So a sixteen year old girl was raped by a complete stranger. Rather than the parents (christians?) subjecting themselves to the shame of admission of their daughters rape and seeking an abortion, they made her endure their 'shame'. Subjecting her to basically imprisonment and 'physical' and no doubt mental abuse. Shame on them!
The young girl, though by now clearly traumatized, wanted to keep her baby despite the abuse she had to endure from her family, she had become a mother.
'End its life to save the pain, shame suffering and abuse'
'Was I worth the pain?'
You ask these questions Sonia and they are quite challenging. You are a living breathing human being and deserve all that life has to offer, as did your mother. Your mother clearly went through alot of pain and suffering, particularly, sadly, from those closest to her.
She is your mother and you are her baby girl, I hope you are there for her when you can be.

Dear david f,

>>Our species is unprecedented in certain areas. However, other species …<<

This is why I listed the criteria for what I meant by “unprecedented”. Of course, there are other criteria for showing that some species is/was unprecedented in a different area. [If the “area” is size, then the species to which the recently discovered dinosaur belonged, c.f. http://edition.cnn.com/2014/05/17/world/americas/giant-dinosaur-discovery/, is the winner.]

>>The simple fact is that the earth and life on it existed before Homo sapiens and will continue to exist if humanity should disappear.<<

I agree; this does not contradict what I wrote about humanity being so far the species most capable of understanding its environment and changing it (for better or worse).

>>However, the propensity for religion is a source of conflict in the modern world where various cultures rub against each other.<<

There are many sources of conflict which by their very nature depend on human propensity for it. Sources of modern conflict are certainly also religious, more precisely cultural - c.f. Huntington’s “clash of civilisations” - but not exclusively, and probably only in the forefront, where the actual causes are globalisation of wealth inequality, scarcity of natural resources combined with need vs greed, all sorts of nationalisms, etc.

I agree, my division into “progressivist” and “traditional” Catholics was vey crude (e.g. not all “traditionals” like to be confused with “conservative” Catholics, although Voris certainly is both, etc). The distinction was not about how they lived but what they proclaim to believe, or strive for, regarding matters of doctrine and morals.

[Thanks again. I am now going to devote my “internet presence” to a more pressing (at least here, in Europe) question: how to understand the Ukraine crisis, more precisely whose intention, or stupid “unintention”, was it to get us where we are, and for 25 years hoped we’ll never be. Of course, that does not belong to this thread.]

oh george..that ukranian/thing..began..many years ago/peaked arround ww2..yet..it links too into fatima/who cautioned\regarding it..but that will/play..out..in a longer/time-setting.

the immediate..issue..is the pope/visiting\that plave..of the last supper/if i was satan..[and often/i\myself wonder]..then/i wouldnt want..that/done\..fullfilled..in that..place/but..which..the red-herring..EVERY-LIFE/matters*[one life-giver/sustaining..all..life*..

unless Israel returns the Sergei Court. Within 24 hours,..the Ministry was evacuated..(See Selling King David's Tomb).

http://www.roitov.com/articles/apifior.htm

A campaign is conducted..by Israeli right..claiming that a similar event..is planned with the Cenacle..and King David's Tomb..*below it.

"Final Agreement..Needs to be Signed"

The visit..of the Pope..at the place is significant..because it includes..a mass..[last-supper/mass]..despite not being..one of the allowed prayer days...Moreover,..Israeli officials..have acknowledged that an agreement..is ready.

[clearly/some..could\seek..to prevent/this][and set-up/arabs/russians/chinese]..to take../the\fall...for/red/flag[black-flag-event]..[using/..say..a mal-asian/plain.]

Speaking for the Latin Patriarchate,..David Noihouse acknowledged that Christians..want an agreement regularizing prayer rights..in the Cenacle.*"This is a central place..[last-upper/place]..for Christians worldwide,..and right now..it is possible to pray there only with special permits.

