouraged is the west to send plenty of even more sophisticated air defence systems, more HIMARS systems and a huge stockpile of rockets for them.

Ukraine's army is now between 700 000 to 800 000 with many of them receiving NATO training. Russia's army is presently being chewed up at an increasing rate and its new recruits have no training and crappy equipment.

Russia is likely to lose Kherson in the next few weeks as they face a massive build-up of Ukrainian forces and heavy weapons. They know this and are already evacuating personnel. That the Kerch bridge is badly damaged does not help their logistics.

The only minuscule gains that the Russians are making are in the Donbas where the Wagner group is smashing itself against the heavily fortified Bakhmut. The Wagner group has lost so many people that they are now recruiting from prisons.

Russia is losing and losing badly.

Hi AC,

I suspect that the explosives were under the bridge as it looks as if the two failed sections were lifted up by the blast. Maybe an autonomous sub?

The Russian military's war crime strategy of destroying civil infrastructure seems to be replacing the tactic of destroying the Ukrainian military. The Ukrainian military's strategy, aside from targeting command posts, seems to have changed to one of containment and encirclement along with the use of raiding parties and accurate targeting of Russian artillery. I get the impression that Russia has lost so many tanks and apcs that it has little offensive capability along a large front. It could retreat to a smaller front, not that Emperor Vlad would allow this, but even with such action the Russian forces would keep getting picked off by more accurate Ukrainian weaponry. That the Russian military has lasted so long is more due to the slow flow of weapons from the west. To be fair though, nobody realised how hard the Ukrainians would fight nor how damaging to the world a protracted conflict would be.

"The Russian military's war crime strategy of destroying civil infrastructure seems to be replacing the tactic of destroying the Ukrainian military."

It's only a war crime when someone other that the west does it?

In any case it might be one and the same.
Destroy the power grid, destroy the UAF ability to move troops and weapons and resupply by rail.
(not to mention that stranded trains full of troops and weapons are also much easier to hit than moving ones.)

"To be fair though, nobody realised how hard the Ukrainians would fight nor how damaging to the world a protracted conflict would be."

Over at RAND corporation they war-game everything, it's hard for me to think the US didn't have some idea where things would lead.

Ukraine is now in the wet season, Ukrainian offensives are becoming increasingly difficult due to soft soil and boggy conditions, and Russian / allied forces defensive lines are slowly strengthening due to arrival of reservists.

The war seems to be increasingly fought with drones, they say the Iranian designed Geraniums (Many call them Iranian drones, but in truth they may in fact be Iranian designed but produced in Russia)
cost as little as $5,000 to $10,000 a piece, with a payload ranging from 5 pounds to 30 pounds and with a speed between 180km to 200km, a million dollars you can purchase between 1000 to 2000 drones, so they are extremely cheap and efficient, and Ukraine has little in the way of defense against them.

They say Bakhmut is close to falling, and western support might dry up further after the US mid terms in November, whilst the EU is going to be in the midst of winter.

Also there's a significant amount of dissent starting to come from EU citizens in various countries.

[Cont.]
"I suspect that the explosives were under the bridge as it looks as if the two failed sections were lifted up by the blast. Maybe an autonomous sub?"

One section looked a little bit strange off memory, but then you also had the blast marks on the road, and the huge spray of gunpowder, so I'm not exactly sure.

- I'm just going on what the Russian military has stated, whether you think this is reliable or not, who's to say.

Looks like the US is chucking a big tantrum about those Iranian drones.
What does that tell you?

U.S warns Iran after Russia’s Kamikaze drone strike destroys Kyiv; Heat on Islamic Republic
http://youtu.be/S66kT9AeZiE

Officially, since January 2021, the United States has committed more than $13.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine.

It sounds to me like an admission they can't shoot them down.
I've even heard already that troops are resorting to small arms fire to try and do so.

US has given 13.5bln in military aid, plus the military donations of 30 western countries and they cant defend against a $10,000 drone.
- And I've even heard some people say they can be built for $700.

Iran's Shahed-136 / Geranium-2 : a Nasty Enemy UAV That Terrorizes Enemies
http://youtu.be/MFbLxRpFUNE

Look at the lies the media is telling:

Iran breaching nuclear deal by providing Russia with armed drones, says UK
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/17/iran-breaching-nuclear-deal-by-providing-russia-with-armed-drones-says-uk

Anyone that goes and reads the JCPoA will know the media is lying.
The deal was removal of sanctions in return for non-enrichment of uranium, but Trump cancelled the deal and reimposed sanctions.
- So there is no deal, but the media thinks all you are idiots and never paid attention enough to actually read the terms of the JCPoA.

