...The violent abuse of their women by Aboriginal men, comes from 60,000 years of training.

That is part of their culture, as in moslem culture to, it is ok to punish your wife.

It is instructive that Mr Pyke discussed an example involving Aborigines. Aboriginal people are at least 6 times more likely to report having been involved some form of domestic violence that non-aboriginals.

Essentially, domestic violence is a problem of poor socio-economoc conditions that the White Ribbon People try to pretend is a general problem across society. the "ambassadors", like Mr Pyke, are little more than self-promoters.

How does Mr Pyke feel about Senator Mason's recent comments, during the very curtailed "debate" over the Family Violence Bill (which makes it perfectly legal for women to tell lies to the Court), in which the good Senator said:

"There is absolutely no excuse for domestic violence or sexual abuse of any kind against women, or children, or in some instances, against men."

Does anybody have any ideas about what sort of domestic violence or sexual abuse is excusable when directed against men? I'm afraid I've not been able to think of anything at all, but that's probably due to my misogyny or something. It couldn't possibly be because there aren't any - could it?

As long as this disgraceful piece of exhibitionism called White Ribbon Day continues, I will never, ever be prepared to put my name to anything they promote. What a bunch of tossers.

and white australian males who make up most of the offenders in Australia. It really is shocking that men want to point the finger at others in postings like those above when violence against women is so deeply embedded in our white culture. It is a shame that the author ensures that we know that this is an aboriginal family. There is much domestic violence in aborginal communities but focusing on one group allows posters like those above to make the problem about others.

perigren, the problem IS about others. I have never hit a woman - not once. I have been hit by women many times. I have had things thrown at me. I have been locked out of my home in the middle of the night, wearing nothing but pyjamas. I have been abused verbally for hours on end. I have been subkected to court case after court case on the same matters, all funded by women's Legal Aid on the pretence that there was "violence", until finally a magistrate told her to "grow up" and "move on". I've had my children withheld from me, on the false accusation of "violence". I've listened over and over to the "conga-line of suckholes" who infest the domestic violence industry telling me that if I protest against this treatment it means I'm all the more violent, since under their definitions it's ALWAYS the man - facts are irrelevant.

Until the enablers of such behaviour like yourself acknowledge that this is a multi-faceted issue that affects mainly those in poor socio-economic conditions and is equally the province of both genders I will continue to do all that I can to ensure you are shown for what you are: misandrists with an agenda that has nothing to do with preventing violence of any kind and everything to do with getting your name in the paper in a story designed to appeal to women.

...Sorry Perigen, you are out of step:

1. 1.500, between ’98 and 2005, admissions to Alice Springs hospital with stab wounds.
2. Alice Springs has the highest incidence of stabbings in the world.
3. 4.8% Aboriginal children under 17yo are under “care and protection” orders. (0.5% for the remainder of the population).
4. 80% of jaw fractures in NT are alcohol related events. NT Aboriginals have second highest incidence of jaw fractures in the world.
5. 45 times above the national average, Aboriginal women in rural and remote areas of Australia, experience domestic violence.

...“The true prevalence of Aboriginal family violence is unknown. What is known is that the violence is endemic and presents an extremely troubling picture of the situation in many Aboriginal communities”. —Conclusion of the Gordon Inquiry Report on family violence. (WA inquiry into DV in Aboriginal communities 2001).

...IMO The author is correct to highlight an Aboriginal incidence of DV in this article

antiseptic, you seem to have a terrible experience but that doesn't change the wider facts. I have no doubt that the author would not support violence against a person of any gender or age. Sadly some men who speak very loudly choose to try to undermine efforts to stop violence against women and use this campaign to make men the victims. Men are victims of violence but most violence against men is happening in the streets and is inflicted by other men and I don't hear men talking about that. Anyone who finds violence abhorent should be supporting any campaign to stamp out violence, be it against women, men or children. I do feel sorry for you that you have had such a terrible time but all the men standing up today to call for an end to violence against women are not colluding in some sort of conspiracy against their own sex. Lobby for change but don't support a shameful part of australian culture.

"but all the men standing up today to call for an end to violence against women are not colluding in some sort of conspiracy against their own sex"

That's a matter of opinion. Most may not know that they are doing so but it does not alter the dynamics of the way that the genderised portrayal of violence is used and abused by gender warriors.

ChazP summed the approach taken by those pushing the genderised DV line pretty well at one point "The selective use/misuse of information is part and parcel of any debate." http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=12255#212833

That was in response to attempts to use a claim about children witnessing violence against their mother and a subsequent suggestion that it would "be rather like searching for squid on Uluhru" to find the relevant figures on children witnessing violence against their fathers (the figure was in the same paragraph of the original report as the figure quoted by ChazP in the first place.

