Like them or not, is it possible that China could soon be part of Australia's (and NZ's) re-opened supply chains (plus tourism, education, etc.), along with Taiwan and South Korea ? And as other countries become relatively clear of the Coronavirus, they can join up with that economic zone ?

Of course, countries with far less competent administrations, such as the UK and the US, will still be outside that healthy and active economic zone perhaps well into next year.

Joe

What they want us to know and the facts, may be two very different stories?

I can believe that the leadership values human life so cheaply as to be able to spend 15 or more million? If that suits long term ambitions or the preferred political narrative!

As for ramped up manufacturing? Judge it by the smog index! And the volume of raw imports, i.e., iron ore and metallurgical and thermal coal?

Other than that, trust but watch!
Alan B.

Who to believe on COVID spread and deaths in China ? :

- Xi's Communist Party

- or what may be a Trump mouthpiece, the Washington, D.C. based American Enterprise Institute, which pushes a democratic capitalism, limited government, private enterprise agenda. The AEI is closely associated with conservatism and neo-conservatism, although it is officially non-partisan. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Enterprise_Institute .

You can bet your bottom dollar that the CCP will be doing its level best to make the most of the crippling results their virus have had on the rest of the world.

I wouldn't put any money on our own mutts.

Previously electricity consumption was a good parameter for economic
production. However it was used to a large extent by finance writers
so the Chinese now probably being aware will fiddle the consumption figures.
However the smog index would be good for heavy industry and hard to fiddle.
Perhaps traffic analysis in industrial areas by satellite might be useful.

LOUDmouth,

You speak like a true believer of the one belt one road initiative.

For myself I want to know if China is prepared to compensate the rest pf the world for the damage and loss of life its Wuhan bat soup virus has caused.

Michael Knox,

It's my opinion that the Wuhan bat soup virus pandemic will set China back 60 years.

When things normalise, the advanced countries will scramble to restructure their economies to become self-sufficient, decreasing reliance on China for manufactures they can produce themselves.

What is the good of China having its industries prepared to supply the world again if the rest of the world is not in a position to buy its products or has decided not to buy its products?

Giday Mr Opinion

And then again Western scholars suspect the so-called "Spanish flu" started in the US in 1918.

But as the US was the major profiteer of WWI, impoverishing the British Empire (including Australia) in paying back US war loans, the US writes the history.

Note:

THE US HAS NEVER BEEEN ASKED TO PAY FOR THE 50 MILLION DEATHS FROM MISNAMED "SPANISH FLU"

see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu#United_States

"United States

Some have suggested that the epidemic originated in the United States. Historian Alfred W. Crosby stated in 2003 that the flu originated in Kansas,[26] and popular author John M. Barry described a January 1918 outbreak in Haskell County, Kansas, as the point of origin in his 2004 article.[5]

A 2018 study of tissue slides and medical reports led by evolutionary biology professor Michael Worobey found evidence against the disease originating from Kansas, as those cases were milder and had fewer deaths compared to the infections in New York City in the same time period.

The study did find evidence through phylogenetic analyses that the virus likely had a North American origin, though it was not conclusive.

In addition, the haemagglutinin glycoproteins of the virus suggest that it originated long before 1918, and other studies suggest that the reassortment of the H1N1 virus likely occurred in or around 1915.[27]"

Cheers

plantagenet,

Are you suggesting there is a relationship between the Spanish Flu and the Wuhan Bat Soup Virus?

Everybody around the world witnessed the first outbreak of the Wuhan Bat Soup Virus on their televisions, which basically means that there were billions of witnesses to the fact that the coronavirus started in China.

The question now is its source inside Wuhan. Did it escape from a lab or did it migrate from animal to human in a wet market? Either way, China is liable for being the source of the pandemic and should compensate the rest of the world for the damage and loss of life it was capable of preventing.

And Trump?

The novel concept of a country's liability for a WORLDWIDE COVID-19 pandemic is Trump's latest attempt to deflect blame away from his delay in handling COVID-19 spread through the US

- together with Trump treating COVID-19 as fake news.
________________________________________________________

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_in_the_United_States

"Meanwhile, President Donald Trump was optimistic and 'cheer-leading the country,'dismissing and downplaying the threat posed by coronavirus and claiming the outbreak was under control.

February 25 was the first time that the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention warned the American public to prepare for a local outbreak..."

