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The Senate tries its hand at climate science : Comments
By Don Aitkin, published 31/3/2014The Senate committee report Paying polluters to halt global warming? signifies only sound and fury, like most parliamentary theatre.
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Posted by Leo Lane, Wednesday, 2 April 2014 4:04:18 PM
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Leo, anybody who cares to check my reference knows that Tuvalu has been flooded.
I believe that CSIRO et al provides a better reference than the grubby The Telegraph you provided: http://www.cmar.csiro.au/sealevel/ A quote from CSIRO et al reference..." Many observations show that the ocean has been changing over the last several decades. One aspect of this is a warming ocean resulting in increase of ocean volume through thermal expansion. There has also been addition of water from glacier and ice sheets ...." Thermal expansion would mean warming wouldn't it Leo, measured. Here is a further quote from your reference Leo..."Low-lying coral islands such as Tuvalu and the Maldives are among the countries most vulnerable to rising sea levels. Most of the world's leading scientists agree that the earth is warming up, caused by carbon dioxide emissions from petrol and the burning of coal." Posted by ant, Wednesday, 2 April 2014 5:03:54 PM
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Luciferace,
It is said that Europeans scoff at data because it can be used to claim almost anything. For example data is being used to claim AGW is caused by CO2. I have been aware for over 50 years about warmth in algae. My ‘hypothesis’ at the very least accounts for fact that solar warmth is absorbed in algae. And to my knowledge warmth in ocean algae has not been measured and assessed in AGW science. Do I need data to establish an unprecedented human population is dumping unprecedented sewage nutrient loadings in ocean ecosystem waters? Do I need data to establish nutrients proliferate algae plant matter? Do I need data to establish unprecedented sewage and land use nutrient pollution has not been measured and assessed in AGW science? Does anybody have any data indicating warmth in natural and sewage-fed ocean algae has been measured and assessed in AGW science? Look, try a basic experiment. At sundown, take 2 equal containers, place 2 desert spoons of dried pea soup vegetable matter in one, fill both equally with boiling water, allow to cool in equal positions but not touching, see which retains warmth longest. Ocean currents can move increased algae mass from one place to another, somewhat like a small heater moves warmth around a big room or building. (continued) Posted by JF Aus, Wednesday, 2 April 2014 7:36:02 PM
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Cont’d………..
I think I have convinced some politicians AGW science is not complete but at present the response is like one religious faith entering and talking in the worship place of a different faith. Then there is phenomena of a student knowing something unknown to the teacher who suddenly becomes hostile toward the student. MT was polite but did not get back to me as indicated. I spoke to Malcolm Turnbull some time ago and I think they want a trading scheme. So I think it likely Greg Hunt will not drop emissions. Recently I sent a number of questions to my local MP Bronwyn Bishop, including the question of warmth in algae already assessed or not. I do not wish to be misunderstood. My focus is on solutions to seafood protein supply collapse and malnutrition and hardship and associated increased NCD amongst Pacific Islands people. To me, AGW is an aside issue. I think warming is occurring in some areas of oceans but whether that warmth is warming the globe as AGW implies, I do not know. I do not think warming is due to CO2 alone, or than an ETS is the best way to go. From my point of view exploring underwater, inside ocean ecosystems and from general research including into surface photographic data, it appears that warmth in algae in some waters is changing atmosphere in that area, and that change is changing the weather downwind. As for peer reviewed data, I invite science to measure and assess warmth in ocean algae and collect data that is available to science. Or science can prove there is no warmth ever absorbed in ocean algae. Meanwhile CO2 non- sense continues to waste vital time and also significant opportunities. Posted by JF Aus, Wednesday, 2 April 2014 7:40:28 PM
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OK, JF, so we've got water carrying algae around the world in the major convection currents. We've got the sun beating down upon this alginated (is that a word) water that absorbs more heat per kilogram per degree rise than normal water and, by your reckoning, emitting more heat than normal water in the reverse process (at night). Wouldn't this moderate ocean temperature changes while making little actual difference to the heat quantity in it?
I'm just thinking aloud, but it's your baby JF, and you are the one who has to see it through. Have you written to those who may receive you warmly (no pun), like Watts or Nova? Perhaps cohenite can help get things going here with his skeptical contacts. Maybe contact the Heartland Institute to put up the money and expertise, or go direct to the Koch brothers. "Meanwhile CO2 non- sense continues to waste vital time and also significant opportunities." Great to see you're keeping an open mind, JF Posted by Luciferase, Wednesday, 2 April 2014 9:01:28 PM
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JF Aus, I do believe you have the cart before the horse. In small waterways during summer algae becomes very noticeable growing over rocks. It is noticeable that as the days become warmer after winter, that algae begins to form. I believe that when waterways get too warm de-oxigenation happens and then algal blooms occur. Too much nutrient is another reason for algae to become more noticeable.
Meanwhile, the weather in Greenland is incredibly unstable with ranges in temperature of 40 degrees Celsius; one week being what you would expect -20 degrees Celsius and a few days later +20 degrees Celsius. In a previous post I have written about concerns being raised as Greenland once considered to be quite stable in holding it's ice sheet has shed what had virtually been a "dam" allowing "ice streams" to flow into open water. Currently, there are high levels of methane that are being measured off Greenland, methane is a stronger greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide. Usual temperature range of Greenland: http://www.greenland.com/en/about-greenland/natur-klima/vejret-i-groenland.aspx "Sealers and whalers at Qaanaaq say that the sea ice is 1 metre (3 feet) thinner today than it was earlier. East Greenlanders see less ice from the Arctic Ocean than earlier, and both scientists as well as tourist guides report that in certain areas of the country glacier heads are pulling back year after year. This applies not least to the UNESCO-protected ice fjord near Ilulissat, which has pulled back almost 10 km (6 miles) between 2001 and 2004." Source: http://www.greenland.com/en/about-greenland/natur-klima/klimaaendringer.aspx Temperatures being experienced: "As described in the post High methane readings over Greenland, huge temperature swings can hit areas over Greenland over the course of a few days. Temperature anomalies may go down as low as as -20°C one day, then climb as high as 20°C a few days laters, to hit temperature anomalies as low as -20°C again some days later." Source: http://arctic-news.blogspot.com.au/ Posted by ant, Thursday, 3 April 2014 5:26:14 AM
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Any progress in producing a genuine scientific basis for the assertion of AGW?
About time that you conceded that there is no such science and the assertion of AGW is fraudulent.