In the twenties and thirties, there were writers and journalists - even on the Left - who sang the praises of Mussolini's Italy and Nazi Germany, so one shouldn't be surprised by similar support for Russia and China from Bilger.

Russia invades the Crimea ? it's the West's fault. Russia invades Georgia ? The West provoked it. Russia invades the Ukraine ? They were provoked by elements in the Ukraine - and of course by the West. Nazis in the Ukraine ? Just Google "Zhirinovsky".

So if China breaches all manner of maritime law ? Clearly that's in response to what the West, i.e. the US, might do. China attacks Indonesian naval ships ? Clearly, somehow, they were encouraged by the US - we'll find evidence of it any day now - and anyway, it's better to anticipate attacks and get in first than just to blithely wait.

Yes, indeed.

God, what a lap-dog.

Joe

Propaganda John? Parenthetically that's your particular forte, and none better at it or serving the interest of, given your take, innocence personified Putin!

I waded through as much of this warmonger's verbal vomit as I could tolerate! Suggest next time you try talking from a little higher up!
Rhrosty.

I feel for writers like Pilger who try to explain a few basics of pol economy and IR and face the sort of uncomprehending responses seen in the comments section.

No.

The world is not divided into people intrinsically good (us) and irredeemably evil ("them").

It is about resources, oligarchies and Big Game geopolitics, not Caped Crusaders and Jet Jacksons saving the nice people from the wicked ones.

Methinks someone is off his meds.

"Russia invades the Crimea ? it's the West's fault. Russia invades Georgia ? The West provoked it. Russia invades the Ukraine ? They were provoked by elements in the Ukraine - and of course by the West. Nazis in the Ukraine ?"

Joe, four propositions in one short paragraph and four absolute historical fantasies. Only the last sentence is accurate but your question mark conveys doubt. Do you actually bother to understand what you write about, or do you just have a set number of standard responses regardless of the topic?

Dear James,

So, when Russia invaded Georgia and seized half its territory in 2008, are you suggesting that it wasn't the fault of the US ? That Russia provoked pretexts for that invasion ?

When Russia invaded the Crimea two years ago, are you suggesting that neither the Ukraine nor the US were in any way guilty of provoking Russia ? That Russia made the decision to invade with no provocation at all ?

But because there are pro-Nazis in the Ukraine just as there are in Russia itself, somehow the West or the US has provoked that ? As I wrote, Google 'Zhirinovsky'.

So what fantasy are you referring to ? What standard response ?

Sometimes it must be difficult to be a useful idiot, but persevere, James, they need you.

Joe

No Joe, I was referring to your relentlessly ignorant rewriting of history. OLO does not allow enough words to provide you with a history lesson, but can I suggest that you do some fact checking before you leap into print.

Russia did not invade Crimea. Crimea has been part of Russia for centuries, until Krushchev gave it away in 1954. After the US organised, financed and controlled coup d'etat in Ukraine in February 2014 Crimea held two referenda in which they voted overwhelmingly to rejoin the Russian Federation.

There are undoubtedly nazis everywhere but they did not come to prominence in Ukraine until after the coup. Now they are the dominant force. You really need to update yourself on what is happening with Donbass and the breaching of the Minsk accords. You will of course read nothing about that in the Oz media. Instead, Abbott goes off to join Poroshenko's "advisory" group.

Georgia is a more complex case, but again to describe it as a Russian "invasion" is simplistic and ignorant beyond reason.

If you want to discuss Russia in a sensible way, at least get a grasp of the basic facts.

Russia never invaded Crimea...
If people believe that crap then one would assume there really isn't any hope for them contributing anything useful on the subject at this point.
What a bloated sack of flatulence...

Armchair Critic

Of course, Russia invaded Crimea! Don't let the facts convince you otherwise. It'll invade everything if given the chance.

In terms of Western propaganda, it's essential to believe that everything Russia does is expansionist and a threat to ... something or other. If the message doesn't sink in, then the ghost of Chamberlain is always there to invoke.