Contrary to what has been a fairly clear anti Islam attitude from China
I wonder if there is a minor shift in that attitude.
China has a copper mine in the Taliban area of Afghanistan and they have
made a deal with the Taliban for them to guard the site.
They are supplying weapons to the Taliban which probably will spell the
end of the Kabul government.
It could be worth considering that both China and Islam have the same
aims, to destroy the democratic countries and to impose their way of
life on the whole world.
They might go into a compact to cooperate in that aim and perhaps divide
the world between them.
I can see that if they succeeded the Islamists would turn on China as
Allah must rule the world.
Can it be that two such powers can avoid real warfare or other conflict ?

«Like them or not, is it possible that China could soon be part of Australia's (and NZ's) re-opened supply chains (plus tourism, education, etc.), along with Taiwan and South Korea ?»

Only if the regime there changes.
Sadly not so likely.
It will, eventually, but what if it takes 1000 years?

Until then, COVID or no COVID, we should have no dealings with China, except perhaps in trying to bring back home from there the last Australian hostages, including children in Wuhan.

Remember how they view Australia? Chewing-gum stuck to the sole of their shoe...

Islands like Taiwan should be OK, perhaps eventually also Japan and PNG, so long as they too agree to have no contact with others outside the bubble, including China, but I would be concerned about having any contact with countries that share land-borders with others that have not yet eliminated the virus.

What a great opportunity to develop self-sufficiency!

FREE TIBET!

Yuyutsu,

Perhaps not a thousand years, more like one, tops.

Economies like Australia and the US have junked their self-sufficiency in exchange for cheap Chinese goods. In the process we have wound down our workforce with those particular skills in automobile manufacture, clothing, building materials, etc. We have become beholden to China and to its supply chains.

Like every other country, China will want to get back to work ASAP. Like other countries, Australia will want to be plugged into 'reliable' supply chains ASAP. And that will certainly include China.

No, I don't like the idea of being so dependent on a totalitarian government, economically and politically. I'm very suspicious of the Belt and Road Initiative, especially in relation to the south Pacific. Well, to South-East Asia as well. And to Africa. I've written many times on OLO about China's aggressions in the South China Sea (there should be a more appropriate name for it: South-East Asian Sea ?) and about the ridiculous and quite imperialist claims that China makes against the sovereignty of south-East Asian countries.

But economic realities will force us, and much of the world's economies, into the arms of China again. It's not easy to whip up alternative suppliers and markets, so we're stuck with that situation for some time yet.

Joe

Loudmouth 2 said;
China makes against the sovereignty of south-East Asian countries.

Pres Xi Jingping himself said that the US and presumably Australia are
not sovereign states. We are after all is said and done vassal states.

Bazz,

The full quote really was:

" ... the ridiculous and quite imperialist claims that China makes against the sovereignty of south-East Asian countries."

If they stick up for themselves, and work closely together, they will be able to defend their sovereignty, I have no doubt. As we can too. I don't think it's time yet to throw in the towel :)

The Chinese, and the Mongols too before them, have tried a few times to invade Vietnam, for example: they have had their arses kicked each time. The great Uighur admiral Cheng Ho gave Vietnam a wide berth. They have never got as far militarily as Malaya or Thailand, or even the Philippines yet. So throwing ourselves on our backs and begging for mercy is a bit premature :)

Joe

LOUDmouth,

You are incorrect because they did get further south than the Malay peninsula.

They got as far as Java in 1271 and attempted to subdue it but after a few battles were forced out by a confederation of several Javanese states.

Misopinionated,

Incorrect - how ? They got their arses kicked even by the Javanese in about 1293-1295. And of course, it wasn't the Chinese but the Mongols by then.

Strictly speaking, the Chinese have ruled China for barely half of the last millenium: the Mongols and Manchus (also Mongols) for almost as long. A bit like calling various Indian imperial governments British. Or vice versa.

In reality, for example, the Chinese ruled Taiwan only in the years immediately after the Second World War, from 1945 until 1949.

You really are an idiot. Keep posting and prove it.

Joe

LOUDmouth,

Here is a snippet from Wikipedia on the Yuan Dynasty established by Kublai Khan in 1271:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuan_dynasty

The Yuan Dynasty is chronicled as a Chinese dynasty.

I erred in putting the invasion at 1271 which is actually the year Kublai Khan established the Yuan Dynasty. As you stated the invasion was later.

I think we can say with correctness that the armies of the Yuan Dynasty sent to Java would have been Chinese, especially the naval fleets that carried the armies of the Chinese Emperor.

I must admit that you have a good knowledge of things you do not have any credentials in. It's too bad you could never qualify to get into an Arts program because I think you would have made a very good Arts graduate. Not as good as me of course, I mean you can only push your luck so far.