The deal was nullified when Trump pulled US out of the deal and reimposed the sanctions.
The media is lying on that, and they know it.

Hi AC,

I am always very impressed with the thought that you put into things. I agree with you that the drones are a problem, with the question being how many can be built? I think they might have a US made chip in them, so the manufacturer would have to get around the sanctions. I believe that the drones are vulnerable to small arms fire. Given that they are slow I think the the Ukrainians will get better at stopping them. Remember that the Bismarck was vulnerable to slow moving torpedo bombers because its anti-aircraft guns were calibrated to faster moving targets.

As for the bridge, of more interest to me is the question of whether the Ukrainians can hit it again.

Regarding wars crimes, targeting infrastructure critical for the survival of a civilian population seems to meet the standard.

AC,

The West clearly tries not to hit civilians while the Russians deliberately target civilians including residential buildings and playgrounds.

The drones were made in Iran and now Iran is facing additional sanctions. The base drone sells for US$20 000 which after payload, controls + transporting them to Russia probably cost closer to $40 000 each. Which is nearly 1/2 of what a HIMARS missile costs. The drones are slow flying and more than 1/2 of them are shot down.

Bahkmut has been about to fall for months. Russia has lost 100s of troops trying to take it and has gained a few dozen km2 while the Ukrainians have gained 1000s of km2 in both the north and south.

As for the 250 000 draftees sent to the front with zero training, they will do little and already are arriving back home in body bags. With zero winter supplies or clothing, many will simply freeze to death.

Russia is running out of missiles, tanks and soldiers, while the Ukraine army is swelling with NATO-trained soldiers and ever more NATO weapons.

The Russian army is close to collapse.

Shadowminister wrote:

"The West clearly tries not to hit civilians while the Russians deliberately target civilians including residential buildings and playgrounds."

As I remember the village of My Lai in Vietnam was destroyed and the people massacred by forces of the West. There were 'shock and awe' bombings of Iraq. The West sometimes deliberately slaughters civilians, but some people find it convenient to ignore our crimes. War is a dirty business, and supporters of one side find it convenient to focus on the crimes of the other side.

A biblical verse is apt. Matthew 7:5 Hypocrite! First cast out the beam from your eye, and then you will see clearly to cast out the splinter from the eye of your brother

David,

My Lai in Vietnam (1968) was an atrocity and probably not the only one, but what happened was an exception rather than the rule in a 20year war.

The Gulf war shock and awe strategy did not target civilians so is not valid.

The Russians however, are deliberately targeting civilian residential areas and buildings and are routinely torturing and executing civilians in the areas they have occupied.

Dear shadowminister,

I don't trust the media. Maybe we are the good guys, and the other side the bad guys. During the Vietnamese war my cousin was a major in the US air force. His picture of the war was quite different from the picture most of the media were giving us. According to him most Vietnamese were against us. He wanted to resign his commission, but he wasn't allowed to. He continued to fly and engage in raids against North Vietnam. He did have the option of refusing promotion. If an officer continues to refuse promotion eventually he will be discharged. That is how my cousin got out. He had planned a career in the US military, but Vietnam ended that. I later read how the Tonkin Gulf incident which justified US intervention in Vietnam was based on a lie. Apparently what the Russians are doing in Ukraine is horrible. However, unlike Vietnam, I know nobody on either side so I have only the media which I distrust and official figures who I also distrust for information.

Hi David,

You are suggesting an enormous conspiracy of independent sources to falsify the reporting of the war in Ukraine. I think that were your conspiracy theory correct it would be a resounding endorsement of western democracy. To be able to coordinate hundreds of thousands of people suggests incredible organisation. Flattening Mariupol, staging Bucha, bombing theatres, schools, hospitals, markets and train stations. That would require incredible skill to conceal, not to mention hiding all those Nazis, drug addicts and homosexuals. In contrast, Russia seems to fair very poorly with their propaganda, and their war effort seems equally abysmal.

I do note that Russia is not denying targeting critical civilian infrastructure. How is this action justified?

