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The Forum > Article Comments > Killing the chicken to scare the monkeys > Comments

Killing the chicken to scare the monkeys : Comments

By Rodney Crisp, published 26/8/2016

It is this success and all the hard work that preceded it that we are now jeopardising by pursuing not only a selective immigration policy but also a deliberately repressive one.

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Banjo,

This is not a reasoned debate. I give my opinion and reasons for it, you simply disagree. The reasons why the coalition's solution is preferable in my consideration are:

1 - It's effective, the stats from 2000 to now clearly show which policies work, w.r.t. illegal boats and deaths at sea.
2 - It's legal, in that it has met the legal obligations of all treaties that Aus is signatory by meeting the letter if not the spirit of the agreements.
3 - It's morally superior in that far fewer people died as a result, and the refugees accepted were based on need and not financial means to buy a seat on a boat.
4 - It's far less expensive, in that the cost of managing illegal migrants under labor far exceeded any similar period under the coalition.

I am looking forward to a reasoned rebuttal of my points if you can.
Posted by Shadow Minister, Saturday, 3 September 2016 3:00:23 PM
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.

Dear Shadow Minister,

.

You wrote :

« I am looking forward to a reasoned rebuttal of my points … »

I’m sorry to hear that, Shadow Minister. I certainly did not wish to give the impression that I am in any way dogmatic or doctrinaire. I seek to understand, inform and explain, not rebut. I have no axe to grind and no chip on my shoulder. Though I do have a few guiding ideals, I am by no means an idealist. I am pragmatic by nature.

Don’t forget, I grew-up in the Queensland outback as a bush kid.

I have no god, no religion and no political allegiance. I try to keep an open mind on most things, and my beliefs to a strict minimum. (They tend to cloud my vision). I cherish what little freedom I have. My commitments are few but unyielding: essentially to my wife and family, close friends and what I consider to be universal values, such as: respect, honesty, reliability, autonomy, courage, wisdom, responsibility, loyalty, friendship, tolerance, compassion, generosity, ...

But, to tell the truth, the list of my shortcomings is even longer.

I’m sorry to disappoint you, but I have no desire to rebut your four points. I don’t see why I should. I basically agree with them - though I have a few doubts about the second one.

I refer you, once again, to the article of the associate lawyer Joshua Dale I already posted above, as well as one by a barrister, Julian Burnside and another by Ben Doherty, who twice won the prestigious Walkley Award for outstanding foreign reporting:

http://www.lawyersalliance.com.au/opinion/australias-opaque-offshore-asylum-policy-on-Nauru

http://arena.org.au/anaesthetising-the-national-conscience/

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2016/sep/01/wilson-security-to-withdraw-from-australias-offshore-detention-centres?utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=Politics+AUS&utm_term=188556&subid=10045778&CMP=ema_792

I don’t know about you, but I find all this quite disturbing.

Even if your four points were perfectly true and we all agreed they were perfectly true, that is not the point.

The list is a bit short.

Apparently, there is irrefutable evidence that we are deliberately detaining people for much longer periods than necessary and causing them to suffer physically, morally and psychologically.

I think we should look a bit more deeply into it.

.
Posted by Banjo Paterson, Sunday, 4 September 2016 1:40:07 AM
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Banjo,

My background as an engineer (30+yrs) has taught me that there is almost never a perfect solution to any problem, and that one must strive for a solution that provides the most benefit with the least adverse consequences, and that nitpicking a particular proposal without providing viable alternatives is indolent and akin to vandalism.

http://www.asyluminsight.com/statistics/#.V8ssQJh96Hs

There are 1300 people on Nauru and Manus in "detention" facilities that are essentially open for detainees to move freely, and detainees in Aus are predominantly visa breaches or those determined not to be refugees. Compare this to the statistics pre 2013 elections and by nearly every metric the situation has improved dramatically.
Posted by Shadow Minister, Sunday, 4 September 2016 7:25:05 AM
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.

Dear Shadow Minister,

.

You wrote :

« My background as an engineer (30+yrs) has taught me that there is almost never a perfect solution to any problem, and that one must strive for a solution that provides the most benefit with the least adverse consequences, and that nitpicking a particular proposal without providing viable alternatives is indolent and akin to vandalism »

I’m glad we agree.

Let’s leave it at that.

.
Posted by Banjo Paterson, Sunday, 4 September 2016 6:47:49 PM
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