Russia is nasty, horrible and evil. The Russian people are just slaves for us to liberate. Too bad if they end up like Iraq or Libya or Afghanistan or Syria or the giant torture chamber of Latin America in the 1970s or the destroyed and napalmed countries of SE Asia in the 1950s and 1960s. We in the West have only their interests at heart.

One day they'll thank us.

Hi James,

History lesson # 1: " Crimea has been part of Russia for centuries, until Krushchev gave it away in 1954."

No. The Tsarists invaded the Crimea and seized it from the Khanate in 1824. In 1954 Khrushchev handed it over to the Ukraine. So it belongs to the Ukraine. There was no legality whatsoever in Russia's occupation of it, in spite of the 99.9 % 'support' for Russian control organised under the Russians. End of.

History lesson # 2: Georgia is indeed a more complex case: Georgia has a long history of welcoming Ossetians into the country, and giving them land, going back to the days of the Mongol invasions of Ossetia to the north, and the Tsarist invasions three hundred years ago. Yes, indeed. Then Russia engineers a 'Polish-style' pretext and invades within hours of such a pretext in August 2008, to seize a third of the country. At least they weren't wearing Polish uniforms.

So where's next, James ? The Baltic states ? A bit more of Finland (do you want another history lesson about Finland ?) ?

Joe

Now that Malcolm is leading us, I feel much better. Tony was a phoney!

Hope you enjoyed Easter. It'll be your last!

Pilger is pilgerizing.

Is mise

Pilger is indeed pilgerizing.
Made me laugh that did.

If pilgeri stubbed his toe on a rock, he would probably think it was Americas
Fault.

I think the days of the Cold War are over.
Putin is an entirely different leader to some of the previous Russian leaders.

America and the West would do well to make him an Allie, instead of antagonising him.
We are going to need all the help we can get in this war with extremist Muslims.

Putin understands this, he has the problem right on the border of his country, plus
Within, in Chechnya.

I am sure if Amercia took a more conciliatory line of communication with him
It would double the strength in the fight against Isis and extremist groups.

After all when Russia invaded Afghanistan in the 1970s. Osama bin laden, said
"We wills defeat these Westeners." The reporter who was there when he said it,was surprised
that he would refer to the Russians as Westerners.

But Osama could clearly see that the Russians were European.
Something America could never see, after all the years of the Cold War.
They would do well to heed Osamas assessment.
Europe needs all the help it can get in today's hostile world.

Putin would be aware that Russia being European, is also threatened if Europe falls.
This will make him inclined to fight with Europe if it becomes a total threat to
European existence.

Hi Cherful,

Russia may not see itself as a strictly European power, more Eurasian: e.g.,
ttps://www.researchgate.net/profile/Marlene_Laruelle/publication/233247863_The_two_faces_of_contemporary_Eurasianism_an_imperial_version_of_Russian_nationalism/links/540224b60cf2c48563af8712.pdf

There is a huge amount written by historians like Spengler and Toynbee and Braudel and Huntington about the history and nature of Orthodox and/or Magian Russia and its fundamentally different history from Europe's - and that it may have much more historically and politically - even ethnically - in common with Turkey and Persia than with Europe.

Just because an outsider like Osama bin laden perceives Russia as part of the West doesn't necessarily mean that it is: from faulty memory, both in Greek and in Thai, all Europeans are 'Franks' or 'Ferengi', and maybe in Arabic too. We all tend to have an over-global view of the 'Other' - 'all South Americans', for example, or 'all Africans' or 'all Balkan countries', when the people there most certainly don't see themselves in that homogenised way.

Russia is striving to be a Eurasian power, straddling Europe and Asia, and not being either, but superior to both. Putin thus has the backing of the Orthodox Church, and of extreme-right-wing groups and demagogues like Zhirinovsky and the Cossacks.