Ultimately I think that the war will need to be ended by force. Toward that end I hope that Ukraine will be supplied with better air defence to better protect civilian infrastructure along with long range munitions to target Russian supply lines.

Dear Fester,

I am not suggesting an enormous conspiracy of independent sources to falsify the reporting of the war in Ukraine. We do not need an enormous conspiracy. All we need are some credible false accounts mixed in with the valid accounts. We now know that the Tonkin Gulf Resolution was based on a false account of an encounter. However, the US participation in the Vietnamese War was based on that one false account.

Dear Fester,

The powers-that-be don't need a vast conspiracy to justify getting involved in a war.The US got involved in the Second Gulf War based on three lies. The three were:

1. Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction
2. He was involved in the destruction of the Twin Towers in Manhattan.
3. He was importing yellow cake for nuclear weapons.

All the above statements proved to be lies. Colin Powell justified the attack on Iraq by citing these lies to the UN. He later apologized stating that he had been misled into believing they were true.

There's a Chinese proverb. Fool me once. Shame on you. Fool me twice. Shame on me.

I no longer believe we tell the truth, and the other guys lie. I believe we should not rush to judgment.

David,

When I see someone saying that they don't trust the media it normally means that they want to ignore any facts that counter their own opinions.

However, there are a few facts that are clear:
1 Russia had no real justification for attacking Ukraine. There was no threat of attack from Nato.
2 Russia has committed 1000s of war crimes and has no problem targeting civilians.
3 Russia is losing the war.

Hi David,

I thought that dubious provocations and terrible outcomes were the norm for warfare, with the conflict in Ukraine being no exception.

US involvement in Vietnam had more to do with a fear of the USSR and communist China funding insurgency and establishing a proxy regime, much like the insurgency and false provocations Russia has been using in Ukraine to justify invasion.

Again, I think the war in Ukraine tragic and horrible, but as a diplomatic solution is as likely as the participants in this discussion agreeing, I see the conflict continuing until the Russian military is depleted or Putin is deposed. With Russia now conducting the war as a terrorist regime, Ukraine's allies will hopefully provide greater assistance to protect civilian infrastructure and defeat the invading army.

Dear Fester,

You wrote: US involvement in Vietnam had more to do with a fear of the USSR and communist China funding insurgency and establishing a proxy regime, much like the insurgency and false provocations Russia has been using in Ukraine to justify invasion.

I disagree. The Vietnamese wished to be free of colonial domination by the French. After WW2 the French, Dutch and English wished to reestablish their colonial empires in southeast Asia. The people in those places wished to be free of foreign domination whether it was by Japanese or the European powers. The English got out of India, but the Dutch and French tried to hold on with the aid of Australia and the US.

Ho Chi Minh in Vietnam originally appealed to the US for help. As the US freed itself from English domination he hoped that the US would help the Vietnamese be free from French domination.

https://www.archives.gov/historical-docs/todays-doc/?dod-date=228 contains a record of Ho Chi Minh’s appeal to Truman which Truman ignored. Ho Chi Minh wanted the aid of the US in becoming independent. In Vietnam it was the US and the French who established puppet governments under Ngo Dinh Diem and Bao Dai in south Vietnam. The US and Australia had no more business in Vietnam than Putin has in Ukraine. Putin is trying to bring back the old Russian Empire, and the US supported European domination in Vietnam. In fact Vietnam fought a war with China after the US left. Vietnam was never a puppet of China. They only wanted to be independent, and they now are independent.

Hi David,

Post WWII I think it a little fanciful to imagine that the US would back a dpr over French rule. The claim is that all the people from Luhansk, Kerson, Donetsk and Crimea want is independence from Ukraine and alliance with Russia. Is that what they want or is it what Vlad wants? The Vietnam war is history now and the only good I see from the conflict is the migration of Vietnamese people to other parts of the world. I hope that the war in Ukraine can at least achieve a reduction in Russia's ability to commit acts of terrorism.

Dear Fester,

What is a dpr? Perhaps it was fanciful for Ho Chi Minh to think that the US would back him against the French. Unfortunately former colonies become colonial powers. Indonesia which was a Dutch colony is now a colonial power in West Irian. Nevertheless, the US and Australia had no more business in Vietnam than Putin has in Ukraine.

