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The Forum > Article Comments > The future of the EU in the wake of Trump’s betrayal > Comments

The future of the EU in the wake of Trump’s betrayal : Comments

By Alon Ben-Meir, published 23/7/2018

Trump has become a marionette manipulated by a master puppeteer, Putin.

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SD,

Invective isn't the same as evidence.

You made claims about 1941 which I demonstrated to be utter rubbish.

Your options were to offer other evidence that supported your claims or to throw a tantrum over being outed as historically ignorant.

That you did the latter says all that needs to be said.
Posted by mhaze, Wednesday, 25 July 2018 2:47:01 PM
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haze, you demonstrated that you walk with the pygmys, I made no mention of 1941 but if you're talking about Pearl Harbour, and what aspect of Pearl Harbour I don't know. I maintained that the Japanese were manipulated into a situation that war became the only option in the 10 years previous. The Yanks took advantage of the Japanese culture and gave them no way out.
You want us to believe the Yanks had no idea as to what the Japanese were up to in the years previous to Pearl Harbour. Give me a break!
Didn't mention it in your Marvel comic books? ahh well guess Capt America forgot to mention it
Posted by Special Delivery, Wednesday, 25 July 2018 9:03:30 PM
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" I made no mention of 1941 "

You were talking about how the US entered the war and offered a couple of reasons as to why they entered on the allies side. Reasons such as Germany running out of money and US ambitions to control Arabian oil.

When do you think the US entered the war? I'm pretty sure it was 1941!

Sorry, I thought I was conversing with someone who had a passing understanding of the history. Clearly I was wrong.
Posted by mhaze, Thursday, 26 July 2018 1:06:31 PM
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Plan B. Come on fellers, we are as guilty as the EU of not carrying our share of the weight of defence costs.

The only way we could even start to be able to defend ourselves alone would be a full nuclear defence force. We would have to make conquering us more costly than what is to be gained from doing it. Defending ourselves, & winning against anyone in the major league is just a pipe dream.

To have even that capacity we would have to drop NDIS, Gonski, Foreign Aid, Age pensions, unemployment & disability benefits, & a couple dozen of useless government quangos.

Even then it would take us a decade to build the necessary people, assuming the yanks sold us the equipment a cut rates.

Right now we couldn't fight our way out of a wet paper bag, & current plan B just might allow us to make a hole we could see out of, if that.
Posted by Hasbeen, Thursday, 26 July 2018 5:33:29 PM
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Admittedly Plan B wouldn't be easy but there is the Israeli precedent in building up conventional and nuclear forces.

Poorer, smaller (than Australia) Israel, could afford full nuclear capabilities as it was/is prepared to use them under the "Never Again" Doctrine aka Samson Option. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samson_Option#Deterrence_doctrine

Even against Russian forces in the Middle East, that in the war years 1967-1973 were supporting Arab client states surrounding Israel.
Posted by plantagenet, Friday, 27 July 2018 10:45:19 AM
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Emeritus Professor Paul Dibb warned July 26, 2018 http://navalinstitute.com.au/new-security-reality-demands-new-australian-policy/

"Events could now become much more serious, much more quickly. More thought should be given to planning for the expansion of the ADF and its capacity to engage in sustained high-intensity conflict in our own defence — in a way that we haven’t had to consider for several generations."

PETE COMMENT

"high-intensity conflict" can encompass an all out conventional war and can also mean nuclear war.

See Australia's need to consider a nuclear capability http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/get-ready-china-why-australia-needs-nuclear-weapons-14416
Posted by plantagenet, Monday, 30 July 2018 5:02:01 PM
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