Whether you or me or anyone else thinks abortion right, wrong, or somewhere in between, whether we think a foetus is a baby or an embryo, a joy or a nuisance, is not the bloody point.
Each of us will think differently, and each of us will make our own choices based on our own beliefs. We will then live with the consequences.
Banning abortion, like banning drugs won't stop it. It will simply make some self righteous people feel even more self righteous.
I have had two children and, years previously, an abortion. If I'd had the first child, I wouldn't have had the second two. Either way potential lives would have been lost. Do I regret my decisions? Not one of them. Do you have the right to hate me, disapprove of me, argue with me? Of course you do. Do you have the right to arrest me or force me to behave differently according to your personal beliefs? Fortunately, you do not.
Please God it stays that way.

Yes enaj, some self-righteous people will feel more self-righteous if abortion is prohibited. Also, if it is not prohibited, some OTHER self-righteous people will feel more self-righteous anyway.
It IS relevant whether or not we are talking about human lives because there are 75000 being killed annually in Australia alone. If abortion were to be prohibited- apart from having a number of people feeling feeling more self-righteous than they are today- this number, 75000, will plummet- I doubt, to zero, as you have said, "it will not stop it", but the closer to zero and the further away from 75000... use your brain.

Well I wasn't presented with what's wrong with my argument or a thorough counter-argument, but here is a small response anyway:

Responsibility is to take the care of the situation. Situation resolved => responsibility met.

Burden if other person does want child:
Man:
-cost of abortion.

Woman:
-forced to remain pregnant
-restrictions on diet
-restrictions on freedom of movement
-hormonal changes and corresponding emotional disturbance
-permanent marks & alterations to her body
-social embarrassment & psychological damage resulting from being forced
-greater risk of post-partum depression and suicide.

What wonderful balance of treatment you've come up with.

"If you still disagree lets move on I'd like to discuss non-vaginal sex and adoption."
No I said I'm only going to post on pro-choice v anti-abortion.

'because there are 75000 being killed annually in Australia alone'

Is it that hard to not used biased words and say 'pregnancies being terminated'? You make it sound like a slaughter. If you disagree with it, then cool, don't do it. But understand that many people, quite reasonably, don't consider a foetus to be a human being. You may disagree, but since you are not supreme overlord of the universe, you can't tell them who's right and who's wrong, and therefore can't stop them! K?

Oops, I hope Jose isn't supreme overlord of the universe. Boy would my face be red!

Neohuman - The mind boggles at the thought of live baby exports. Most Australians are not happy about live sheep exports but this is a totally unacceptable.

Neohuman asked . . .
“BTW could you state whether you in principle could give up vaginal intercourse to avoid unwanted pregnancies and abortions?”
Nah! hmmm, sounds kinky . . .

Ah! Demographics is a very inexact science. The Australian demographer in the 1950’s mispredicted the Australian population size because he failed to take into account the aging population.
If Australia wants to increase its population then it has to foster family friendly policies [My goodness I sound like a Steve Fielding supporter]. Young people are usually 30 before they move from their cocktail of part time casual jobs into permanent employment when they can pay off their HECS debt look for a life partner, leave mum and dad get a mortgage and settle down. Maybe when the baby boomers leave the workforce this will free up permanent positions.

Its better to encourage the desired behavior rather than legislate unenforceale prohibitions.

Is it that hard to not used biased words and say 'pregnancies being terminated'?

Spendocrat Don’t know about you but when a fetus is sawed up or has a hole drilled in its skull 'pregnancies being terminated' just doesn’t cut it either.

Sand between my toes. The mind boggles at the thought of live baby exports. Most Australians are not happy about live sheep exports but this is a totally unacceptable.

The mind boggles how the current international adoption practices sorry ‘trade of babies’ and children get away with such a disgraceful practice of making childless couples and orphaned or unwanted children happy. Totally unacceptable!

>Nah! hmmm, sounds kinky . . .
So you are a prude anything other than vaginal sex is kinky I wonder have you tried the other kinky positions other than missionary?

>Ah! Demographics is a very inexact science.

Yes planning now for an aging population is just a waste of time the developed worlds demographers and governments are concerned about nothing, great to be able to dismiss those qualified in their fields so easily without anything else other than they got it wrong in the past. Just the sort of reasoning used by creationists.

>Its better to encourage the desired behavior rather than legislate unenforceale prohibitions.

So then don’t have vaginal sex : )
BTW Murder and rape are unenforceable therefore we shouldn’t try.

Duec We seem to be on different wavelengths but if I understood you correctly -

Basically her body her choice, it happens to her alone so no obligation to anyone else. She suffers the mental physical burden whereas a man doesn’t so there is no equivalency or appropriate compensation and there is no obligation or responsibility anyway just a situation to be fixed, which with abortion is fixed?

How’s that?

Could I see you summarize mine? Cheers no hard feelings.

BTW when discussing pro-life vs pro-choice sex and adoption are relevant as they are proposed solutions. If you exclude such sub arguments there is no debate