Yabby, what you and I have described is not discrimination. As long Catholics are prepared to hire non-Catholics who support their ethos and you are prepared to hire non-humanists who support your ethos, there is no discrimination. I don’t need to be Jewish to be willing to forego eating bacon at the staff caf, and if a Jewish organization hires me on the basis that I support their ethos, that’s fine; but if they say they won’t hire me because I’m Catholic even though I’ve said I’m willing to work within a Jewish ethos, then that is discrimination.

I find you incoherent on the matter on contraception. Papal infallibility has nothing to do with the matter, and church teaching is not dependent on the number of people who obey or disobey it. The Church is composed of sinners; nothing new there.

GlenC, you may find the perspective of this Catholic woman blogger interesting: http://awomansplaceis.blogspot.com.au/2012/02/but-everybodys-doing-it.html. I would add that there are plenty of women who haven’t always been Catholic or who were never really taught properly about contraception – I can assure you that I’ve never heard a priest mention it! This is a problem that the Church must address, but it doesn’t mean men in robes have been deciding what laywomen should do. Quite the opposite, the problem is that they haven’t been telling them what to do. And the priests you mention cannot step aside and let the women decide. This is a matter of church teaching, set in stone. Nothing they say or do can change that. Not even the Pope has the power to change that. The Catholic Church is not a democracy. My personal observations are that most practicing Catholic women of childbearing age do not use artificial contraception, proven by the fact that they tend to have a baby every two years or so in their most fertile years.

Yuyutsu, thank-you for your sensible observations.

*I find you incoherent on the matter on contraception. Papal infallibility has nothing to do with the matter*

Mishka, lets get real here. If I'm roughly correct, less then 3%
of the Australian population even bother to attend a Catholic church
each week. Going by the stats, most of those largely ignore Catholic
teachings on family planning. So what the church preaches on the
matter is largely irrelevant. Sadly the church still has quite some
political influence and as we saw with Harradine, one Catholic
managed to force his viewpoint on a Govt via bargaining over Telstra.

Things were not at all clear, before Paul 6 issued the Humanea Vitae.
Many in Rome were pushing for the pill to be accepted. The church
has paid a heavy price ever since, with Catholics in most parts of
the world, leaving in droves and others simply ignoring church dogma
on family planning. But alas they are locked in a corner, for no
pope can now go against the dogma with any credibility. Take a look
at the growth churches in places like South America. Its Pentacotals
and similar, whilst Catholic bums on seats continue to decline.
People will clearly get to heaven, even if they use contraception!

Meantime in places like the Phillipines, the poorest of the poor pay
a heavy price. Women who have popped out 7 and 8 kids, plead to
have a tubal litigation, but of course the Catholics control the
hospitals, so there is not much chance of that. Sadly that
Vatican dogma is responsible for an awful lot of suffering on our
planet. Shame on them, that is hardly compassion.

>>This is a matter of church teaching, set in stone. Nothing they say or do can change that. Not even the Pope has the power to change that. <<

Fail. The Pope is infallible when speaking ex cathedra on doctrine concerning faith or morals. He most definitely has the power to change the Church's teaching on contraception: he just chooses not to exercise it. I'll leave the wisdom of that decision for others to debate.

>>The Catholic Church is not a democracy.<<

You're right that the Church is not a democracy: it is, essentially, a benevolent dictatorship run by the Pope. The only man in the Church who is elected is the Pope himself: all the Bishops are there by his predecessor's appointment.

Cheers,

Tony

Tony, you clearly do not understand infallibility. You are correct that the Pope's teaching is infallible when speaking ex cathedra. That does not, however, enable him to teach heresy. Contraception is contrary to the Magisterium, and this article (which has a Nihil Obstat) explains the situation. I quote: "The Church has always maintained the historic Christian teaching that deliberate acts of contraception are always gravely sinful, which means that it is mortally sinful if done with full knowledge and deliberate consent (CCC 1857). This teaching cannot be changed and has been taught by the Church infallibly." http://www.catholic.com/tracts/birth-control

Yabby, this is old ground. We've had these discussions before. I'm not going to repeat myself. Low church numbers, while unfortunate, have no bearing on this issue. I refer you to the link I just gave Tony. Things were VERY CLEAR prior to HV. Contraception has always been against church teaching, and you will see evidence of this cited from as early as 195AD. You might also note that Protestant churches also condemned contraception up until the Lambeth Conference. You also are very out of touch with the Church. The younger generation don't have a problem with the Church's teaching on birth control, and I think WYD attendances in the millions suggest you are wrong, including 4 million attending in the Philippines. There are dying parishes but there are also thriving ones, and now that the USA suddenly has a full complement of bishops united as one we're finally seeing some leadership. You seem to think you know so much about the Church, but my guess is you don't go to Mass and haven't done so in a long time.

*but my guess is you don't go to Mass and haven't done so in a long time.*

Lol Mishka, I saw through the attempts at brainwashing when I was
about 8! If it were up to me, the pope would be charged with
environmental degradation and taken before the courts for denial
of peoples human rights.

Fact is that the whole Catholic contraception thinggy is built
upon the old testament story of Onan and the wasted sperms.
Now either the old testament is true or its not true. If its true,
then I should kill my neighbour for working on the Sabbath. I refuse
to do that, I like my neighbour.

Now if wasting sperms is a mortal sin, then I don't think too many
male catholics are ever going to make it to heaven.

How people believe this stuff just blows me away. But fair enough,
they have a right to believe whatever they want. My problem is
when they try to enforce their dogma on the rest of us, by use
of the political system. Keep Catholic dogma for complying catholics
and leave the rest of us out of it.

As to the history of the Catholic Church, read "The Sex lives of the
Popes." It makes for entertaining reading.