The US has been a colonial power in the Philippines and waged a war of aggression against Mexico. Grant in his memoirs stated:

The Southern rebellion was largely the outgrowth of the Mexican war. Nations, like individuals, are punished for their transgressions. We got our punishment in the most sanguinary and expensive war of modern times.

Hi David,

dpr = democratic people's republic

One of the achievements of western civilisation I appreciate is places like this where we are free to argue and express opinions. I think it good to reflect on ideas and realise that people can see the world quite differently.

On a national basis I think openness and reflection a strong driver of change (hopefully for the good). An example is the My Lai massacre making the US military more open and accountable.

I authoritarian Russia you can freely express the opinion of the state, but you do not have the same freedom to challenge it. Nor is the military open and accountable, so unlike My Lai, massacres in the Russian military are commonplace and often ordered from the top.

My hope is that the internet allows Russians access to information and will allow them to reflect on what the Russian military is doing in Ukraine, like this fellow has:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63346300

Dear Fester,

I appreciate the freedom we have in democratic countries to criticise the government and others that we find at fault. That freedom comes with an obligation, and the obligation is to use that freedom.

Wm Calley who ordered the massacre served three years of house arrest. His punishment was a slap on the wrist. From an article about Calley:

"In March of 1968 Calley and his men arrived at the village of M&#7929; Lai where they murdered hundreds of elderly men, women, children, and infants from allied South Vietnam. In addition, he and his men gang-raped many of the women, some as young as 12 years old, before mutilating them, even stopping to have lunch before resuming their slaughter. Calley would later state in court about the deaths, claiming an air strike killed the innocent civilians. There was no sign of enemy combatants in M&#7929; Lai when he and his men arrived."

In some other countries nothing would happened to him at all. However you wrote: "An example is the My Lai massacre making the US military more open and accountable."

Can you cite any evidence that the massacre made "the US military more open and accountable"?

Hi David,

From what I read it has, e.g.:

https://www.dw.com/en/lessons-for-the-us-from-my-lai-50-years-after-the-massacre/a-42969338

My impression is that the US military is more open to public scrutiny and consequently commits fewer war crimes than say the Russian military. Do you think that public scrutiny makes any difference? For example, do you think that the Chinese military would behave differently were the Tiananmen Square massacre not wiped from Chinese history? I am under the impression that democracy is facilitated if people know what is happening.

Also, if transparency and public scrutiny were of no concern, then why would Chinese authorities go to great lengths to erase evidence of this fellow from the public record?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-63339816

Dear Fester,

You wrote: “My impression is that the US military is more open to public scrutiny and consequently commits fewer war crimes than say the Russian military. Do you think that public scrutiny makes any difference? For example, do you think that the Chinese military would behave differently were the Tiananmen Square massacre not wiped from Chinese history? I am under the impression that democracy is facilitated if people know what is happening.”

I agree that public scrutiny can make a difference. I also agree that democracy is facilitated if people know what is happening.

One way to look at the actions of any military is to allow the ICC (International Criminal Court) to examine those actions. The following lists the nations who allow the ICC jurisdiction.

https://asp.icc-cpi.int/states-parties

“123 countries are States Parties to the Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court. Out of them 33 are African States, 19 are Asia-Pacific States, 18 are from Eastern Europe, 28 are from Latin American and Caribbean States, and 25 are from Western European and other States.”

Among nations which do not allow the ICC jurisdiction are Russia, China and the US. Public scrutiny makes a difference, and the US avoids it. One example is the case of Julian Assange.

https://truthout.org/articles/julian-assange-is-enduring-unbearable-persecution-for-exposing-us-war-crimes/

“Assange’s indictment is based on WikiLeaks’s 2010-2011 disclosures of U.S. war crimes in Iraq, Afghanistan and the military prison at Guantánamo. Those revelations included 400,000 field reports about the Iraq War; 15,000 unreported deaths of Iraqi civilians; and systematic rape, torture and murder committed by Iraqi forces after the U.S. military “handed over detainees to a notorious Iraqi torture squad.” WikiLeaks also disclosed the Afghan War Logs, which are 90,000 reports of more civilian casualties by coalition forces than the U.S. military had admitted to. And its revelations additionally included the Guantánamo Files, 779 secret reports showing that 150 innocent people had been held there for years and documenting the torture and abuse of 800 men and boys in violation of the Geneva Conventions and the Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment.”

