Dear csteele,

I agree with you about the oppressive nature of the current Israeli government and its disregard of both world opinion and common decency. The factors I cited such as the memory of the Holocaust, the fear of being wiped out etc. are the psychological levers that government exploits to stay in power.

http://www.nif.org/component/content/article/15-general/1473-20-december-2012 is the site of one of the many groups in Israel that oppose the present government. One great problem is the support given to that government by American Christian Zionists who have poured much money into Israel to support the present government. In general they also support the Republican Party. American Jews by a great majority voted for Obama in the last election.

We are getting many anti-Israel pieces. Most people, me included, read what reinforces our opinions or what we find pleasant. I find Mr. Singer a one trick pony and do not read most of his items as I find them both predictable and boring. I imagine Mr. Singer’s readership is mostly limited to those who swallow his line and those who want to put their hooks into him. Article count is one thing. Actual readership is another.

I favour nations which do not discriminate among their citizens on the basis of ethnicity and religion and have separation of state and religion. Therefore I oppose Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist and Hindu states.

In Australia I oppose chaplains in the public schools, subsidies to non-public schools and all other actions which break down the separation of state and religion.

Dear davidf,

Thank you for the link to the NIF, an organisation certainly worthy of support. They do not have Paypal initiated but I will send them an email to see what can be arranged.

From their site; “Israel's 1.37 million Arab citizens vote, pay taxes and speak Hebrew, yet suffer pervasive discrimination, unequal allocation of resources and violation of their legal rights. Housing, education, and income all substantially lag that of the Jewish majority.  Only 3 percent of the land in Israel proper is owned by Arabs; permits are rarely granted to Arab families to expand their housing; and most Jewish towns and neighborhoods remain off-limits.”

Quite extraordinary, but are they anti-Israel?

You wrote;

“We are getting many anti-Israel pieces.”

I took the liberty of going back over the last thirty days of articles by noting those that had been commented on in that period, obviously not definitive by any means. The count as you see is 7 pro vs 5 that could be loosely called anti.

While you may dismiss Mr Singer's pieces I'm afraid it would take some creative accounting for the rest of us to do so. I'm certainly not denying your taste in commentators, I regard your rebuttal of Mr Singer some time ago now as the most effective and powerful ever given,

Palestine: democracies in diplomatic disarray Pro

Wrist-slapping unlikely to halt Israeli military sales to Australia Anti

Reason and passion on Israel Anti

Palestine - hands up those who hate Jews Pro

Australia's diplomatic pragmatism Anti

Palestine vote finally turns the tide Anti

Israel's Iron Dome: a global game changer? Pro

Palestine: Sharon's Gaza gambit Pro

Targeted killings: Operation ‘Pillar of Defence’ Pro

Australia's blinkered view of violence in Gaza Anti

Palestine: Gaza conflict sure to resume Pro

Israel on the horns of a dilemma Pro

What is disturbing to me is that there are not more articles challenging the actions of the Israeli government but perhaps the drive to be 'balanced' afflicts OLO on this issue as much as it does on AGW whether warranted or not.

Dear csteele,

I don't think online opinion tries to be balanced on any subject. Since they don't pay authors they are happy to get any item that sounds literate. Singer grinds out material and gets printed. I write an occasional piece, and most of my effusions get accepted.

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/author.asp?id=4977 will direct you to all my articles that olo has published. Israel is not a major interest of mine so only two articles of mine concern Israel. Apparently Singer only writes articles on Israel.

Propagandists such as Singer concentrate their energies on their hobby horse. Most of us are not so focused, and I regard that as a more reasonable attitude.

Yeats wrote a poem called "The Second Coming". In it were these lines.

The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

I don't think the best lack all conviction. They merely are not one trick ponies like Mr. Singer. However, I think he is full of passionate intensity and probably doesn't have time for poetry.

Since I have referred to horses twice in the above you can take that with equinimity.

Dear davidf,

It's behooven for me to reply.

At my family's Christmas eve celebration I spent some time in conversation with a former East German border guard and an Israeli cancer doctor doing research in Australia. The former has written a book on a German paratrooper regiment but had very little idealism left, particularly for communism, while the latter has served in the IDF and was full of nationalism and exceptionalism not only for Israel but also for the US where he had been studying.

When the question of the Palestinians arose he could have been reading from Mr Singer's play-book. It was like having a check list in front of me and he ticked all the boxes, even announcing that without a proper understanding of the history of the region it was always going to be almost impossible for me to get my head around the true state of affairs.

As the conversation developed the value of engaging with Mr Singer's pieces came to the fore and allowed me to answer most of the propaganda politely but firmly, stating the facts as I saw them.

In the end he conceded and admitted quietly with a rather rueful smile that yes for the Israelis, setting all the rest aside, it was mostly about grabbing as much land as possible.

Even those who give the air of being full of 'passionate intensity' are often just as the rest of us, lacking conviction.

Thank you for the Yeats poem. Before writing this reply I had been watching a half hour doco titled 'Crime & Punishment in the Gaza Strip'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWJFC98jPrQ

Part of it detailed the drug taking of Palestinian youths, particularly of the prescription drug Tramdol.

“Because of the disgust, sadness and despair we started to use it.” When asked if they were scared of another war and they reply “We don't care any more. We've become desensitised. I hope there is another war where all of us die. Dying is better than living like this.”

“The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;”

Dear csteele,

You wrote: " I regard your rebuttal of Mr Singer some time ago now as the most effective and powerful ever given,"

As far as Singer is concerned did it make any difference?

I am 87 and afraid of getting Alzheimers'. I think it more worthwhile for me to read and write poetry, study mycology, travel and learn more about mathematics. It exercises my mind.

Yeats' poem is full of great lines. There is a beauty in simplicity. I don't know how much time Shelley spent on the last line of Ozymandias, but it has such air of desolation in the one and two syllable words. "The lone and level sands stretch far away." Even President Grant got in an occasional good phrase. “pure morals unfettered by religious sentiments” That was in his speech to the veterans of the Army of the Tennessee on September 30, 1875 told about on page 509 of "Grant" by Jean Edward Smith.

I despair of reaching the Israeli government or its apologists. From Candide:

Pangloss used now and then to say to Candide, “There is a concatenation of all events in the best of possible worlds; for, in short, had you not been kicked out of a fine castle for the love of Miss Cunegund; had you not been put into the Inquisition; had you not travelled over America on foot; had you not run the baron through the body; and had you not lost all your sheep, which you brought from the good country of El Dorado, you would not have been here to eat preserved citrons and pistachio nuts.” “Excellently observed,” answered Candide; “but let us take care of our garden.”

From me: "Dogma is a bitch."

Dear davidf,

You ask; “As far as Singer is concerned did it make any difference?”

With the greatest respect that is not the question to be asking. What you delivered showed us the man for what he really was. You tore his armour asunder and made it easier for the rest of us who take exception to his propaganda. Although my replies to his articles are spit-balls in comparison it certainly inspired me to take it up to him more forcefully.

I feel where possible a man like Mr Singer does need to be answered on every occasion as it is easy for others to assume silence means acceptance.

Another thread has inspired some Ogden.

This is for Mr Singer;

““The door of a bigoted mind opens outwards so that the only result of the pressure of facts upon it is to close it more snugly.”

And this is for you;

“A jolly young fellow from Yuma
Told an elephant joke to a puma;
now his skeleton lies
beneath hot western skies-
the puma had no sense of huma”

Seasons greetings.