Hi Ojnavb,

" ..... the beheadings but let us not forget the beheadings, shooting and torture by the Colonial British in the name of Queen Victoria that the Aborigines had to endure ........"

Do you have the slightest evidence of that ? There is no record of any beheadings here in South Australia, and the killings were about even on both sides. The only massacre for which there is ample evidence was the murder of 28 people on the Coorong in 1840, by the clan from Salt Creek. Two men were hanged on the beach for that, and as a result, Governor Gawler was recalled: there were calls for him to be tried for murder.

Back to topic, please: currently, 130,000 Syrian Kurds are fleeing over the Turkish border from ISIS. People left behind are being killed and yes, beheaded.

In the paper today, an ISIS spokesman was quoted as exhorting followers to enslave non-believing women. Is that a mis-quote ?

Let's be honest: the Koran is the usual contradictory mess of a religious book: in the early part, yes, it says that to kill an innocent person, is as if one has killed all of humanity and thus one can never get into heaven. In the later parts, it exhorts murder, enslavement and rape. Something for everybody.

Surely it's time for 'moderate' Muslims to declare that they won't follow the second part, relating to the times when Muhammad had an army, and no longer had to be meek and mild and love everybody: if you like, he no longer had to be like Jesus on the Mount, but could go back two thousand years when the Hebrews were (according to their book) butchering every man, woman, child and animal from every town, hanging their king in a tree.

So which Islam is it to be ? One we can live with, or one which we will have to fight for a hundred years ? Which part of the ghastly Koran is bullsh!t and which part if 'genuine', worth following ?

[TBC]

[continued]

How is anybody supposed to believe any Muslim who claims to follow the Koran and does not differentiate its vile parts from its mild (uncannily early Christian) parts ? I want to be able to trust every person I meet, every Muslim, and of course I do, and this must be a burden for Muslims, but one that only Muslims can deal with.

Especially when there exists a principle of tukkiah, permission to lie and cheat in 'a good cause' ?

Joe

Loudmouth please refer to "The Myall Creek Station Massacre" Northern NSW in 1838, 28 Aboriginal men women and children were hacked, slashed and beheaded and their headless bodies were left where they fell,this would not have been one isolated beheadings of the Aboriginal people, I am sure many Aborigines in S.A. Would have also suffered the same fate at the hands of the superior Colonial British.

Is Mise

"Wasn't there some law/legal instruction, enacted by the British, that was the basis of the successful Mabo case?"

No. The basis of Mabo's case was that the British, in claiming and establishing sovereignty over Australia, had not intended or acted to extinguish native title in general.

Loudmouth
"So which Islam is it to be ? One we can live with, or one which we will have to fight for a hundred years?"

A hundred? What makes you think a hundred will do it? It's been fourteen hundred so far.

All
The fact that at any given time perhaps the vast majority of Muslims do not follow the precepts of their own religion is good, and to be commended. But it's nonsense to say it's a peaceful religion.

It would be great if the so-called moderate Muslims would turn their mind to actually renouncing the parts that are so obnoxious; but I can't see that happening somehow.

'Arab Logic' makes no sense to Westerns, its hardly make sense to them. There is no logical way to talk the Muslims around. So many of the jihadists are essentially uneducated, highly reactionary and religiously brainwashed - there is no dealing with them.

It was encouraging to see that at least Saudi Arabic, the Emirates, Qatar, and Bahrain are actively participating in the fight against ISIS. Let's hope its quick.

CH,
The other factor is that the median IQ in most middle eastern countries is below 90,Islam is actually a good fit for low IQ people, under normal circumstances it keeps them in order by limiting their options for error.