The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > Coronavirus lockdown: we need our freedom now more than ever > Comments

Coronavirus lockdown: we need our freedom now more than ever : Comments

By Edmund Baha, published 12/5/2020

In the past few weeks, all around the world, governments have held their own citizens hostage in the name of 'protecting the people'.

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. Page 4
  6. All
Hi Chris,

Yes, there is some crazy talk here. Do some people, some posters, have a sort of death wish, or an "End of Days" notion that maybe god has sent this virus to destroy all the evil people of the world, i.e. the vast majority, in his/her/its time-honoured way of destroying the world in order to re-build it it, and bring about heaven on earth ?

Ain't working :). Except maybe in the US (well, maybe the 'destruction' part is). Their fair-weather "President" is so out of his depth and worse, is oblivious of that, while a complete disaster is looming in 'Little America' with his 'policy' of opening up while the Curve is still high.

I can't explain what the fruit-cakes are on about (oh hello, Runner, didn't see you there) except by some disaster scenario which they are welcoming. Praising Sweden with its 2,000 deaths and slagging Australia with its less than one hundred, worshipping the architect of the US's 80,000 deaths and counting - that might make horrible sense from that point of view.

Loony tunes, as Reagan would call them. Do some people think this is all just a disaster movie that they will happily avoid thanks to god ?

Joe
Posted by loudmouth2, Tuesday, 12 May 2020 3:59:01 PM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Hostage is an unnecessary & opportunistic term by those to whom self-centred ideology
is the main issue, not the health of a whole Nation !
Posted by individual, Tuesday, 12 May 2020 6:09:01 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
A libertarian actuary, I'm not sure there is a more dangerous beast alive.

There were two notable Norwegian actuaries who found Nazi ideals allowed them the chance to flourish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birger_Meidell

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sverre_Krogh_(editor)

If the debate about Australia adopting the universal health system call Medicare was being proposed what side do you think the author would take?

This pandemic was always going to be a balance between freedom of and freedom from. The author is focused on just one. Luckily our government recognised and attempted to get right that balance. Have they gone overboard one way or the other? We will never know, but I feel a lot less fearful for my elderly relatives here than I would have in countries like the US or Sweden where the fear of succumbing to this disease would have been very real.
Posted by SteeleRedux, Tuesday, 12 May 2020 7:23:53 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
An excellent piece but probably think that only because it aligns with my thinking and I am a social libertarian :)
Posted by Valley Guy, Tuesday, 12 May 2020 8:28:47 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
There is this a lot of this black/white thinking around.

To some, its either total lockdown or no protective measures at all. One or t'other. No middle ground.

In my earlier thread, I opined that at the start when data was scarce and terror abundant, it was fair and prudent that governments assume the worst.

But remember that that was the 'flatten-the-curve' time. The aim wasn't so much to save lives, as to save the health system from the kind of catastrophes that happened in Lombardy and Wuhan. That policy had a use-by date and we all signed up.

But then we started getting more and better information: children were neither in danger nor transmitters; it rarely if ever affected those under 60 and even then only those who had other conditions; people over 60 with other conditions were in danger and needed to be protected.

But still we closed schools. Still we closed cafes, restaurants etc. Still we told young fit health adults to cower in their homes. None of which was necessary.

And then we bought in the police to enforce rules that were just made up on the spot and had no rationale behind them. And neighbours were encouraged to dob on neighbours.

The most worrying and/or interesting part of it was that we adopted and embraced this embryonic police state with ease and even eagerness. "The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed and hence clamorous to be led to safety". Mencken

There were/are other options. Honestly tell those who are most at risk that they are most at risk and how they can protect themsleves. Sequester all nursing homes. But open up all schools allowing teachers and kids in at-risk situations to stay away. Utterly open the entire economy but allow those at-risk to stay out of it while the danger passes and give those people the economic wherewithal to stay sequestered.

We had options then and we have options now. That we are going down a different path is a disaster that the nation will be paying for for generations.
Posted by mhaze, Wednesday, 13 May 2020 7:40:02 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Mhaze,

Of course there are positions between your black and white: total this or toal that. Morrison's approach, an early quarantining of the country and lock-down with conditions, seems to have worked. Has Trump's worked ? 86,000 dead and counting.

But I'll concede that Trump might be onto something:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/trump-says-coronavirus-testing-overratedclaims-fewer-cases-if-no-testing-2020-05-14

By extension, if they didn't count the number of deaths in the US - so dispiriting and un-American - then clearly there would have been fewer deaths. You can't trust health professionals or those petty bean-counters. Miserable, pessimistic bastards ! Probably from sh!thole countries. [Well, yes, i.e. the US]

So there's a clear black-white situation for you, Mhaze: either

* don't test or count cases, always look on the bright side, ignore the so-called 'experts'; or

* test like mad, count cases, respond to positive cases and treat, and save American lives.

So, should the world do a Morrison or do a Trump ? One hundred deaths or one hundred thousand in a couple of weeks ? And climbing ?

Joe
Posted by loudmouth2, Friday, 15 May 2020 1:44:26 PM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. Page 4
  6. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy