Loudmouth

Very interesting posts. Like Kartiya Jim, the best we can do is make a recognition in a very general sense - that in and of itself is acknowledgement of how much history and culture has been lost.

I would like more acknowledgement for people who come here from anywhere - the contribution made by people who have had to flee their home countries and now make substantive contributions to this country. Maybe something could be worked on on very formal occasions, such as change of government, when a new regime is sworn in. Would also make a difference to Australia Day ceremonies - maybe there is a way to make 26th January significant for indigenous folk rather than invasion, maybe there were celebrations among tribes at around that time of year. Take the date back. Christians have been co-opting significant dates for centuries, be a satisfactory reversal.

As for my moniker, an ammonite is an fossilised marine creature, in the shape of a spiral, therefore it is ancient and beautiful, or just an old fossil depending on your point of view. I hadn't made the connection to Ammon, but my great grandmother was Jewish, so double bonus.

Good with natural science, not so well read on anthropology.

[contd.]

So 'country' was quite specific, specifically owned by specific groups or extended families. They would have had little interest or claim on others' lands. So welcome to country could really be quite focussed.

On the other hand, people down this way (Adelaide) treat all of the land owned by all of the groups within a language group - the Kaurna, for example, whose country encompassed Adelaide - as if all Kaurna people had an undifferentiated claim on all Kaurna land, from Clare in the north down to Cape Jervis. I would seriously question that those areas were Kaurna, that Kaurna country ever extended that far, but there you are.

And perhaps characteristically, 'Kaurna' is a Ngarrindjeri word, meaning 'men': 'korni' meaning 'man', plural 'kornar'. The word was first recorded in about 1914, so it may be a bit unreliable.

So I've been puzzled for a long time about huge groups in very good country in NSW, like the Kamilaroi and Wiradjuri, whose country extended for hundreds of thousands of sq. km. Surely, they must be confederations of dialect groups, each with perhaps hundreds of clans ? The clan, for example, that was the land-holding group around, say, Dubbo (Kamilaroi country ?) would have controlled a very specific stretch of country - its family members would not have necessarily had any ownership, or rights, in other people's country, say around Warren or Nyngan. 'Country' was specific, not general.

But the beauty of it is that there are far more records around that people think: people can track back their ancestry in many, if not most, cases, if they know where to look. Missionaries' journals are goldmines of information, and at least down this way, the missionary had to keep records of births, deaths, marriages and other records, over long periods of time. Ration stations had to keep accurate records, and those records would very likely show up who consistently came to certain places every month for rations, i.e. on their own country. Stationrecords, policerecords, hospitalrecords - there's a hugeamount of informationaround. It just needs a bit of detective work :)

Note to self, wait before posting.

:D at you Loudmouth.

Enc.some great examples from the Ouyen District Football League Resultsin 1946 that brought in local site names.
This Mallee area in Western Victoria still has some amazing places and unique Australian Native Footy Club names that carry a native identy - it seems that the both Explorers and Surveyors liked the way they rolled off both black and white tongues .
Should be more of it !
Just a few from the area :
- Kiamal (4th),
- Ouyen (premiers),
- Patchewollock,
- Tempy (3rd),
- Tiega
- Walpeup.
Gorya,

The Link , http://footypedia.isgreat.org/00001276.htm Cheers, jim .

So Australia was "Invaded"

That was 200 years ago....

Pilger, I suggest you get over it.

Australia today is Australia today, the "invaders", like the Romans, Saxons, Angles and Normans did in the UK

they settled this land and have farmed this land and have done so for the past 200+ years.

and in so doing have justified their "invasion" of this land

so like I said before, get over it... crying in your beer over past invasions seems to be the product of some Celtic gene, the Irish go on about the same sort of irrelevance.

Obviously they have too few real problems in their lives to worry about.

One thing... if it had not been the British who "invaded" Australia, the outcome for the "defenders" might have been alot more brutal and lethal that there would be no one left to complain about it.

Fair go Col ,
The masses were politically powerless then - not so now, even for those pesky upstart Natives .
Invasion Title is slowly becoming irrelevant Col and about time too .
Beware the haunting click of the boomerangs - at last they are getting louder .