Eurasianism is a real ideology, a belief that Russia has the destiny and the right to recover all of the old Tsarist Empire, and rule from the Carpathians to the Hindu Kush to the Altai and the Pacific, and from the border with Norway (including Finland) to south of the Caucasus (perhaps even Iraq) and to the Bering Strait. Imperialism never seems to wholly die.

And to that aspiration, Bilger gives his allegiance.

Joe

Loudmouth is aptly named. Empty vessels come to mind. Pilger is 100% correct.

The real rulers of this planet are the central bankers who create our debt from nothing.

In 2012 Putin took control of his own central bank and nationalised much of his energy controlled by our Western Oligarchs. Putin stopped the takeover of Syria and the invasion of Crimea. He still has a 70% approval rating in his own country.

Even Malcolm Fraser said on many occasions the West were trying to surround and enslave China. China you see has many Govt Banks and is not a total slave to the Bank of International Settlements owned by the Rothschilds. We were told to sell off our Govt Banks. This is the group who own the USA via the private US Federal Reserve. In 2000 these were the countries without a Rothschild Central Bank. Afghanistan, Iraq, Sudan, Libya ,Cuba, North Korea and Iran. Is there any co-incidence that the wars are nearly all in these countries? Now only Cuba, North Korea and Iran are free.

Gaddafi was working on a gold backed Dinar for Africa which would free Africa from US $ hegemony. Yes Hillary delighted in his torture and murder.

The immigrant invasion of Europe by war refugees was planned. Divide and conquer. The central bankers want 2 classes. Their elite and us the serfs whom they will control at their whim. See Georgia Guide Stones. They have set in stone that the world's population must be under 500,000 or reduced by 90%. http://www.rense.com/general16/georgiaguidestones.htm

Unless we all wake up soon, it will be WW3, destruction and total slavery if you are lucky enough to survive.

Hi Arjay,

That's the idea.

This, from another thread:

So China is now threatening Malaysia:

http://www.news.com.au/world/beijings-fishing-fleet-asserts-claim-to-contested-south-china-sea/news-story/4ed6b3c0a5a1112370931ac684d6cc18

"About 100 Chinese-registered boats have been detected encroaching in Malaysia’s waters in the disputed South China Sea, Malaysia’s state news agency has reported.

"The reported encroachment on Thursday is the latest action by Chinese vessels to raise concern in Southeast Asia, where four countries object to China’s claim to virtually the whole of the South China Sea.

"Malaysia’s national security minister Shahidan Kassim said assets from the Malaysian Maritime Enforcement Agency and the navy have been sent to the area near the Luconia Shoals to monitor the situation ..... "

The Luconia Shoals are 100-200km off the N-E coast of Sarawak, Eastern Malaysia. The Chinese claim them as part of their territory, 2000 km from China. I wonder how John Bilger would explain this away: how might this somehow be the fault of the US ?

It must be difficult to be a lickspittle these days. Keep trying, Arjay :)

Joe

Loudmouth,Fukushima has destroyed the fishing grounds around China and Japan and even all the way to the West Coast of the USA. USA General Electric built these reactors and gave no assistance to Japan to help contain radiation.You bet China is irate.They are not going to let their people starve unlike our Govts. We have closed down all our refineries and only have 3 weeks of fuel in reserve. What happens if our fuel does not come from Singapore in time? No fuel = no food.

So where is the logic in which we sell our real estate ,farms and major ports to China and threaten war in conjunction with the USA ?

The USA controlled by central bankers has 900 military bases around the planet. They spend 10 times more on weapons than Russia alone. Their economy is collapsing and need war to subdue their masses. The US economy is based on selling debt,weapons,destroying countries, stealing resources and paying their contractors to rebuild.

Could it be Loudmouth that the elites of all our countries see us as the enemy and want 90% of us gone ? With robotics, human labour and intelligence will be needed far less. The environmental movement have painted humans as a blight on the planet.

Time to wake up Loudmouth to all the possibilities. The Central Bankers can create all the money they need for think tanks to consider every possibility.

Nice fanciful stuff, Arjay, good to scare the kiddies with.