In certain sense,..the Church was born there,*..it is the most natural thing..for Christians to want to visit and pray there..as mother mary spake..in fatima.

Hanna Bandekobsky..(English spelling may vary)..is the Director of the Program..for Jewish-Christian Relations of the Jerusalem Center. On May 20,..ahead of the visit,..she gave an interview to Yediot Ahronot.

She said,.."Now there is a final agreement..that needs to be signed; it includes many details...As part of it.. the Catholics tried to introduced prayer rights in the room,..but the details have not yet been published."

Right\wing/activists were stopped..from visiting the Cenacle..by the police...The latter told the intruders.."It is a church up there"..[while secretly filmed.]

The video..was uploaded to the internet..and is now a source of Jewish religious hysteria;..*"King David's Tomb..*will be given to the Vatican,"..they say in a variety of ways,..despite the event being unlikely...as/because,,*

they..only..'share'..a..common
entrance/doorway\street/city..colony...planetoid...share...SHARE..

unfair..?
end/exclusive\franchise..
that dissinfranchises..indigenant/peoples'..from..their..owned-homes..into squats/camps\gulags/....when All WE GOT..IS THE ONE/OMNIPRESNT..living god*..

[pure/truth/pure-good..pre/grace/pure-mercy]..
ohhhh...mmmmm..men-enneme..me/man/many\men..mene many men/ahhh-men*

jode/rote/quote..:<<..So a sixteen year old girl was raped by a complete stranger.>>

thats/strange..most/know\their rapist..[i suspect/it wasnt..a..stranger.]..the face simularity..alone..means familiour recognition..of a known known,\.

<<Rather than the parents,..(christians?)>>

so/it..seems
<<..subjecting themselves..to the shame of admission>>

often/sadly..some/play..the person/in this case clearly..to extreem[the poor mother]..abandoned by her parents/likely 'the'/priest/the congregation/even god[or rather so the poor mother/must have felt/and clearly..continues..to/avoid feeling.

<<..they made her..endure their 'shame'.>>

where/no shame..is due/indeed..for saving what clearly/is a worthy/woman..speaking out for the 52/million aborted children[since vietnam-war]..[just usa/numbers]

<<..Subjecting her..to basically imprisonment>>
in those days/that was\the best..they could think-of[least we forget/education..wasnt a big thing/way bACK..IN THE DIM DARK/AGES.

<<..and 'physical'..and no doubt..mental abuse.>>
SO IT WOULD..APPEAR

if/so...<<..Shame on them!>>
shame..on whoever/advised..them wrongly[
their immediate/peers/confudants/mates..relitives]

<<..The young girl,[mother]..i have/little concern/for\the scribe...<<..though by now clearly traumatized,..wanted to keep*..*her/baby..[despite the abuse..she had to endure from her family,..she had become..a mother.>>of a child/with a timely-story..to reveal.

<<..ask these questions..Sonia..and they are quite challenging.>>
but/your..here..to/speak..for millions/unable..to speak[because they had/not..the strength..of mother-mission..your mum/has.

<<..You are a living..breathing human being..>>
with..a..clear..reason/of\being..laid-out..before.you[but/dont..forget..who the credit...really..is/due.to.[mum]

<<and deserve..all that life has to offer,>>
you/..great/but..what-about..her

<<as did your mother.>>..[?]

<<..Your mother clearly went..through*..alot of pain and suffering, particularly,..sadly,..from those closest to her...>>

so..it/seems\

<<..She is your mother..and you are her baby girl,..I hope you are there..for her..when you can be.>>

me/too..but it seems..
mum/has gotten..the real damage-burden..in../all\..of..this.
now/you..share/her\burden..now..your lives..values/have changed..
now..your the more../..\..needing..to..do..the../mothering\giving/after..recieving..so-much.

Just close the thread off....We cant keep breeding...so the ape will have to make some changes to the ID.

Its still the women's call.....only you can save mankind...8.9 billion and counting.

P/S....Just keep breeding:)

Kat