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The Forum > Article Comments > The Clexit Founding Statement > Comments

The Clexit Founding Statement : Comments

By Viv Forbes, published 2/8/2016

If the Paris climate accord is ratified, or enforced locally by compliant governments, it will strangle the leading economies of the world with pointless carbon taxes and costly climate and energy policies.

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mhaze
Max caught you out in relation to a material you misrepresented.
Previously, I believe we had a discussion about your claim that temperature was higher 11,000 years ago. Much the same circumstance applied, you misrepresented a particular study; I gave a quotation from the study which had been published by AAAS, to access the study you need to register with AAAS. Did you ever do so? You accused me of making up the quote provided.
Another situation of about the same time was when you provided a graph/diagram showing a few studies including Lonnie Thompson a Glaciologist. I have seen Lonnie Thompson on a video clip being interviewed; he has a very firm consensus view on climate change.

Here is a quote from another advertisement placed after the Tillerson one in the New York Journal:

"Climate change has become too sore a subject. We’d like to move past it. Wouldn’t you? Maybe a good place to start is the basics. Carbon dioxide (CO2) keeps much of the sun’s heat from escaping back into space.

We’ve known this for more than a century. In the 1820s, French physicist Jean-Baptiste Fourier identified the Greenhouse Effect.[i] By 1896, Swedish physicist Svante Arrhenius showed how CO2 from industrial emissions would cause temperatures to rise.[ii]

This isn’t a left or right issue. It’s science."

The advertisements had been placed by major fossil fuel companies.

http://www.partnershipforresponsiblegrowth.org/pricecarbon/

Fossil fuel companies; particularly ExxonMobil have allegedly been playing a double game; saying the science is not wrong; and yet, funding denier groups such as Heartlands, the Cato Institute, ALEC et al. It is a crime in the US to provide wrong information to the financial market. ExxonMobil is being investigated by a number of State Attorney Generals at present.
Posted by ant, Friday, 5 August 2016 7:30:01 AM
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As Monbiot says:-

What is salient is not important. What is important is not salient. The media turns us away from the issues that will determine the course of our lives, and towards topics of brain-melting irrelevance.

This, on current trends, will be the hottest year ever measured. The previous record was set in 2015; the one before in 2014. Fifteen of the 16 warmest years have occurred in the 21st century. Each of the past 14 months has beaten the global monthly temperature record. But you can still hear people repeating the old claim, first proposed by fossil fuel lobbyists, that global warming stopped in 1998.

Arctic sea ice covered a smaller area last winter than in any winter since records began. In Siberia, an anthrax outbreak is raging through the human and reindeer populations because infected corpses locked in permafrost since the last epidemic in 1941 have thawed. India has been hammered by cycles of drought and flood, as withering heat parches the soil and torches glaciers in the Himalayas. Southern and eastern Africa have been pitched into humanitarian emergencies by drought. Wildfires storm across America; coral reefs around the world are bleaching and dying.
https://goo.gl/zuu9hN
Posted by Max Green, Friday, 5 August 2016 9:49:37 AM
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'You also seem confused about 'cold killing' and 'heat killing'. It's not that simple. Climate does NOT equal weather. Get a dictionary! Climate is about what happens when there is more ENERGY in the atmosphere, not just more heat. A two degree warmer plant DOES NOT equal a one degree warmer day where-ever you are'

Yeah I know Max every prediction by the alarmist has proven false and now the heat is 'hidden' in the ocean. Keep fighting the 'good' fight. Your support base is dwindling.
Posted by runner, Friday, 5 August 2016 10:50:28 AM
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Runner,
the heat is not 'hidden' in the ocean. Read some basic climate science: they all admit that well over 95% of the additional 4 Hiroshima bombs per second trapped by CO2 ends up in the oceans! Therein lies the danger. It shouldn't be called 'global warming' but 'ocean warming': and it's bad. Real bad.

http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2013/09/what-ocean-heating-reveals-about-global-warming/
Posted by Max Green, Friday, 5 August 2016 12:57:51 PM
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Max Green

"Fifteen of the 16 warmest years have occurred in the 21st century."

According to SOME of the databases. Others tell a different story. Those that are most 'homogenised' tell the approved story.

Strange how, when the temperatures hadn't risen for well over a decade we were told that that was much too short a time to draw any conclusions but now it seems that a year or two of El Nino induced warming is crucial. Science or propaganda?

" hear people repeating the old claim, first proposed by fossil fuel lobbyists, that global warming stopped in 1998."

I don't think many said it stopped. That's the very essence of the realist case - that climate change doesn't stop. And despite the meme from the alarmists that 1998 is the crucial year, in fact you can go back to 1995 to see where the pause started. But repeating the 1998 meme reduces the need to actually think.

Anthrax? The last time an outbreak occurred was 1941, a particularly cold year as that nice Herr Guderian could attest. I wonder what caused that outbreak? Strange how every unusual event gets blamed on GW by the usual suspects and then, when the evidence comes in they just move on to the next claim. What's causing the decline in frog numbers?

" torches glaciers in the Himalayas."

Yes, I hear they'll be gone by 2035....oh wait!

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/jan/20/ipcc-himalayan-glaciers-mistake

Are you aware that temperatures over the past 11700 years have been higher than now approx 25% of the time? How ever did we survive all that anthrax, melting glaciers and ancillary disasters in those times. Strangely, civilisation seemed to do best during these higher temperatures but that doesn't suit the scare so we'll pretend its not true.
Posted by mhaze, Saturday, 6 August 2016 8:24:00 AM
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Maze, the world’s top 4 temperature databases confirm that the planet is warming.

NASA
http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2016/03/01/february_2016_s_shocking_global_warming_temperature_record.html

I’m sorry, why are NASA in on ‘the conspiracy’?
http://climate.nasa.gov/

“Geneva, 21 July 2016 (WMO) _ Global temperatures for the first six months of this year shattered yet more records, and mean that 2016 is on track to be the world’s hottest year on record.”
http://public.wmo.int/en/media/press-release/global-climate-breaks-new-records-january-june-2016

I’m sorry, but why are the WMO in on ‘the conspiracy’?

The Met office are in on it as well. Why?
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/research/monitoring/climate/surface-temperature

So are NOAA. Why?
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/

They all confirm what we can see in the observable, repeatable, demonstrable physics: CO2 traps heat. Yes, the ocean soaks up most of this heat: then burps it out again in catastrophic El Nino’s that exacerbate the already dangerous heat gain in the atmosphere, while raising sea levels, increasing wildfires, releasing toxic anthrax, moving weather patterns, increasing both famines and floods as the global hydrological cycle shifts. Did you know that for every 1 degree warmer the air gets it can carry an extra 5% moisture? That’s huge. That changes agriculture profoundly.

“Are you aware that temperatures over the past 11700 years have been higher than now approx 25% of the time?”

Are you aware that Mhaze makes outrageous claims without linking to a shred of data 99% of the time?
Posted by Max Green, Saturday, 6 August 2016 10:12:16 AM
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