But I agree that ".... where is the logic in which we sell our real estate ,farms and major ports to China ...."

Do you realise how close to Nazi-style justification your argument is about China needing to raid other people's fisheries because of Fukushima ? Apart from the obvious fact that it is probably rubbish, of course. China has the right to fish in other people's waters any time it likes ? It needs 'lebensraum' ?

So what's your definition of 'imperialism' ? Yes, the US, yes, yes, maybe so, but does that justify Russia invading Georgia, the Crimea and the Ukraine, and China seizing territory in the south China Sea ?

Basically, how does one imperialism justify another ?

Joe

George Green is an ex -investment banker who worked on the inside. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sG3Gsi_ivqU Population reduction is very high on their agenda.

The theory is that if the have a nuke war in the Northern Hemisphere the most of the radiation will stay there due wind reversal.

These are families who have been in power for over 300 years that see it as a right to be supreme rulers. Grand Daddy Prescott Bush head of the Union Bank during WW2 was busted for laundering Nazi money. The Nazis leadership just changed countries.

Joe, your repetition of historical nonsense does not suddenly make it correct. Can you give any evidence at all of Russia invading Ukraine. No, of course not because there isn't any. Apart from some of the usual US military nut jobs making outrageous claims (eg Breedlove) no serious commentator is making such a claim.

As for China seizing territory in the South China Sea? Again, where is the evidence? There is a definition of "land" in international law, and the collection of sand banks, shoals and rocky outcrops do not qualify. Are you aware that the so-called 9 Dash Line was first promulgated in 1946? That was before there was a PRC. The then government of China is now the same mob who rule Taiwan. It may surprise you (because you will never read it in the Oz news media) that Taiwan makes exactly the same South China Sea claims that the PRC does.

Maybe even OLO will one day print something that actually discusses the real issues.

Loudmouth.

I wouldn't turn my back on Russia or Putin, or lay down my guard,
If they were to be an Allie in the fight against extreme Muslims.

Putins first and only loyalty is to mother Russia.

Europe will fight together when they fight the same enemy of
The fundamentalist Muslims, but it won't stop them fighting each other once
That is settled. Germany ended up in a war with Britain.

But at the moment I think It would be to Western advantage to enlist the support
Of Russia.
I don't know much of the historic genetics of the Russians, but I wonder
If their is a link between The Russians and the Serbs.
The Russians came to the aid of the Serbs in world war 1, after they assassinated
The Archduke of the Royal German Family. Who had control of the Serbian area.
The German ruling family sent the German army to deal with the Serbs, but the Serbs
enlisted the protection of Russia, and they got it. That kicked off world war 1.

I should wade through the history of the Russian bloodlines but it is something I only
do when I get really interested because it is so tedious.

James,

Where to start ?

1. Are Ukrainian troops occupying any part of Russia ? Or the other way around ? Russian troops in the Donbass ? Oh, they're not troops but freedom fighters ? Keep dreaming.

2. As you write, " ....There is a definition of "land" in international law, and the collection of sand banks, shoals and rocky outcrops do not qualify." Exactly. In international law, it is illegal to claim ownership over, occupy and build up shoals, reefs or any natural structures which are underwater at high tide. Anywhere in the world. Including the south China Sea. What China is doing is illegal. Ask yourself: couldn't every country in the world do this if it was legal, building on shoals near another country, building military bases within the EEZ of another country ?

3. Yes, The Kuomintang regime of Chiang Kai-Shek made that arbitrary claim back in the forties. My understanding is that the great majority of Taiwanese don't support it. So what if they did ? Would that make it legal ? I don't think so. But the CCP and the PRC does support it. What does that say about the common thread of Chinese imperialism ?

4. Any other excuses for a return to the days of Russian and Chinese imperialism ?

Joe

We do not have much time left. They need a war before the really big economic collapse happens. Many like James Rickards have noted that new money created as debt compounds like interest and after 40 yrs we reach a collapse point whereby, exponentially more debt money must created now to pay for the debt of yesterday. When they went off the gold standard in 1970 the money printing began in earnest.