There is a very clear determination by some to misrepresent the issue to give women greater power in family law situations and overall as part of a militant feminist agenda.

The White Ribbon mob reversed the outcomes of one study regarding acceptance of violence in one recent publicity splurge and when caught out on it the retraction was very muted. There is a deliberate attempt from some quarters to claim violence is primarily a gender issue rather than an issue tied far more strongly to other indicators.

Perpetuating those lies leaves people exposed to violence that could be avoided.

R0bert

Peter,

Seems like there is hope yet !

Many Thanks for sharing this story.

Arthur Bell ( aka bully )

militant feminist, Tell me where they are and i will give em a wide birth. I have never seen one or heard of any. Family violence is for real and increasing, road rage in the house. The police say 99 % of family violence comes from men. That 1% of men that get abused need, how to be a man counseling.

A man who hits a woman is no man at all...

These articles never talk about women's responsibilites. My brother's neighbour put his hand through a wall when arguing with his wife. Would that be an indication to any reasonable minded person that he was at his wits end and that it would be a good idea to just stop before things got worse? Or are women not responsible for their actions?

Would anyone feel sorry for me if I, as another man, kept pushing a man who was obviously at his limit and then got beat up?

I'm not excusing men who hit women but I'm also not excusing women. For those of us who live in the real world we know women are not perfect either: women cheat, lie, drink, take drugs, spend money and gamble just like men. There are also plenty of women who do violence well too (especially Aboriginal women). I have even heard of women cheating on their partners!! (I know, it seems hard to believe but it is true)

That's why these constant stories about DV get tiresome - they always take women to be these angelic little creatures who never put a foot wrong while big bad men beat them up.

In the story, the cowering in the corner with the smoking cop just seems a bit over dramatic for me too. I'm not doubting women get hit but it seems like years of DV industry advertising (brainwashing) might have influenced the authors reconstruction of events all those years ago.

The DV instustry has just become another way for women to exercie power and control over men.

where did white ribbon day come from? I have had several beaten woman on my door step escaping violent men. In all cases they had been beaten before and went back to their drunken 'man'. The kids of these families would of been taken away long ago if white. They will no doubt follow in their fathers and mothers footsteps. I have found that their is such a hatred for authority among those involved in this barbaric behaviour that as soon as things settle it is the Police who become the enemies until the next call. A little leadership from the cultural leaders might help although that might be considered doing things white men's way. Tragic for those involved and neighbours who have found the Police are very slow in coming because they are sick of the 'game '.

579 "The police say 99 % of family violence comes from men."

Care to back that with a credible reference.

Over a long period when both genders have been asked similar questions about violence in the home the results show that men and women initiate violence in the home at similar rates. Women get hurt more at the extreme end of the scale (that's the strength factor cutting in).

In 40% or more of relationships where there is violence it's mutual without a clear distinction between perpetrator and victim.

You start with http://www.fact.on.ca/Info/dom/heady99.htm (Australian example)

or https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/170018.pdf (NZ research)

or a range of material at
http://www.mediaradar.org/

Now find me some serious work that examines violence against both genders in a domestic situation that's not starting with the premise that it's only DV when men do it which also back's up the 99% claim?

R0bert

perigren:"I have no doubt that the author would not support violence against a person of any gender or age"

As I would certainly hope to be the case. However, the article is specifically about violence directed at women within the Aboriginal community and the attitudes of police to that violence until it extrapolates to the general case and the plot is hopelessly lost.

You've divined my point however, which is that violence is done by people to people. Whether the person on either end of the transaction is male or female matters not a jot except insofar as it can be used as a gender-political tool.

perigren:"most violence against men is happening in the streets and is inflicted by other men and I don't hear men talking about that"

And just as in the case of domestic violence, that street violence is strongly correlated with substance abuse and poverty, as well as the inevitable fights over and at the behest of women. "Let's you and him fight" is an old game. Generally, even in those circumstances men don't hit women: they hit other men, or walls...

However, you're wrong that it isn't talked about. Early closing has just been introduced to address the issue of street violence fuelled by alcohol consumption. There are cameras everywhere there are drinkers or revellers of any kind, monitoring behaviour so a quick response may occur to any incidents.