Hi David,

Civilian deaths are the most compelling argument against war. Jules tends to exploit these deaths for profit in the same way that televangelists exploit Christianity. Well, some deaths, but not the civilians deliberately murdered by his backers. Jules' humanitarianism is for sale, which is what makes him revolting to me. I don't discount any civilian death, but I am unaware of the US military deliberately targeting civilians or infrastructure, nor of them using the civilian population as a shield for their combatants.

For example, in 20 years of war in Afghanistan there were about 70,000 civilian casualties. in itself a great argument against the conflict. So what is the breakdown? How many killed by the Taliban? How many died as a result of being used as human shields? How many were deliberately targeted by the US military? Do you think that the US military deliberately targeted civilians and civilian infrastructure? Did they capture towns, sort through the civilian populations, torturing, murdering, raping and looting as they pleased, using them as human shields, then burying their victims in mass graves? All of that is standard operating procedure for the Russian military, yet it provokes no reaction from Vlad's good friend Jules.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/feb/17/taliban-human-shields

Dear Fester,

You wrote:

For example, in 20 years of war in Afghanistan there were about 70,000 civilian casualties. in itself a great argument against the conflict. So what is the breakdown? How many killed by the Taliban? How many died as a result of being used as human shields? How many were deliberately targeted by the US military? Do you think that the US military deliberately targeted civilians and civilian infrastructure? Did they capture towns, sort through the civilian populations, torturing, murdering, raping and looting as they pleased, using them as human shields, then burying their victims in mass graves? All of that is standard operating procedure for the Russian military, yet it provokes no reaction from Vlad's good friend Jules.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/feb/17/taliban-human-shields

Who is Jules? Unfortunately the US is responsible for many civilian deaths. The US massacred American Indians in the Indian wars and Filipinos in the Filipino-American War which followed the Spanish-American War.

Brown University records the following:

https://watson.brown.edu/costsofwar/costs/human/civilians
“The U.S. post-9/11 wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Syria, and Pakistan have taken a tremendous human toll on those countries. As of September 2021, an estimated 387,072 civilians in these countries have died violent deaths as a result of the wars. Civilian deaths have also resulted from U.S. post-9/11 military operations in Somalia and other countries.
People living in the war zones have been killed in their homes, in markets, and on roadways. They have been killed by bombs, bullets, fire, improvised explosive devices (IEDs), and drones. Civilians die at checkpoints, as they are run off the road by military vehicles, when they step on mines or cluster bombs, as they collect wood or tend to their fields, and when they are kidnapped and executed for purposes of revenge or intimidation. They are killed by the United States, by its allies, and by insurgents and sectarians in the civil wars spawned by the invasions.”

continued

Not all the deaths mentioned above are a consequence of US actions, but many of them are. The report recommends:

• The U.S. government should include civilian deaths and injuries in public reporting of war deaths, including a tally of children killed.

• The U.S. government should [do] a more comprehensive and thorough job investigating allegations of civilian deaths that result from its drone strikes.

The US deliberately targeted civilian areas. However, the following indicates there has been a change in policy.

https://www.degruyter.com/document/doi/10.7591/9780801454578-005/pdf

United States leaders’ normative beliefs about targeting civilians with conventional strategic bombing and the practices themselves have changed dramatically over the last nearly seventy years. Specifically, before and during World War II, and to a lesser degree in Korea, military and civilian leaders believed that targeting civilians was militarily necessary and effective. Perceptions of military necessity consistently trumped the value of civilian immunity, which itself was an emerging normative belief. It was considered acceptable to deliberately target civilians and to be relatively unconcerned when civilians were harmed incidentally as “collateral damage.” Targeting civilian morale and economic infrastructure generally led to the same consequences as deliberately targeting civilian bodies, since those bodies were often located alongside economic assets. During the long Vietnam War, which I argue constitutes a turning point in U.S. policy, it became less acceptable among military professionals and the public to deliberately target civilians or to strike in ways that could lead to foreseeable harm. Ad hoc procedures put constraints on bombing that could harm civilians. After Vietnam, declaratory policy and operational planning increasingly emphasized protecting civilians and U.S. authorities instituted methods to mitigate civilian casualties. The emphasis on civilian casualty avoidance and its institutionalization is seen in the first Gulf War and U.S. air operations in the Balkans. While there was still a degree of tolerance for

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