Global debt is now 3 times the GDP of the planet. The gambling derivative market is 28 times the GDP of the planet. Derivatives are honoured before shares and bank deposits. With "bail in laws" passed banks can now convert your deposits into their shares.

Just 2 days ago ANZ shares went down 5% on revelation another $100 million in bad loans. The ANZ Bank has $11.2 billion in bad loans which is 2% of their total loans but 20% of their market capitalisation. ANZ has used their Credit Default Swaps to off set their loses. What happens when all banks suffer many loan defaults and those who bet against their default cannot pay? They bail into your deposits. In Dec 2015 20,000 in Italy people lost their deposits due to bank collapses. Not mentioned on our media.

The point is they need something to blame this collapse on and war is their best escape. As John Pilger notes;small nuclear weapons now make their war very plausible.

Hi Arjay,

You could be right - what's the state of the Chinese economy - the real state of it ? Has the Chinese regime massively over-invested n infrastructure and in bailing out state-owned enterprises, and massively over-stated the growth rates of the economy ? Has it too been printing money to pay for its 'development' ?

Given the additional problems of demography and changing age-structure, how long does the Chinese regime have to advance its military control of the south China Sea ?

The problem with a Mafia-type, patron-client-type, system is that it has to appear brutally strong to maintain control - and if it initiates aggressive ventures such as China is now in the south China Sea, then it has to follow through. Like a Mafia boss, it can't afford to ever back down, or show any weakness. So it has to stand over, and if necessary (we'll see)invade and try to crush, any opposition to its advances.

And clearly, its advances will be into Vietnam, its nearest 'neighbour', militarily weak in comparison with China. So let's anticipate some blustering from China about Vietnam in the near future, perhaps even some put-up job of Vietnam's 'incursion' into Chinese 'territory', that sort of pretext. It worked for the Nazis in 1939 and for the Japanese in 1937, so it shouldn't be difficult to cook up something.

Joe

Joe, I will answer your four points in the same order that you wrote them.

1. Repeating nonsense does not make it correct. I asked for "evidence" and your posts demonstrably lack anything approaching that.

2. No, it is more subtle and complicated than that, as the recent US State Department Report on the topic noted.

3. I do not know what the Taiwanese people think, but it is a fact that the Taiwanese government repeated their claims recently as January 2016.

4. For goodness sake Joe, get a grip. You will be yelling Reds Under the Bed and Yellow Peril next.

More generally, does the term US imperialism resonate with you at all? Their post WW2 record in this area is unmatched, as is the scale of their killing, the number of deaths caused, the governments overthrown, etc etc. Plenty of references available if I thought you had a serious interest in the truth.

You might have some thoughts on the number of US bases that ring China and Russia; the US militarisation of the South China Sea (dragging Australia along) and the dire prospect of a Clinton victory in November. Hope you have your bomb shelter built and stocked.

Loudmouth "Has the Chinese regime massively over-invested n infrastructure and in bailing out state-owned enterprises, and massively over-stated the growth rates of the economy ? Has it too been printing money to pay for its 'development ?"

Yes China has been in the game money printing and building empty cities but they are still the factory of the planet. They have real productivity to back up their money printing and they don't borrow a lot from OS private central bankers to finance their growth. China and Russia were expected to roll over and let our Central Bankers have total control of their economies. China has won the peace. They do not need war. They are buying assets all over the planet.

We joined their Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank probably a hedge against the collapsing Western system. They also have the BRICS Nations for trading and investment which make up 40% of the World's pop and 25% of its income. This is another reason our oligarchs want war.

Notice how all these new oppressive laws are coming in under the lie of preventing terrorism? When the collapse happens they need to silence dissidents. With now war to blame this on the people could eventually take control and they lose 300 yrs of power and planning to control the planet.

