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The Forum > Article Comments > From victims to suspects: Muslim women since 9/11 > Comments

From victims to suspects: Muslim women since 9/11 : Comments

By Alice Aslan, published 19/5/2016

The First Lady's speech helped recreate 'an imaginative geography of West versus East, us versus Muslims-cultures in which first ladies give speeches versus others in which women shuffle around silently in burqas'.

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It basically boils down to a clash in cultures.
One that is a rich diverse modern and ever evolving culture.
The other is a religious based one who is trending to be less inclusive and less tolerant.

Would love to understand how many articles the author has written about multiculturalism tolerance in predominately Muslim countries? Perhaps she could link to a few......
Posted by Cobber the hound, Thursday, 19 May 2016 3:41:31 PM
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Hi Mac

During the medieval period the Muslim world experienced flourishing arts, science and culture that surpassed anything in Christendom at the time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Golden_Age

I agree with your points on “imperial feminism”, though. It seems to me that any of the questions that Hussain’s book complains are directed at Muslim women are legitimate. Muslim women and girls who are citizens of Western countries and run off to marry ISIS fighters do cause painful reflection. John Howard was right to say that some sections of the Islamic community hold attitudes towards women that are out of line with mainstream Australian society. And most western women would not agree that forcible removal of a headscarf is as demeaning as rape.

I see no evidence, either, that mainstream views fail to recognise the diversity among Muslim women. We know that the ISIS brides and terror sympathisers are a small minority, and that many Muslim women get the same freedoms and opportunities as Western ones. The problem is not that Westerners see all Muslim women as either victims or suspects. The problems is, some of them actually are.
Posted by Rhian, Thursday, 19 May 2016 6:41:26 PM
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Hi Rhian,

"During the medieval period the Muslim world experienced flourishing arts, science and culture that surpassed anything in Christendom at the time:"

Agreed, with qualifications. That's a generalisation that's not true for the entire period. By the later Middle Ages when Europe was about to experience the Renaissance, Islam's "Golden Age"was over. Muslims were very slow in adopting developments that reached them before the West, such as "Arabic" numerals, printing and paper. Europeans quickly assimilated these inventions and produced the world's most innovative and dynamic culture. Even supporters of the concept of Islam's Golden Age such as Prof Jim Al Khalili ( 'Pathfinders') acknowledge the religion's later stifling influence on science and technological development.

"John Howard was right to say that some sections of the Islamic community hold attitudes towards women that are out of line with mainstream Australian society."

Given the status of women in majority Muslim societies around the world, I'd claim that it's a very large percentage---unless by some miracle Australia has received the least misogynistic male members of the Ummah.
Posted by mac, Thursday, 19 May 2016 7:23:28 PM
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Indonesia is apparently the largest Muslim country in the world.

They oppress their women so much that they made one of them President not so long ago and I don't recall ever seeing her in a burqa or hijab.

Likewise, Turkey is a great place to go to see belly dancers.

Even in the 21st century, some people are unable to tell the difference between religion and culture. There are several secular states and a handful of sectarian ones and all of the latter have social restraints. Even the USA has religious zealots blowing up abortion clinics.

It would be easy for anyone to pick a Christian religion - particularly one of their (many) notorious cults - and generalise enough to make it representative of them all.

I suppose it comes down to whatever your personal motivation is, what prejudices you hide behind and your degree of intolerance.
Posted by rache, Thursday, 19 May 2016 7:30:48 PM
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rache,

(1) "Even in the 21st century, some people are unable to tell the difference between religion and culture."

Nonsense.

Religion is part of culture, it's produced by a culture. Do you think that religious ideology somehow floats above a society on little fairy wings and doesn't interact with or is not influenced by the society's culture. There are a hundred versions of Islam, so what?

(2) "They oppress their women so much that they made one of them President not so long ago and I don't recall ever seeing her in a burqa or hijab."

See the islamisation of Aceh.

More nonsense. Both India and Pakistan, very misogynistic countries had women as prime ministers, what does that indicate about the status of women?

"Turkey is a great place to go to see belly dancers."

(3) It's a great place to see Islamisation as well.

Do some research on Islam and its history.
Posted by mac, Thursday, 19 May 2016 9:06:19 PM
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Rache:

“I suppose it comes down to whatever your personal motivation is, what prejudices you hide behind and your degree of intolerance.”

It comes down to what Muslims say they believe in. This author believes that having a head scarf removed is a violation akin to rape. She says that many other Muslim women believe the same thing. It is not prejudice to disagree with that. It shows a very warped sense of values and has nothing to do with religion. A non-Muslim woman might well make the same statement about having her hat removed but it is just as absurd. What is under question is the sense of values and whether or not those values measure up to fundamental human rights which most western nations adhere to.

Muslims can have all the religion they like but religion should never over rule basic human rights and values. When a Muslim woman makes a claim such as this author has done then they should be challenged as to the humanity of such values. Everyone who so flippantly dismisses fundamental values should be challenged in the same way. It is not prejudice since everyone is treated the same. If Christians deny fundamental human values then they too should be subject to scrutiny.

The reality is that Muslims have themselves quite openly said that they do not value many things that should be basic to all human beings. They are entitled to their own set of values but if they live outside predominantly Muslim countries they are going to be challenged as to their humanity. That is the way we live and if they do not like being challenged then they are free to live in Muslim societies.
Posted by phanto, Thursday, 19 May 2016 10:46:24 PM
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