Not sure of your point, chrisdbarry.

>>Please don't deign to take it upon yourself to speak on behalf of a community that doesn't exist<<

I have never suggested that I speak for anyone else except myself, and certainly not that I in any way speak on behalf of other atheists. These folk do just that, which is what hacks me off.

Pericles, you say that the people that attended the conference were not representative of atheism, whilst also contending that atheism has no community. You're right on the latter claim and confused on the former.

You seem to make assumptions about the people at the conference without any knowledge about them. You are misinformed if you conclude that the event was attended by people who "choose to define their atheism by taking juvenile potshots at religion in general, and targeting Islam in particular". I was there - here's what I experienced. People from all walks of life and many backgrounds. People in their teens and people in their 80s. Men and women. People from many cultures and countries.

I can also only guess you don't know what the topics of discussion were. The topics were broad and diverse. Science, society, philosophy, personal... The approach was diverse. Serious, lighthearted, humorous, somber...

Some of the attendees may define their atheism as you claim, but your blanket statement cannot be made to define either the attendees or the conference.

If you wish to make a statement about your position, great, but don't claim you speak for "real atheists". As you note, there's no such thing.

Jeez, chrisdbarry, how many more times do I need to say it?

>>If you wish to make a statement about your position, great, but don't claim you speak for "real atheists"<<

Read my lips.

>>I have never suggested that I speak for anyone else except myself, and certainly not that I in any way speak on behalf of other atheists. These folk do just that, which is what hacks me off.<<

It would have been more honest if the conference had been titled "New Atheists Convention". So when my Christian friends ask, why such animosity, why such derision, why such ridicule passed off as "humour", I can explain that it is just a new sect, made up of a bunch of self-righteous activists.

>>It would have been more honest if the conference had been titled "New Atheists Convention". So when my Christian friends ask, why such animosity, why such derision, why such ridicule passed off as "humour", I can explain that it is just a new sect, made up of a bunch of self-righteous activists.<<

Just what atheists need to prove that they are more rational, mature etc. than the theists: a few good old fashioned schisms.

It starts with people like Pericles arbitrarily categorising atheists as New Atheists or proper atheists depending on whether he agrees with their opinions: it ends with all out war with bloodthirsty sea otters.

Cheers,

Tony

Pericles, you were obviously not in attendance and again mis-characterise an event you didn't attend and draw a false conclusion. This is called a strawman.

I will repeat that the topics of discussion and the people in attendance were diverse. Whilst activism was certainly discussed, so was philosophy, society, physics...

You should read up on the history of atheism - the so called "new atheists" are by no means the first to suggest that privilege of religion is questionable only to be met with shock at the mere suggestion.

If you cannot defend your own position in a way that makes your Christian friends feel comfortable, perhaps you should address your own situation rather than make false claims about something you know little about.

Poirot and WmTrevor,

I must apologize for my response on 19 April regarding the speed of light and space-time. I guess I have been looking for something simple, something my tiny brain could get to terms with. No such luck, no simple answers. It is a puzzlement, and reading about Prof. Brian Greene, WMAP, Cosmic Background Radiation and string theory leaves me looking at the ground and just being thankful I'm here at all.

Thank you for your input and your kind forbearance. I am going to crawl back into my hole, look up at the stars in wonder, and meditate on just how small and insignificant I really am. (Whilst also continuing to marvel at the wealth of knowledge some have accumulated, and at their spectacular mental prowess.)

I guess it was always a stupid idea of mine that maybe, just maybe, the odd behaviour of light might somehow indicate the possibility of 'outside' intervention, or at least a magical 'design' feature defying randomness. I shall continue to hold life and the universe in awe, but will try to avoid looking for any more 'fairies' in the 'garden'. (Lest I may actually spot one.)

With religion playing a part in so much turmoil in the world, past and present, there is little hope of any new 'messiah' being taken seriously, no matter how enlightened, and it becomes increasingly questionable when, if ever, humankind will attain true humility.