Dear Nick,

Of course Israel is far from perfect (and who is?), of course I lament its occupation, but the Arabs around it could have had everything they wanted had they not been so stupid.

This started with the Arab massacre of Jews in Hebron, in 1927. Totally stupid! The Jews at the time (including Ben Gurion, and earlier Herzl himself) wanted to include them as equals in the state they were creating, but they just continued to kill innocents until the Jewish leadership gave up on including them. They then senselessly attacked Israel in 1948 - and lost territories, then in 1967 again, then they called themselves "Palestinian" - an insulting word which is like showing a red cloth to a bull. Even then they could have received Gaza and the West Bank on many occasions, but they always refused. They could have been happy, they could have even peacefully ruled Israel as a democratic majority if they wanted, but they chose the path of destruction instead and that's what they are getting.

We see it all the time in Australian and American politics too: the one who is less stupid - shall win!

"Germany" is not the German name and "Palestinian" is from non-Arabs and ABC uses both names. Israel means Jewish state and they mean it. 'Majority Arab Israel' does not translate but the majority Israel army votes the squiggly lines across ballot maps . ABC tries to keep up but are stupid and make David confused with blue , yellow , white pieces and names that aren't there and if they are shouldn't be fake news and who's perfect at target shooting I ask you.

Dear Nick,

«Israel means Jewish state and they mean it.»

No they don't. It's true that Israel maintains SOME Jewish characteristics, but it also incorporates other values and ideas.
Of interest may be the recent resignation of the Israeli health minister on the grounds that Israel failed to observe the Sabbath, clearly having other priorities besides Judaism: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-11-27/israeli-health-minister-resigns-over-work-on-the-sabbath/9195666

«'Majority Arab Israel' does not translate»

Had the Jews preserved their moral and spiritual superiority and led by personal example (note that not all Jews are lawyers), then ten Arabs would be voting for one Jew rather than for a fellow Arab. This is what the bible has to say about this situation:

[Zechariah 8:23]

Thus saith the Lord of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

The state began as Jewish rather than democratic. Arabs were expelled and refused re-entry to maintain Israeli Jewish majority.That's distinct from Zionism as "Jew" included lingual or cultural ethnics.They could have co-existed as Jewish population among Arab majority in (?) west Jordan , south Syria etc but chose an enclave with power to occupy and expand.

Is Israel a true democracy? - Opinion - Jerusalem Post
www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-Ed-Contributors/Is-Israel-a-true-democracy-352445
May 15, 2014 - Israel would be described as a Jewish state only, since a democracy cannot coexist with the Jewish religion (or with communism for that matter) ...

David is worried about losing his grip on a map . Arabs worry about the real thing.

Dear Nick,

It makes an interesting discussion whether what we perceive to be the Jewish religion and democracy can be compatible. If you go into it, then you need to ask WHICH Jewish religion, because the religion of the prophet Zechariah was very different than the Jewish religion as we know it today (which itself isn't one). Note also that today the most religiously orthodox Jews, while not into democracy, they still want the Arabs in, they still want to be Palestinian and do not recognise the state of Israel.

But that would be digressing because the founders of the state of Israel were mostly atheist socialists, Jewish only in ethnicity and culture - and those founders, including their leaders, were more than happy to include the local Arabs in their state. They only were forced to change their minds following the Hebron massacre in 1927 and yes, by the time the state of Israel was created, 21 years later and following many further Arab pogroms, the Arab population was no longer wanted by the Jewish leadership.

«Arabs worry about the real thing.»

If they did, then they should worry about their corrupt and autocratic leadership which leads them only into misery and wars that they can never win. Otherwise they could have been prosperous and perhaps even a majority within Israel. Too late now to be a majority after all the mistrust that was created by this painful history, but they can still be prosperous and happy alongside a smaller Israel if they shake out their leadership.

As I understood it, the main subject of this thread was the existence or otherwise of laws in various Middle Eastern countries in relation to the right of a rapist to 'make it all right' by marrying his victim. The ABC published a map of countries where the law still applied, and countries where it had once applied but didn't any more.

One would have thought that, if there were any countries in the region where the law had NEVER applied, that this would beef some interest. But no.

After all, the only country fitting that description is: Israel. The one country which the ABC map overlooked. Funny, that.

Yet so many commentators on this thread dodge that issue and somehow obfuscate, twist and turn, to avoid agreeing that Israel is the most enlightened country in the Middle East, at least on this issue. As it happens, I disagree with Israel's settlement policy, but that also is quite peripheral to the issue of this thread: the right of a rapist to marry his victim, and the fact that the ABC, our precious ABC, overlooked that glaring fact.

Come on, you fellas, have the courage to say: "No, it's wrong to allow a rapist to marry his victim, and I'll grudgingly commend Israel for never having such a law, even if I disagree strongly with its actions in other areas."

Anybody with enough courage ? No ? Never mind, get stuck in, keep twisting and turning, and dodging the issue.

Joe