By using a targetted approach resources can be properly directed with the least inconvenience to those doing the right thing. I'm afraid that in DV matters that means focussing on the Aboriginal community, lower-tier socio-economic groupings generally and substance abusers more specifically. Gender is far less important than any of those factors, other than as an indicator of likely outcomes once violence has been initiated. Men hit harder, but women often hit first and they hit far more frequently, as well as being much more likely to be verbally abusive.

These are realities, which the WRD campaign simply ignores. It has no credibility.

I was both moved and anxious when reading this article.

Moved because I am pleased with how a young police officer went back in and helped the mum and children, and anxious because it reminded me of many, many instances of domestic violence I was called to clean up after.

Dane, this author was a policeman, and as such would know more about domestic violence than all the other posters here put together I would imagine.

Medical staff know the disgusting business of domestic violence too, and I am pleased to see an article dealing with Aboriginal people and how they have the most obvious problems with domestic violence in our community.

As a younger nurse, I was involved in Aboriginal health, and I remember going to an Aboriginal community at the hospital's request to attend to wounds on a woman's knuckles on both hands.

Her loving husband had bent all the fingers back and broken the fingers, and she had wires inserted in them. He had no obvious injuries.

The finger wounds were all oozing pus around the wires when I arrived, so I told her she needed to go back to the hospital for treatment.
Her husband refused to 'let the b##ch out of my sight', so I had to agree to take him to the hospital with us in the car.

I dared to ask why they had fought.
The answer: "The fat cow won't get pregnant, so what use is she?"

And that is just one clear recollection of way too many domestic violence situations to discuss here.

It would seem clear that the main driving force here is poverty, but not *just* being short of money.
The situations described relate to aboriginals, not just poor in our economic system, desperately poor in western cultural capital. There are "white" and "immigrant" people who are also so lacking and similar instances of viciousness and violent.

The violence would appear not to have developed as a first option, but been descended to by means of these people feeling they have no other option to influence their lives. Suseonline describes the "fat cow" that "won't get pregnant". Why was this so important? is having children the *only way* to increase household welfare income?

The questions may not revolve around telling people not to be violent but to look at the dismissive manner "welfare" is concieved and delivered. The trap becomes so deep that the perversion of making kids merely to get more becomes normalised, as does beating the barren cow.

How can we *really* help rather than just saying "don't thrash, just sit quietly in the shite".

Rusty

One thing about DV that is not talked about often, is the violence to men, by women.
I do not condone violence of any kind, but 'two way' DV is not always talked about, mainly because most abused males will not talk about it.
No matter what, regarding "equality of the sexes", women are complex critters, whereby the males, are more simple regarding their domestic needs and wants. A man will want to come home after a day's work, play with the kids for a while, have dinner, and relax with his wife. But when marital separation/divorce rears its' ugly head, the male is the loser every time, in my view at least. He pays for the kids upkeep, the mortgage etc. etc. has not got a hope in hell of ever finding another partner, because he cannot afford to keep her and another woman and kids.
His frustration runs deeply, often not even knowing why the marriage ends abruptly.What hope has he got of getting another house and starting over again?
Observing Aboriginies in Kalgoorlie for many years, alcohol is the major problem of abuse, and trust me, the women can be as (if not more) violent than the males. The behavior trickles down as learned behavior after witnessing violent brawls between adults. Violence is a way of life for some of them. Consumption of alcohol is a big driver, and the violence commited by youth has trickled down by this situation. The problems are almost unsolvable, someone or something has to be done about it before future generations think that abuse is the norm.
NSB

NSB:

...# The problems are almost unsolvable, someone or something has to be done about it before future generations think that abuse is the norm. # ...Abuse is the norm!

...With community attitudes so compliant towards acceptance of drinking, the hard options are the only alternative. NT is in the process of constructing a brand new, state of the art prison. The new prison will be constructed at a cost of $500million; that is, half a billion dollars! This then flags the unavoidable Government approach to the social cost of alcohol, and associated crime such as DV.

...When 80% of the prison population in Darwin are Aboriginal, then one could safely say, the new prison will be a forced drying-out venue for alcoholics from the Aboriginal population in the NT.
When also, alcohol abuse in the broader Australian community is seen as a “right”, with binge drinking a Saturday night imperative, IMO prisons remains the most effective answer to the problem of crime associated with alcohol. Prisons serve as the most effective weapon against alcohol induced crime and violence, by removing the offender from a society he/she little respects, giving him/her time to reflect on personal behavioural issues and their consequences.

...A huge tax on alcohol is a simple means to a complicated end, for Governments to use if they genuinely wish to improve safety in the home, and reduce DV. Simply tax alcohol out of existence