George Carlin sums it very well. "The politicians are put there to give you the illusion of choice. You have no choice. You have owners. They own you ." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbnzhTmiyec

Hi Arjay,

Perhaps China isn't as flash as you think :) And it's got only ten years or so before the demographics crash in on it. So it's got to act pretty soon - of course, as elsewhere, a huge lift in its military budget would also boost the economy. Gosh, I do believe that's happening right now.

Trouble is: how will those millions of little darlings, the one precious child in each family, beavering their way through university, react to the likelihood of compulsory military service ? When their eyes are on migrating to the US, evil incarnate and the heart of darkness, or to Europe ? Or to Australia and NZ ?

So: how to engineer a war in anticipatory retaliation for the coming surprise unprovoked aggression from Vietnam or Malaysia or Indonesia or the Philippines ? Where are the Chinese going to get their hands on WW II Polish Army uniforms ?

Interesting times, Arjay.

Joe

Arjay,

Why do you still keep droning on about private central banks? I know you can find websites making that claim, just as you can find websites claiming the moon's made of cheese. But in reality the US Federal Reserve is the only central bank in the entire world with any private equity in it at all. Even the BIS (which is not a central bank and does not control central banks) is now entirely owned by its members.

The Rothschilds may still be major players in the bond markets, but the days when they controlled the world's financial system are long gone.

Although the amount of gross debt has increased exponentially, the global amount of net debt sums to zero, so the claim that exponentially more money is needed to pay for the debt of yesterday is illogical. More money may well be needed to keep the economy growing, but that's not a problem, because productivity growth and/or inflation and/or cutting interest rates increases our ability to service debt.

Australian law does not permit bank deposits to be converted to shares.

And I think the reason that our media didn't mention Italian depositors losing their money in December 2015 is that it never occurred. Bondholders lost their money but deposits are far more secure.

Fukushima is on the East Coast of Japan and has had no effect on the fishing grounds around China, nor the fishing grounds on the other side of the Pacific Ocean.

Government spending can always counteract an economic downturn, but war is the least efficient way for a government to spend money.

Aidan,The Rothschilds are still the most powerful family on the planet.The Money Masters. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4wU9ZnAKAw

Last yr the fishing on the West coast USA has been shut down. Japan's PM Abe has passed laws that journos who report unauthorised reports on Fukushima or its affects get 10 yrs jail. Do you think the media in any country will tell the truth? 3 reactors went into melt down and continue to pour radiation into the ocean.

DR Paul Craig Roberts is the ex assistant secretary to the US Treasury.He also warns of a nuke war. http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2016/03/24/the-real-likelihood-of-a-nuclear-war-paul-craig-roberts/

Those involved with the false flag attacks of 911 to bring about the invasions of Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, and now Syria have a lot to lose if they face trial for their crimes. This is what makes them so dangerous.

General Wesley Clarke ex head of NATO has blown the whistle on their planned invasions of 7 countries in 5 yrs, just 10 days after 911. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RC1Mepk_Sw

Arjay, the Rothschild family includes a lot of inherited wealth, though nowadays that's spread out quite thin as it's a very big family. Cumulatively they're theoretically very powerful, but that's irrelevant because they're not collaborating as a family. Some are still in finance, but none control any central bank.

I noticed you linked to a documentary a few hours long. Is there anything in particular in it that you wanted to highlight?

The USA West Coast fishing shutdown, was because of overfishing, and totally unrelated to Fukushima.

The Japanese laws you refer to aimed at protecting state secrets. They are bad laws that could potentially be applied to those reporting about Fukushima, but the claim that "journos who report unauthorised reports on Fukushima or its affects get 10 yrs jail" is false.

BTW the phrase "continue to pour radiation into the ocean" suggests you don't understand the problem. It's the atoms that emit radiation that are hazardous; the radiation itself is extremely short lived.

Neocons are very dangerous, and undoubtedly did want to invade many countries, but there were no false flag attacks on 911.

Will we wipe ourselves out with a nuclear war or will the planet wipe us out first?

Aye Pilger matey ;)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CZmW1DhWAAEhZwm.jpg